I gots the Covid.

[Okhotnik]

You can cut the data at the state level, country level, or individual level. Republicans are vaccinated for COVID at a significantly lower rate than Democrats and are (not unsurprisingly) dying from COVID at a significantly higher rate.

"NPR looked at deaths per 100,000 people in roughly 3,000 counties across the U.S. from May 2021, the point at which vaccinations widely became available. People living in counties that went 60% or higher for Trump in November 2020 had 2.73 times the death rates of those that went for Biden. Counties with an even higher share of the vote for Trump saw higher COVID-19 mortality rates."

Pro-Trump counties now have far higher COVID death rates. Misinformation is to blame

An analysis by NPR shows that since the vaccine rollout, counties that voted heavily for Donald Trump have had more than twice the COVID mortality rates of those that voted for Joe Biden.

www.npr.org

Excerpt from an NBC article from August 2021 that surveyed individuals:

• Democrats: 88 percent
• Independents: 60 percent
• Republicans: 55 percent
• Republicans who support Trump more than party: 46 percent
• Republicans who support party more than Trump: 62 percent

NBC News poll shows demographic breakdown of the vaccinated in the U.S.

First Read is your briefing from "Meet the Press" and the NBC Political Unit on the day's most important political stories and why they matter.

www.nbcnews.com

I see Biden, Harris, the mayors of San Fran, DC and The Gov of Oregon and Fauci were just caught AGAIN violating their own mask mandates. Just follow the science lol

 

[5MilesBack]

I see Biden, Harris, the mayors of San Fran, DC and The Gov of Oregon and Fauci were just caught AGAIN violating their own mask mandates. Just follow the science lol

In regard to the masks........they ARE following the science. They don't work!

 

[Actual_Cryptid]

In regard to the masks........they ARE following the science. They don't work!

You sure about that?

https://www.kansascity.com/news/coronavirus/article256266117.html

 

[AK Troutbum]

Ahhhhh insurance.........now we're in a totally new territory and argument. How about no insurance, and pay as you go........for everyone? I'm all for that.

And pay before you are treated. If you end up in the hospital for something the requires more and more life sustaining measures, than you must pay prior to receiving those measures. One thing is for certain, our country would get a LOT smaller (population wise), very quickly.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MattB]

I call bull$#!+ that you made the call to an insurance agency just to prove a guy wrong on a forum.

My work is renewing benefits and I spoke yesterday with an insurance broker while going over different policies and rates. She, who's job it is to know policies of multiple insurance companies like the back of her hand, asked me up front if I had received a covid vaccine in the past 30 days. I inquired, and she told me that if I was looking to start a new policy, I would not be eligible if I had received a covid vaccine within the last month. Her words not mine. I trust that she knows the business.

Clearly, as seen by how often you post on this thread, you love nothing more than a good argument. So, with that, I'm out.

I just hate the misinformation that is so common on these threads. Do you have anything in writing we can see? Otherwise it is just hearsay.

And I absolutely did call USAA. I am retired and have time.

 

[MattB]

I think at least some of the folks who came up with these articles have a conclusion (Trump and/or Republicans are causing Covid deaths) and looking for data to support it. I think you and I have agreed on plenty of the science-related components of these various Covid threads, but I think trying to tie in politics to any particular point of view on Covid is going to be a challenge, and IMHO brings too much subjectivity and opinion into an area already fraught with disagreement.

I'm not sure the NPR article says Republicans are vaccinated at a lower rate - it merely draws an association from the deaths per 100k data, and an association doesn't equate to causation. (This point is acknowledged in passing in the NPR article, since they have no idea of the political leanings of those who died, but then the author immediately says "ut the strength of the association, combined with polling information about vaccination, strongly suggests that Republicans are being disproportionately affected." I again point to the "strong association" of consuming margarine and divorce - which is a spurious correlation). The NBC poll (and another telephone poll referenced in the NPR article) does say Republicans are less likely to be vaccinated, but I personally don't put any stock in telephone polls - especially an NBC poll of 1000 people, only 790 of whom are registered voters. As an example, that poll shows that blacks are more vaccinated than whites (76% vs 66%), but the CDC reports that blacks are 1.9x likely to die from Covid than whites. Can I now take those two statistics and draw any conclusions - like the vaccine works better for white people? No, and there's really nothing in the polls that can lead anyone to draw sound conclusions if they will concede that correlations can be spurious.

Mississippi and Alabama have (reportedly - https://www.statista.com/statistics/1109011/coronavirus-covid19-death-rates-us-by-state/) the highest rates of Covid deaths per capita. Is that because they are red states, or counties, or individuals? Or could it be due to another reason, or many reasons (because the population is older or has more co-morbidities, vaccines and other health care isn't as available, etc.)? NJ has the third worst Covid mortality, and NY is 7th, but I don't think anyone can draw conclusions based on the residents of those states either.

While I agree with you about putting stock in one small survey, when you look at the results of multiple surveys on the same topic the sample size becomes more robust. Here are some snippets from another article (link below) that references 3 different surveys from Sept. 2021. More surveys, data, similar conclusions:

Kaiser Family Foundation - "90% of Democrats had been vaccinated, compared with 68% of Independents and just 58% of Republicans."

Gallup - "...92% of Democrats, 68% of Independents, and 56% of Republicans."

Johns Hopkins - "Of the 21 states with vaccination rates above the national average, Joe Biden carried 20 last November. Of the 29 states below the national average, Donald Trump carried 24."

The real question IMO is not whether this is the case, but why is it the case? Based on what I have observed on this forum, I believe that a susceptibility to accepting misinformation has a lot to do with it.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixg...liation-matters-more-than-race-and-ethnicity/

On MS and AK, they are both red (62% for Trump to 36% for Biden and 58%/41%, respectively) and fat. Likely both politics and comorbidities at work.

I agree with you on the folly of using NJ and NY death rates to draw conclusions on vaccine effectiveness. The majority of deaths in both states occurred very early in the pandemic (2020) and prior to the vaccines being available (see "Daily New Death" graphs in the links below).

New Jersey COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

New Jersey COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

New York COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

New York COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

To contrast, AL and MS had 7-day average new deaths in the fall of 2021 (after vaccines were widely available) that roughly equaled that of Jan 2021 (pre-vaccine availability).

Alabama COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Alabama COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

Mississippi COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Mississippi COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

 

[fwafwow]

While I agree with you about putting stock in one small survey, when you look at the results of multiple surveys on the same topic the sample size becomes more robust. Here are some snippets from another article (link below) that references 3 different surveys from Sept. 2021. More surveys, data, similar conclusions:

Kaiser Family Foundation - "90% of Democrats had been vaccinated, compared with 68% of Independents and just 58% of Republicans."

Gallup - "...92% of Democrats, 68% of Independents, and 56% of Republicans."

Johns Hopkins - "Of the 21 states with vaccination rates above the national average, Joe Biden carried 20 last November. Of the 29 states below the national average, Donald Trump carried 24."

The real question IMO is not whether this is the case, but why is it the case? Based on what I have observed on this forum, I believe that a susceptibility to accepting misinformation has a lot to do with it.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/fixg...liation-matters-more-than-race-and-ethnicity/

On MS and AK, they are both red (62% for Trump to 36% for Biden and 58%/41%, respectively) and fat. Likely both politics and comorbidities at work.

I agree with you on the folly of using NJ and NY death rates to draw conclusions on vaccine effectiveness. The majority of deaths in both states occurred very early in the pandemic (2020) and prior to the vaccines being available (see "Daily New Death" graphs in the links below).

New Jersey COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

New Jersey COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

New York COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

New York COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

To contrast, AL and MS had 7-day average new deaths in the fall of 2021 (after vaccines were widely available) that roughly equaled that of Jan 2021 (pre-vaccine availability).

Alabama COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Alabama COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

Mississippi COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Mississippi COVID-19 Coronavirus update by county with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, current active cases, recoveries, historical data, trends, projections, and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

Association doesn’t equate to causation, and citing more phone surveys that describe associations doesn’t change that.

 

[Trr15]

I just hate the misinformation that is so common on these threads. Do you have anything in writing we can see? Otherwise it is just hearsay.

And I absolutely did call USAA. I am retired and have time.

Is your conversation with USAA not just hearsay as well or do you have different rules for yourself?

 

[jmez]

You sure about that?

https://www.kansascity.com/news/coronavirus/article256266117.html

How did they designate masks as the factor for the results? Were the results significant? How do they account for infections in masked areas being higher prior to the Delta wave? Or are we to conclude that mask wearing increases the spread of non Delta variants. See how easy that is.

The results weren't released to the public because they don't mean anything.

 

[jmez]

https://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations


Gotta be careful what you call Science and how you interpret the results.

 

[fwafwow]

https://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations


Gotta be careful what you call Science and how you interpret the results.

Yes! That’s where I read about the margarine and divorce.

 

[5MilesBack]

The real question IMO is not whether this is the case, but why is it the case? Based on what I have observed on this forum, I believe that a susceptibility to accepting misinformation has a lot to do with it.

Then you haven't been following this thread very closely at all. We've explained "why" multiple times already, and misinformation (or falling for misinformation) is not part of that. Conservatives don't follow the whims of the masses, or solely the information that is put out. We make our own decisions.

 

[Hatchet Jack]

I am retired and have time.

We can tell

 

[Shorthunter]

You and every other mammal.

I've had it twice that I know of. It's here to stay, just like the seasonal flu.

 

[Actual_Cryptid]

https://www.tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations


Gotta be careful what you call Science and how you interpret the results.

The entirety of the anti-mask, anti-vaccine response has been spurious correlations. You yourself used a spurious correlation (claiming infection rates were higher in masked areas prior to the delta variant) so take your own pill as well.

The way you get around spurious correlation is through peer review and replication, something that has favored the fficacy of both masks as a community health measure and vaccine efficacy and safety, but which has not had favorable results for ivermectin. Or before that when Hydroxychloroquine was the secret cure-all. Or in between that when it was Oleander extract.

 

[Okhotnik]

The entirety of the anti-mask, anti-vaccine response has been spurious correlations. You yourself used a spurious correlation (claiming infection rates were higher in masked areas prior to the delta variant) so take your own pill as well.

The way you get around spurious correlation is through peer review and replication, something that has favored the fficacy of both masks as a community health measure and vaccine efficacy and safety, but which has not had favorable results for ivermectin. Or before that when Hydroxychloroquine was the secret cure-all. Or in between that when it was Oleander extract.

The ultra rich people in control with all of the recent unrefutable mask science are constantly being caught without masks in indoor public settings violating their own mandates on a flu virus. No reliable research even attemptempted on alternatives.

Passive aggressive Liberal arts majors with zero science background or classes lecturing others on science. Living in a Clown world


Why is that? A phugging 2 year old can figure out that a non medical Chinese cloth mask with a kitty cat or blm logo or Chinese produced ( origin of the virus) paper face diaper has zero protection.

 

[Okhotnik]

You and every other mammal.

I've had it twice that I know of. It's here to stay, just like the seasonal flu.

How many decades has the flu virus been on earth? political science. or psychology or ecological sustainable studies majors will inform you that this is a new phenomena.

 

[Texizona]

Interesting factoid I learned today.

If you've had the covid vaccine within the last 30 days you are not eligible to start a new life insurance policy.

I own one of the largest employee benefit brokerages in East Texas. We regularly work with over 50 different insurance companies and none have rules regarding vaccination status. I'm not saying it is impossible, but I've not heard of any carrier instituting restrictions. There was initially a lot of conjecture that this could happen, but we haven't seen seen it.

Unless you are deeply involved in the industry, you are probably not aware of the politically sensitive nature of insurance companies. With the pressure that our politicians have placed on everyone to be vaccinated, I don't see any major carrier "punishing" anyone who has been vaccinated. It's far too easy for bureaucrats to make an insurance company's life miserable.

 

[MattB]

Is your conversation with USAA not just hearsay as well or do you have different rules for yourself?

if you knew what the word meant, you wouldn’t have asked the question.

 

[Rob960]

So I listened to an interesting conversation while driving home on Sirius XM Fox News. Martha MacCallum had an infectious disease doc on who stated with the Omicron variant what we could see is Covid 19 ending up becoming another cold virus which is also a coronavirus.

Herd immunity which Fauci keeps espousing through vaccinations ( I am not anti-vacc as I have the full compliment and the booster and still got Delta) is an unobtainable goal as the variant keeps changing and so forth. I think it is time that decisions from one doc be replaced by a panel of experts, many of whom are offering alternative theories on where this is going and what to do.