CPW Commission is proposing ALL DRAW for elk

[BarCO]

No there doesn’t. Be glad there are so many people that are just point collectors and never enter the draw. If they’re not in the draw, they have no influence on the creep.

The only thing that can reverse point creep is for supply to exceed demand. That ain’t happening.

if you require PP to be submitted regardless of the tag I think it will help. You should not be able to hunt elk and retain elk points.

 

[Jethro]

I’m in favor of all seasons draw for NR, but still only points for first choice. I think any first choice tags returned should cost points to whoever picks them up off the reissue list. Don’t think points should be used for 2nd or 3rd choices or true leftovers.

 

[Zeke6951]

As a NR archery hunter I would like to see all tags elk tags go draw. Too many NR don't think about hunting CO. elk until mid August so they just head to CO and stop a the first WalMart and buy a OTC tag. I started applying for tags roughly 20 years ago. I set my sights on 76, I think it took 6 or 7 then. I realized I would never accumulate enough points for one of the best tags. When I got to 9 points, 76 took 14. I burned 9 points on a 4 to 5 point unit (point banking would have been great). Had a fantastic hunt. I jumped right back in the game to maybe get 1 more hunt in the 4 to 5 point unit before I got too old. The 4 to 5 point unit is now 7 or 8. I have 6, at 72 yo I'm not sure I'll make it.

 

[Still Hunter]

As a NR archery hunter I would like to see all tags elk tags go draw. Too many NR don't think about hunting CO. elk until mid August so they just head to CO and stop a the first WalMart and buy a OTC tag. I started applying for tags roughly 20 years ago. I set my sights on 76, I think it took 6 or 7 then. I realized I would never accumulate enough points for one of the best tags. When I got to 9 points, 76 took 14. I burned 9 points on a 4 to 5 point unit (point banking would have been great). Had a fantastic hunt. I jumped right back in the game to maybe get 1 more hunt in the 4 to 5 point unit before I got too old. The 4 to 5 point unit is now 7 or 8. I have 6, at 72 yo I'm not sure I'll make it.

The whole point system really is age discriminatory. If an older hunter hits the "Western Hunting" scene late in life, he will never accumulate enough points to hunt a top GMU, like 76. I am older, spent a lot of time in 76 in the summers but will never live long enough to draw a tag in 76, that's unfortunate.

 

[Liv2HntBigBullz]

The answer is simple, DAU management. OTC with caps and a resident/nonresident allocation. Adjust pricing accordingly to account for the same revenue.

The points game, use prior BGSS draw minimums, if an applicant applies for a unit requiring 10+ points the tags are awarded basis a weighted point or bonus point system. Otherwise allocate as is. The NW corner is really funny to hunt, guys have waited a lifetime to hunt elk there and now it's only hunted by guys 60+ and most can't make it far from the road system. Going to be a crying shame when our youth population no longer cares because it'll be impossible to draw without some changes made.

I don't understand why this is so hard. Spent a lot of time trying to be an active sportsman but like most government agencies, "public input" is just a check box and not a place where solutions are sought. Regardless of what you do people will be pissed so grow a pair and rip the band aid.

 

[RyanT26]

The whole point system really is age discriminatory. If an older hunter hits the "Western Hunting" scene late in life, he will never accumulate enough points to hunt a top GMU, like 76. I am older, spent a lot of time in 76 in the summers but will never live long enough to draw a tag in 76, that's unfortunate.

Come on man, age discriminatory. Maybe for the younger people, there are units like 76 that my 13 old son will never catch up to the creep on.

 

[Still Hunter]

Come on man, age discriminatory. Maybe for the younger people, there are units like 76 that my 13 old son will never catch up to the creep on.

I won't disagree with you there either! LMAO! The younger hunters certainly have lots of challenges ahead that we older guys did not have to deal with.

 

[stonewall]

As a NR, I think go all draw for NR. Keep some sort of OTC for residents as long as possible. For NR, allocate 75% of tags to point holders, 25% to random draw.

 

[sndmn11]

I’m in favor of all seasons draw for NR, but still only points for first choice. I think any first choice tags returned should cost points to whoever picks them up off the reissue list. Don’t think points should be used for 2nd or 3rd choices or true leftovers.

I agree. If you win the reissue game, it should take whatever points you have for the species, or whatever points it required in the primary draw, whichever is lower.

 

[Str8shooter]

Colorado gives out upwards of 200-350% more licenses to non residents than the average western state. BHAs article points out "55% of the licenses have the potential to be allocated to non-resident hunters in certain units (20% landowner preference plus 35% non-resident allocation". This fact, plus lower knowledge barriers to entry (onx, gohunt) plus the steady stream of youtube/social media/hunting TV content of DIY OTC Colorado has served to crush the quality of experience for both residents and nonresidents in recent years. The experience is being fundamentally compromised. After spotting game, I now immediately make a concerted scan for hunters already on the stalk and its extremely common to see more than one person already making a move. Its not just nonresident allocations that need to be reduced. CO is soon to exceed 6 million people, something has to give. https://www.backcountryhunters.org/colorado_bha_tag_allocation_observations_information

 

[EJFS]

I don't hunt OTC units, so it has no bearing on me at all. But, a lot of you guys haven't mentioned a very important factor with NR tags...money.

	Res	Non-Res
Bull Elk License	$57.90	700.98
App Fee	$7.13	9.17
Habitat Stamp	$ 10.59	10.59
Cheapest Qualifying License (needed for draw units)	$31.41	86.50
	$96.44	$807.24

$711 more for every Non-res bull elk license into CPW's coffers. Even if a NR is unsuccessful, they're paying $106 just for a preference point. CO residents may not like it, but CPW's budget relies heavily on non-res apps and license sales.

Man, this argument is getting old, y'all are way over rating the need for OTC NR money. CPW is RAKING in money from OHV permits, fishing licenses, camping/access fees, fees from outfitters (hunting and otherwise) money from grants, money from the state, money from the feds, plus they'll still sell plenty of NR tags. LOL, they'll be FINE... Everyone will be better off without the flood of NR OTC hunters. Hope they don't chicken out on this.

 

[EJFS]

They should go every unit and season draw and require min 3 PP (regardless of residency to have a name in the hat just like sheep/moose/goat).

They should go 80/20 on residency tag break down and any tag left over should be available OTC but at NR price.

Well you win dumbest post of the thread....

 

[cuttingedge]

No OTC Archery tags... might be time to move

 

[5MilesBack]

You should not be able to hunt elk and retain elk points.

Says who?

 

[BarCO]

Says who?

Me

 

[Jimss]

1). Around 80% of the total elk units in Colo are OTC. Just think how many guys would burn rather than build points if all elk seasons and units were draw.

2). Require points to be burned by anyone that purchases landowner tags.

3). No pt banking. It leads to major pt leap in the mid tier units.

4). $ up front when applying! The CPW is aware that was a major mistake for pt creep.

 

[cnelk]

1). Around 80% of the total elk units in Colo are OTC. Just think how many guys would burn rather than build points if all elk seasons and units were draw.

Since we are talking archery going draw....

There are 119 OTC units in Colorado.
59 units are EAST of I25.

So lets focus on WEST of I25 for obvious reasons.

There are 60 OTC units west of I25
There are 63 DRAW units west of I25

 

[5MilesBack]

The whole point system really is age discriminatory. If an older hunter hits the "Western Hunting" scene late in life, he will never accumulate enough points to hunt a top GMU, like 76. I am older, spent a lot of time in 76 in the summers but will never live long enough to draw a tag in 76, that's unfortunate.

I find it funny how mystical and utopian some units are viewed, and that seems to suck so many folks into their spell of grandeur, and just "have to hunt" those particular units.......or the whole system sucks and doesn't work.

Just like most every other unit in CO, most hunters in 76 eat their tags. Many more shoot bulls that you can easily find in OTC units. But everyone thinks they just "have to hunt" these particular units. And if they can't, the system is rigged and unfair.....LOL.

Will it be possible for someone to hunt unit 76 if they just start out now collecting points? Probably not. Is that a problem? Not at all. Unit 76 is but one unit in a state filled with elk hunting opportunities. Are things changing? Of course, everywhere. For what has been perceived as a dying sport, elk hunting demand just keeps increasing. Just 10 years ago, things weren't bad here at all, even for NR's. Ya, things have changed. Demand is through the roof for a so-called "dying sport". And we're living in a "perceived" entitlement era. But folks should be changing their expectations to match that reality as well. And be looking at what opportunities are possible and do exist.......not what isn't possible. I should have every right and opportunity to build a home in Aspen, but that just isn't a realistic expectation for me, while for many others.....it is. Do I dwell on that? NO. Plenty of other places to live and/or hunt.

 

[5MilesBack]

Me

Exactly. And everyone else has their own differing opinion, including the CPW and the game commission. Kind of like God creating everything and everybody, setting the rules and expectations, creating the guide book/users manual.......and then folks come up with their own opinion on how things should be run......LOL.

 

[GringoBling]

Man, this argument is getting old, y'all are way over rating the need for OTC NR money. CPW is RAKING in money from OHV permits, fishing licenses, camping/access fees, fees from outfitters (hunting and otherwise) money from grants, money from the state, money from the feds, plus they'll still sell plenty of NR tags. LOL, they'll be FINE... Everyone will be better off without the flood of NR OTC hunters. Hope they don't chicken out on this.

My statement applies to all units, OTC and draw. For all bull elk licenses sold, 82% of the funding comes from NR. You're not familiar with how government entities operate if you think they'll be willing to forego the majority of a major source of revenue.