Unfollowing Hunting Social Media Will Make Hunting Better: Matt Rinella Essay

[Arctic Hunter]

A better analogy would be comparing mountain bike trails to a public archery range. Might be crowded, but the targets aren’t going anywhere.

I’m still not convinced severely limiting or eliminating NR tags wouldn’t solve some of the crowding issue.

 

[murphyjm29]

A better analogy would be comparing mountain bike trails to a public archery range. Might be crowded, but the targets aren’t going anywhere.

I’m still not convinced severely limiting or eliminating NR tags wouldn’t solve some of the crowding issue.

It would solve the crowding issue, but would create a huge revenue issue.


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[Arctic Hunter]

I could see some revenue lost. It would take about a 250% increase in resident tags cost in my state alone to make up for the money lost in NR license sales alone (according to the stats I looked at the other day).

But then, our tags are significantly cheaper than the Wyoming special draw. They could limit the numbers of NR tags and charge everybody more to keep that income even. I’d gladly pay it.

Other than increasing access (cross your fingers on the whole corner crossing thing), reducing numbers is the only way I see to do it.

But I’ll go either way, and figure something out.

 

[cnelk]

It's scary to think about how many people in the hunting community, the same people who are hopefully(not) part of organizations that lobby for hunting rights think the answer is to reduce hunters and discourage new hunters from getting started.
I'm coming for your spots, and bringing all my kids and friends with me.
See you at the trail head, ill be the guy with the out of state plates

Do us all a favor and be sure to know how to bugle. lol

 

[Muledeerhunter406]

It would solve the crowding issue, but would create a huge revenue issue.


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Not necessarily for MT any ways all they would have to do is charge us roughly 2.5x what we pay for Tags now and it would offset the "lost" revenue and that would be 17000 less people in the hills which I'd gladly pay that

 

[Elkangle]

Not necessarily for MT any ways all they would have to do is charge us roughly 2.5x what we pay for Tags now and it would offset the "lost" revenue and that would be 17000 less people in the hills which I'd gladly pay that

Why not just triple it now and price people out as it is... we don't want to recruit new younger less financially stable kids so why not just turn up the heat and price out the poor people


This is such a good path

 

[Idaho_Potato]

It would solve the crowding issue, but would create a huge revenue issue.


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Just did some quick math for Idaho. Best I can tell, non-residents get somewhere around 20,000 tags between general and controlled hunts. Non-res license and an elk tag comes to $835. Total generated from non-res elk is $16.7 million. Divide that across the rest of the resident elk hunters - somewhere around 100,000 based on last 10 years of data. Each resident hunter needs to pay $167 + $37 = $204. "Huge" revenue issue solved.

Done. Sign me up.

 

[murphyjm29]

Just did some quick math for Idaho. Best I can tell, non-residents get somewhere around 20,000 tags between general and controlled hunts. Non-res license and an elk tag comes to $835. Total generated from non-res elk is $16.7 million. Divide that across the rest of the resident elk hunters - somewhere around 100,000 based on last 10 years of data. Each resident hunter needs to pay $167 + $37 = $204. "Huge" revenue issue solved.

Done. Sign me up.

For the tag fee that’s not huge, but you are not taking into account all the dollars spent in you state by non residents. Hotels, fuel, food, outfitters, etc.

Also you have to get 100,000 residents on board with the increase. Indiana just announced they are raising tag prices $6 for the first time in 17 years. People are losing their minds, claiming unfair taxation. You’ll never make everyone happy.


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[OMB]

A better analogy would be comparing mountain bike trails to a public archery range. Might be crowded, but the targets aren’t going anywhere.

I’m still not convinced severely limiting or eliminating NR tags wouldn’t solve some of the crowding issue.

Again- NR numbers in the west outside of Arizona OTC archery deer and Colorado OTC elk have been the same small slice of the pie for 10+ years. Continue to shrink that number below 10% or eliminate NR hunting and the 45 other states are going to have conversations about hunting on BLM/Forest Service land that I don't think will beneficial to anyone. Ignore all the new sub-divisions going up in Idaho/Montana/Utah at your own peril.

 

[Blackcow]

https://scholarship.law.marquette.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1055&context=mulr

A long read, and there’s a newer one than 2006 that I couldn’t find nor did I particularly look on Christmas morning. He Feds are going to miraculously swoop in and make sure I can go hunt another state with anything near the same privileges as a resident of that state, west or east, even on federal lands.

 

[realunlucky]

This thread has unleashed the selfishness of hunters.
One side wants to profit from the resource, the other side wants to deny others the same resource they enjoy.

I can't say I fully agree with either argument.

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[Mattrinella]

That’s not my stance at all. I favor disincentivizing hunting for money and fame by making the posting of dead game to strangers taboo. Also, I oppose efforts to influence people to hunt in order to sell them products. Considerations of profit should play no role in inspiring people to hunt. I’m fine living with whatever crowding remains after we strip away the untraditional incentives.

 

[3forks]

This thread has unleashed the selfishness of hunters.
One side wants to profit from the resource, the other side wants to deny others the same resource they enjoy.

I can't say I fully agree with either argument.

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Some of us are looking for a compromise.

 

[realunlucky]

That’s not my stance at all. I favor disincentivizing hunting for money and fame by making the posting of dead game to strangers taboo. Also, I oppose efforts to influence people to hunt in order to sell them products. Considerations of profit should play no role in inspiring people to hunt. I’m fine living with whatever crowding remains after we strip away the untraditional incentives.

From reading this thread I'd say your message has been diluted (most likely from commenters that didn't actually read your article) and it's good for you to solidify your position.
Overcrowding is an issue that's far more complex than excluding new comers or non-residents.



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[3forks]

@Mattrinella - since you posted on Christmas Day, I have to ask about the ultimatum mentioned in the podcast…

Did you and Steve get together for the holiday, or are you guys still too far apart on the issue to break bread with each other?

 

[ODB]

That’s not my stance at all. I favor disincentivizing hunting for money and fame by making the posting of dead game to strangers taboo. Also, I oppose efforts to influence people to hunt in order to sell them products. Considerations of profit should play no role in inspiring people to hunt. I’m fine living with whatever crowding remains after we strip away the untraditional incentives.

There is the nuance that every hunting product manufacturer has an incentive to encourage people to hunt and a profit motive. Unless we are all making our own equipment, at some point we have to rely on for-profit companies to manufacture the goods we use - be they bows, binoculars or boots.

But I agree there is a line between explaining the benefits of a good pair of boots and a gluttony of dead animal pics showing that "...so-and-so-famous-hunter uses them to stack up the bodies or fill the freezer or top the record books...and so can you."

maybe i'll wear my DDD T-shirt my brother got me today - in solidarity with the cause...

(and for anyone wondering - there was no profit on the shirts)

 

[Mattrinella]

@Mattrinella - since you posted on Christmas Day, I have to ask about the ultimatum mentioned in the podcast…

Did you and Steve get together for the holiday, or are you guys still too far apart on the issue to break bread with each other?

I was joking about the ultimatum on the podcast. That said, Steve uninvited me for Christmas.

 

[ODB]

I was joking about the ultimatum on the podcast. That said, Steve uninvited me for Christmas.

Oof...

I used to think blood was thicker than water... that's a flat-out bummer to hear.

We'll have extra fondue tonight if you can make to boise in time...

 

[Lee_R]

I was joking about the ultimatum on the podcast. That said, Steve uninvited me for Christmas.

That's tough, I'm sorry to hear that and hope you guys patch things up soon.

 

[Idaho_Potato]

For the tag fee that’s not huge, but you are not taking into account all the dollars spent in you state by non residents. Hotels, fuel, food, outfitters, etc.

Not sure why that matters at all when talking about hunting. Wildlife should not be a source of income for corporations like exxon or Marriott hotels etc. Tourism is a waste of energy. Outfitters can get creative or find another business where their income is not reliant on hunting.