Unfollowing Hunting Social Media Will Make Hunting Better: Matt Rinella Essay

[GAPointer]

I don’t believe I’m educated enough to have a great opinion either way. In general, I’m not a huge fan of social media and I’m 30 - but I believe the Steve/Newberg types are a net positive.

I was uncomfortable listening to the podcast haha - as I hate conflict. Any one else curious if @Mattrinella and Steve are still on good terms?? I would hate to see something like this come between brothers but maybe they are used to these kinds of arguments.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Absolutely I have. You can’t imagine the work I put into that Free Range American article. I am a slow writer, and it took me a month of evenings to write that. I definitely want to hear what people think of it. I’m pretty disappointed nobody seems willing to weigh in on the more complicated arguments in the article. Is bragging about and profiteering over dead animals to strangers of value to the hunting community? Is the proper attitude of the hunter one of understatement and humility? Would disincentivizing the bragging and money making by unfollowing sponsored hunters that show legions of strangers what they shoot move the needle in the right direction? Is it fair that people like Cam and Joe that pay 20k to hunt glorified cattle on landowner-sponsored tags and thereby contribute to the privatization of wildlife are creating throngs of aspiring hunting celebrities to crowd out lifelong public land hunters? Would we be better humans if we stopped patronizing these people and used the time to shoot our bows?

Matt - I thought it was a great article and just got done listening to your debate with Steve. I agree with you on most of your points. There are few things that also really bother me about social media influencers.

1. A lot of them end up doing illegal shit like poaching to get footage, post it to their social media, and chase the almighty dollar. A google search will show several of these guys are in legal trouble over hunting violations.

2. If you wound an animal and you can’t find it, I have always believed that my tag is filled. I won’t go shoot another animal. These social media hunters will keep shooting and wounding animals until they finally kill something and have the footage they need to post to their social media accounts.

3. I am not sure how many new hunters the influencers create, but they sure as hell influence hunters from out east to hunt out west. I was born in Utah, raised in Idaho and hunt both those and the surrounding states. I see more license plates from back east than I do locals.

 

[robby denning]

I want to make sure for those who weren’t here when this place started up, it was Aron Snyder’s wilderness forays, skills, and successes that got this place off the ground.

Aron gave people hope that they could do it too. And we’re thankful to him for that.

Some of you should be too or you’d be only able to vent on FB.

Something else to note, pretty happy that this thread has stayed open. Hats off to a good debate. Let’s keep it that way please. Some comments have been deleted as there are some who still can’t make a point without calling their opponents names?!?! Take a hint from some of the better debaters on this thread, they don’t call anyone names. Much more persuasive. You can do it!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[hflier]

Social media (Aron Snyder) got me into this area of hunting which I am grateful for. That being said is does have a negative impact. The reduction of the AZ deer hunt is a direct result of social media. I am one of the guilty.

Ron


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[maddmartagan]

I feel like a lot of people are missing the point when Matt complains about overcrowding. His point (at least I think) is that the overcrowding is BECAUSE influencers are making money from social media. If there were zero people making money from it, and overcrowding happened, I don’t think Matt would be as upset. But his point seems to be that influencers are are basically attributing to overcrowding by making money off it. Which screws over the overwhelming majority of hunters.

Influencers making money AND overcrowding = Matt doesn’t agree with

NOBODY making money and overcrowding = Matt probably wouldn’t have the same issues with social media.

That’s the way I take his view on overcrowding. But most of y’all are just using strawman arguments and claiming he’s just pissed his spots are blown ip, while ignoring the issue that a select few are profiting off of overcrowding, and screwing over the rest of us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Idaho_Potato]

Social media (Aron Snyder) got me into this area of hunting which I am grateful for. That being said is does have a negative impact. The reduction of the AZ deer hunt is a direct result of social media. I am one of the guilty.

Ron


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I believe it was mentioned on a podcast as well that a big reason for kifaru packing up and moving from Denver area to Wyoming was the crowding and population on the front range, and by extension their local hunting areas. They certainly were not shy in discussing all the resident tags they will now get, and the ability to hunt the wilderness as residents.

It's so damn complicated. Make more hunters, then pack up and move when hunting gets too popular in your spot. Lets hope Lander doesn't become the new Bozeman or Denver.

 

[Muledeerhunter406]

I believe it was mentioned on a podcast as well that a big reason for kifaru packing up and moving from Denver area to Wyoming was the crowding and population on the front range, and by extension their local hunting areas. They certainly were not shy in discussing all the resident tags they will now get, and the ability to hunt the wilderness as residents.

It's so damn complicated. Make more hunters, then pack up and move when hunting gets too popular in your spot. Lets hope Lander doesn't become the new Bozeman or Denver.

Bozeman is on a whole other level of stupid man it's a legit mini California pretty disgusting what it's turned into

 

[Idaho_Potato]

Bozeman is on a whole other level of stupid man it's a legit mini California pretty disgusting what it's turned into

Before the world melted down from a virus, the desolation and economic situation in Wyoming seemed to keep it off the radar for a realistic place to have a career for most people. This whole work from home nonsense has thrown a wrench into all that, and I hope we don't see the transformation come true.

 

[ODB]

Before the world melted down from a virus, the desolation and economic situation in Wyoming seemed to keep it off the radar for a realistic place to have a career for most people. This whole work from home nonsense has thrown a wrench into all that, and I hope we don't see the transformation come true.

It’s happening in your (our) backyard, mate. Not sure which end of Idaho you are on but down here I can’t drive but a few miles without saying “I used to hunt birds right there,” while staring at subdivision.

 

[Blackcow]

On the topic of Az otc deer, at the December 10th Commission meeting the commission instructed G&F to implement the mandatory harvest reporting/ threshold model for OTC deer, and told them to evaluate a method to cap NR to 10% going forward. Currently the NR otc deer tags hover around that 10% anyway, but there it is.

 

[Idaho_Potato]

It’s happening in your (our) backyard, mate. Not sure which end of Idaho you are on but down here I can’t drive but a few miles without saying “I used to hunt birds right there,” while staring at subdivision.

Yes sir. I don't live in Boise but I avoid it like the plague. It's the same story in multiple places here. The only good thing about this neck of the woods is that in the outlying ag communities people are downright hostile to outsiders from the west coast.

 

[204guy]

I feel like a lot of people are missing the point when Matt complains about overcrowding. His point (at least I think) is that the overcrowding is BECAUSE influencers are making money from social media. If there were zero people making money from it, and overcrowding happened, I don’t think Matt would be as upset. But his point seems to be that influencers are are basically attributing to overcrowding by making money off it. Which screws over the overwhelming majority of hunters.

Influencers making money AND overcrowding = Matt doesn’t agree with

NOBODY making money and overcrowding = Matt probably wouldn’t have the same issues with social media.

That’s the way I take his view on overcrowding. But most of y’all are just using strawman arguments and claiming he’s just pissed his spots are blown ip, while ignoring the issue that a select few are profiting off of overcrowding, and screwing over the rest of us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well said. For me it's the for profit motivation that perverts everything for me. I've made a conscious decision to not attempt to profit from hunting. I've seen friends go down that road and it has always changed their relationship to hunting in a negative way. Some guy blowing up an area because he's an idiot like the above linked WY post is completely different than an influencer with 250k followers doing it for likes or attention or whatever. Ultimately it always comes back to a for profit motivation.

 

[ODB]

Well said. For me it's the for profit motivation that perverts everything for me. I've made a conscious decision to not attempt to profit from hunting. I've seen friends go down that road and it has always changed their relationship to hunting in a negative way. Some guy blowing up an area because he's an idiot like the above linked WY post is completely different than an influencer with 250k followers doing it for likes or attention or whatever. Ultimately it always comes back to a for profit motivation.

Yes. A while back on a different thread (maybe a few months?) I made the comment that folks like Steve and others are essentially market hunters because they hunt to run a business. It’s reducing a public resource for personal gain. A lot of people didn’t like that perspective. I thought it was interesting Matt brought up the exact same thing to Steve. I think the point is that whether you are one person killing a lot of animals to sell or selling the inspiration for a lot of people to go kill one animal, the market doesn’t care. The resource is diminished.

The proof is in the pudding: how did the NR Idaho tag-fest go this year? Faster than ever, I believe.

 

[hibernation]

Where does the anti-R3 movement stop? Is it still ok to instill a love of the outdoors and hunting in my kids, or is that bad for the resource?

Personally, I draw the line at two things: first, coordinated, nationwide efforts to move the needle on hunter numbers; and second, profiting off the boom of new hunters while avoiding the fallout. I think the latter is more what Matt's article is talking about.

I'm totally in favor of helping out new hunters. Pass it on to your kids, take a neighbor out with you, help out at a hunter's sight-in day at your local range, etc. But I've seen some state agencies try to solve their budget problems by increasing hunter numbers, and in most places that's just not sustainable. More people applying for the same number of tags will increase revenue, sure, but now I might only hunt big game every other year. Or every third year, or worse. To me, there's a big difference between helping out new hunters (someone who's already interested and just needs advice), and a coordinated plan to identify potential recruits, convince them they should hunt, and then giving them just enough tools to buy a license.

The other part is the influencers essentially trying to make a living off a natural resource. They're relying on a public resource to generate income, but passing the buck when it comes to the repercussions. I think the market hunting comparison is spot on - maybe it's not to the same degree, but it's definitely in the same ballpark.

 

[CorbLand]

I think people are missing a very important part of the increase in hunters. The US saw a 7% increase in population in the last 5 years and an increase of 10% between 2000 and 2010. Thats about 35 million people and if only 1 percent of those hunt, thats an additional 350,000 people to contend with. Then try it with the actually percentage of the US that hold hunting licenses, which is about 4%. Depending on what number you choose to use, you are are looking at a 5 to 10% increase to the number of license holders in the last ~15 years.

Has social media affected hunting? Yes. Is it the leading cause of increased number of hunters? That is to be determined.

 

[Idaho_Potato]

The proof is in the pudding: how did the NR Idaho tag-fest go this year? Faster than ever, I believe.

The hilarious part was the live thread on this forum alerting everyone that forgot to jump in the online IDFG waiting room to compete for the same handful of tags . Just invite 50,000 of your closest friends to compete for the same 35 tags you are trying to grab.

 

[clkress5]

Social media (Aron Snyder) got me into this area of hunting which I am grateful for. That being said is does have a negative impact. The reduction of the AZ deer hunt is a direct result of social media. I am one of the guilty.

Ron


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

As an AZ resident myself I will 100% disagree. AZ game and fish is to blame, Lack of proper management, excess rifle tags and no real tracking of animal number. Want to blame any with social media, blame them. AZ G&F paid social media influencers to promote OTC here in AZ to make more money. Plenty of influencers had been coming to AZ to hunt OTC the last 10 years, it only really been the last 2-3 that its been kinda over board. Doesn't help that they keep increasing rifle tags and closing OTC units to put more pressure on the other open ones.

 

[d-bone20917]

I want to make sure for those who weren’t here when this place started up, it was Aron Snyder’s wilderness forays, skills, and successes that got this place off the ground.

Aron gave people hope that they could do it too. And we’re thankful to him for that.

And now he is literally saving lives with his social media accounts. If you don't believe it just listen to his Blood Origins podcast. No shortage of arrogance there. It was also obvious he didn't read Matt's article.

 

[KurtR]

And now he is literally saving lives with his social media accounts. If you don't believe it just listen to his Blood Origins podcast. No shortage of arrogance there. It was also obvious he didn't read Matt's article.

Are you saying he is a liar and doesnt get stuff like that from people?

 

[blackdawg]

I infinitely prefer being a research scientist and a no-name than a hunting celeb.

I definitely align with this thought process and I think many of us are the same way, unfortunately we all recognize social media has created power that can be wielded beyond our wildest imaginations. Banning the President of the United States for making posts that didn’t align politically is imho a scary example we as outdoorsmen should be extremely alert about, things can get sideways fast if we are divided as a community and we are silenced. I acknowledge in total disgust that times have changed for the worse, I sure would like to be “King of the World” for a few days. I doubt that will happen so I will put this thought out there. From the bottom where I stand I ask this question. Are we teetering at a moment that replicates the turn of the century when wildlife had been virtually wiped out due to the greed from the urban dwellers for fancy feathers,meats and skins, a time in the past when by chance many great conservationists emerged such as Theodore Roosevelt to preserve the lands and wildlife before all of it was lost forever, that preserved everything that this entire thread is revolving around?It sure looks to me like we could be at a new crossroads and we hit the peak a decade ago before this incredible communication explosion. Once again it seems the evil monster of greed in a different context is starting to make the wheels spin off this wagon nationwide for the outdoorsman. I could make a huge list of changes proposed and changes implemented that are detrimental to everything we would like to see as hunters in many different states but will save that for another day. We are coming under attack from outside the hunting community and fighting within at levels so high it makes me terrified of what the future holds. Over 1000 posts on a thread here and some great thoughts have been disseminated for sure, but I don’t think any real change will be effected, mostly keyboard warriors getting their panties in a wad. Perhaps it’s time for the outdoor community to reassess how we pursue the activities that keep us as we define it, “living life to the fullest”. Do we really want to continue down the path we are taking with divisive activities and equipment like long range guns, crossbows, robo ducks, scoring systems, game department advertising, cell trail cameras,Utv’s, drones, etc,etc,etc. I could go on and on about the technological advancements that have changed the way we participate in the outdoors.I do believe if this so called “value” of the wildlife continues to be promoted so intensely and the perceived values continue to escalate at such a rapid rate with All the players screaming “mine,mine,mine” it’s almost inevitable a European model of wildlife management with only the wealthiest having access to hunt is looming, most of us peasants here will be sitting on the sidelines permanently watching these influencers on Netflix or YouTube. Without a doubt it has gotten flocked up all over North America really quickly whether it be private access or public opportunity. Perhaps JFK’s famous statement needs to be applied to Outdoorsman with our personal twist,”Don’t ask yourself what hunting/fishing can do for you, what can you do for hunting/fishing ” might be the mindset that the community needs to adopt. Should we continue down this technological path and make this our new “tradition”? Like it or not as outdoorsman we need strong voices that represent well in the public eye, organizations or individuals like Newberg, Primos, Steven, Newcomb, Waddell,Shockey, Ronquest, Warren, Snyder, Don Jr., Phil, Dance, Hayes, Lindner, and many others,staying visible to the friggin “Public”, from down here at the bottom where I see it, our job is going to be making sure with our dollars, the message they are sending reflects what the majority of the community considers acceptable and they are given the “Cancel” notice if they screw up the assignment! That is all.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk