6mm /.243 hunting success on Big Game

[UngulateGuardian797]

Killed the cow elk yesterday at 362 yards with 108 ELDM out of my 6 Creedmoor. It just flattened her.

 

[Poe]

Much better with the link added. List doesn't include the 95 NBT, but has been brought up numerous times as a great option. Especially for non LRH applications and 1:10 barrels.

I have had good results on deer with the 95gr NBT and the 87&95gr Berger’s but I just got a 7.5 twist 6 creed barrel so I’m exploring the heavier options. Thanks

 

[Brap01]

Any experience with close range shots in a 6mm on elk facing you?

Several years ago a buddy of mine put a 6.5 PRC into the chest of a bull at 65 yards and it dropped. Something around 2900 FPS in that 140 gr range. It tried to get up and he shot it between the shoulder blades. After a bit it got up and ran off. Tracked blood in fresh snow for a couple hundred yards and then nothing all the way out to 700 yards. That worries me with smaller bullets.

Is there an upper limit for impact velocity on something like a 6mm 108 gr ELDM?

 

[DisplacedHusky]

Any experience with close range shots in a 6mm on elk facing you?

Several years ago a buddy of mine put a 6.5 PRC into the chest of a bull at 65 yards and it dropped. Something around 2900 FPS in that 140 gr range. It tried to get up and he shot it between the shoulder blades. After a bit it got up and ran off. Tracked blood in fresh snow for a couple hundred yards and then nothing all the way out to 700 yards. That worries me with smaller bullets.

Is there an upper limit for impact velocity on something like a 6mm 108 gr ELDM?

Did you see this happen? Was the bull recovered?

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Any experience with close range shots in a 6mm on elk facing you?

Several years ago a buddy of mine put a 6.5 PRC into the chest of a bull at 65 yards and it dropped. Something around 2900 FPS in that 140 gr range. It tried to get up and he shot it between the shoulder blades. After a bit it got up and ran off. Tracked blood in fresh snow for a couple hundred yards and then nothing all the way out to 700 yards. That worries me with smaller bullets.

Is there an upper limit for impact velocity on something like a 6mm 108 gr ELDM?

I have multiple kills in this exact impact location on heavy bodied deer and cow elk using 95 grain SSTs out of a .243.

These would be considered “even more likely to grenade” than the 108 ELDM by most at the same impact velocities.

I wouldn’t hesitate to make a base of neck/chest shot at any impact velocity with a 108 ELDM (obviously with a low end spec of 1,800-2,000 for me).

 

[Brap01]

Did you see this happen? Was the bull recovered?

I did not see it. I trust him 100% and he has killed a pile of elk. The bull was not recovered. Lone bull in fresh snow, he said it was super easy to track.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

I did not see it. I trust him 100% and he has killed a pile of elk. The bull was not recovered. Lone bull in fresh snow, he said it was super easy to track.

Bummer. Happens when you shoot enough animals and it still sucks every time.

Did he mention which bullet?

 

[Brap01]

Bummer. Happens when you shoot enough animals and it still sucks every time.

Did he mention which bullet?

I don’t recall which is why I was vague about the bullet. I’m not sure if they e changed bullet construction in the last 5 years so it might not be the same bullet anymore anyway.

 

[Castle Rock]

Any experience with close range shots in a 6mm on elk facing you?

Several years ago a buddy of mine put a 6.5 PRC into the chest of a bull at 65 yards and it dropped. Something around 2900 FPS in that 140 gr range. It tried to get up and he shot it between the shoulder blades. After a bit it got up and ran off. Tracked blood in fresh snow for a couple hundred yards and then nothing all the way out to 700 yards. That worries me with smaller bullets.

Is there an upper limit for impact velocity on something like a 6mm 108 gr ELDM?

A front on shot high in the chest is a bugger of a shot, above the heart and between the lungs

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

A front on shot high in the chest is a bugger of a shot, above the heart and between the lungs

If you shoot high enough you can sever the trachea and catch some spine and vitals with fragments. It can kill well.

 

[Telford29]

243 Winchester, 95 grain nosler bt. Shot was 100 yards, behind shoulder. Bullet ended up on far side under hide. Weighed 60 grains. Broke ribs on both sides of cavity. Traveled about 30 yards after the shot, stopped hung head and fell over.

 

[Castle Rock]

If you shoot high enough you can sever the trachea and catch some spine and vitals with fragments. It can kill well.

For sure, but I would call that a frontal neck shot

 

[The Guide]

Any experience with close range shots in a 6mm on elk facing you?

Several years ago a buddy of mine put a 6.5 PRC into the chest of a bull at 65 yards and it dropped. Something around 2900 FPS in that 140 gr range. It tried to get up and he shot it between the shoulder blades. After a bit it got up and ran off. Tracked blood in fresh snow for a couple hundred yards and then nothing all the way out to 700 yards. That worries me with smaller bullets.

Is there an upper limit for impact velocity on something like a 6mm 108 gr ELDM?

I have taken that shot before and not had the outcome one would expect. Hunting with a friend and his kids. Son with dad, daughter with me. She spots a mule deer buck and hits high and back in the guts. I give the deer time to bed down and her time to get her composure back. We start the tracking job. The deer never bedded down. He was still on his feet trying to follow the does and they were 800 yards away now. We drop into a gully and get to about 275 yards and we get pinned down. All the deer are alert and facing us very aware of where we were. She could not get into a position where she could see the deer and have a solid shooting platform. I decided to try and end the rodeo and took a frontal shot with my 280AI shooting the 160 Nosler Partition. I hit him dead center of the chest at the top of the brisket. The bullet never entered the chest but instead followed the brisket in the fat between the hide. It exited just before the sternum, entered the gut cavity, exited the gut cavity, blew off a testicle, and lodged in the back leg. He dropped and we figured he was dead as we saw him taking those giant deep breaths that they take when they are lung shot and you hit bone. We get up there and he jumps up and runs away. Now it is a race to keep him off private and get him dead. My young partner made a great shot on him as he paused to jump a ditch at a little over 300 yards. When my buddy processed the deer he found the brisket and sternum bones all broken and the ribs loose but that joker was still moving fast and getting out of town. Frontal shots can work but they can also cause a rodeo. Aim higher than you think you need to.

Jay

 

[Brap01]

I have taken that shot before and not had the outcome one would expect. Hunting with a friend and his kids. Son with dad, daughter with me. She spots a mule deer buck and hits high and back in the guts. I give the deer time to bed down and her time to get her composure back. We start the tracking job. The deer never bedded down. He was still on his feet trying to follow the does and they were 800 yards away now. We drop into a gully and get to about 275 yards and we get pinned down. All the deer are alert and facing us very aware of where we were. She could not get into a position where she could see the deer and have a solid shooting platform. I decided to try and end the rodeo and took a frontal shot with my 280AI shooting the 160 Nosler Partition. I hit him dead center of the chest at the top of the brisket. The bullet never entered the chest but instead followed the brisket in the fat between the hide. It exited just before the sternum, entered the gut cavity, exited the gut cavity, blew off a testicle, and lodged in the back leg. He dropped and we figured he was dead as we saw him taking those giant deep breaths that they take when they are lung shot and you hit bone. We get up there and he jumps up and runs away. Now it is a race to keep him off private and get him dead. My young partner made a great shot on him as he paused to jump a ditch at a little over 300 yards. When my buddy processed the deer he found the brisket and sternum bones all broken and the ribs loose but that joker was still moving fast and getting out of town. Frontal shots can work but they can also cause a rodeo. Aim higher than you think you need to.

Jay

That’s a wild rodeo story. Thanks for sharing!

I still wonder if there is a higher velocity limit when killing big game with small calibers, especially with frontal or quartering shots.

I’m relatively new to this skinny bullets killing big game and just exploring the limits before I buy a new rifle.

 

[Formidilosus]

That’s a wild rodeo story. Thanks for sharing!

I still wonder if there is a higher velocity limit when killing big game with small calibers, especially with frontal or quartering shots.

No, or at least not anything below 3,400fps. Read the 223 thread and match bullets for killing threads in their entirety. All of you questions have been asked and answered.

 

[The Guide]

That’s a wild rodeo story. Thanks for sharing!

I still wonder if there is a higher velocity limit when killing big game with small calibers, especially with frontal or quartering shots.

I’m relatively new to this skinny bullets killing big game and just exploring the limits before I buy a new rifle.

It depends on the cartridge. As you move up in velocity, you move up in bullet size and toughness because a 6UM will have similar velocity at 300 yards as a 6mm ARC has at the muzzle.

To do it right you need to figure out what bullet you want to use and what maximum range you will shoot. Back calculate to find your minimum muzzle velocity to get your bullet to perform at or beyond your maximum range. Use a ballistic calculator to find those numbers. Then find your cartridge that gives you your required velocity with the bullet you want to use. Always use the heaviest bullets you might want to use to do this calculation so that of you end up using a lighter bullet, you will be over velocity rather than being under velocity because you started with a light bullet.

Example...

You hunt in 2 different places normally. Where you live at 1900' and where you go for your yearly trip and that is 7600'. You know that the largest bullet you will ever use is the 108 ELDM although you would also try the 108 and 105 Berger and 103 Hornady bullets. Your maximum distance is 650 yards so we want that 1800 fps threshold at 700 yards to make sure we stay above it. We run the numbers and find that to get 1800 fps in our typical hunting weather atmospheric conditions at 700 yards we need a 2900 fps MV. What cartridge will give that?

We do research on real world velocity readings with the 108 ELDM and find that 243 will give you 2900 fps with common powders, the 6mm Creedmoor will give you 2960 fps with common powders, the 6ARC will give you 2680 fps, and the 6UM will give you 3210 fps. The 243 will work, the 6CM will work, the 6ARC doesn't get you there, and the 6UM is way too much for your needs.

Say you didn't have the skills or the the place to shoot past 500 yards and you didn't plan on using anything but the 103 ELDX to hunt with. Run the numbers and find that at 550 yards you get to the 1800 fps threshold when you launch at 2690 fps. Do the research and find that the 243 spits that bullet at 2980 fps, the 6CM is 3050 fps, the 6ARC is at 2710 fps, and the 6UM is 3300 fps. The little 6ARC gets you where you need to be without issue. The others will work but you will have more velocity and recoil than needed and increase your chance to have over expansion at short range when shots take place at closer than expected distances.

This is an easy way for you to find the proper bullet launching speed and cartridge to get you there.

Jay

 

[gman82001]

243 Winchester, 95 grain nosler bt. Shot was 100 yards, behind shoulder. Bullet ended up on far side under hide. Weighed 60 grains. Broke ribs on both sides of cavity. Traveled about 30 yards after the shot, stopped hung head and fell over.View attachment 807077View attachment 807078

Man I like that orange barrel on there it looks awesome. Congrats on the cow I’m going to revisit the 95bt and see if I can get it to shoot better with a different powder in mine

 

[Brap01]

It depends on the cartridge. As you move up in velocity, you move up in bullet size and toughness because a 6UM will have similar velocity at 300 yards as a 6mm ARC has at the muzzle.

To do it right you need to figure out what bullet you want to use and what maximum range you will shoot. Back calculate to find your minimum muzzle velocity to get your bullet to perform at or beyond your maximum range. Use a ballistic calculator to find those numbers. Then find your cartridge that gives you your required velocity with the bullet you want to use. Always use the heaviest bullets you might want to use to do this calculation so that of you end up using a lighter bullet, you will be over velocity rather than being under velocity because you started with a light bullet.

Example...

You hunt in 2 different places normally. Where you live at 1900' and where you go for your yearly trip and that is 7600'. You know that the largest bullet you will ever use is the 108 ELDM although you would also try the 108 and 105 Berger and 103 Hornady bullets. Your maximum distance is 650 yards so we want that 1800 fps threshold at 700 yards to make sure we stay above it. We run the numbers and find that to get 1800 fps in our typical hunting weather atmospheric conditions at 700 yards we need a 2900 fps MV. What cartridge will give that?

We do research on real world velocity readings with the 108 ELDM and find that 243 will give you 2900 fps with common powders, the 6mm Creedmoor will give you 2960 fps with common powders, the 6ARC will give you 2680 fps, and the 6UM will give you 3210 fps. The 243 will work, the 6CM will work, the 6ARC doesn't get you there, and the 6UM is way too much for your needs.

Say you didn't have the skills or the the place to shoot past 500 yards and you didn't plan on using anything but the 103 ELDX to hunt with. Run the numbers and find that at 550 yards you get to the 1800 fps threshold when you launch at 2690 fps. Do the research and find that the 243 spits that bullet at 2980 fps, the 6CM is 3050 fps, the 6ARC is at 2710 fps, and the 6UM is 3300 fps. The little 6ARC gets you where you need to be without issue. The others will work but you will have more velocity and recoil than needed and increase your chance to have over expansion at short range when shots take place at closer than expected distances.

This is an easy way for you to find the proper bullet launching speed and cartridge to get you there.

Jay

Thanks for the detailed explanation. Before I joined the RokSlide I used basically those same steps to decide on a 6 CM. Just bummed Tikka doesn’t make one. So now I have to re barrel my 30-06 T3 Lite or buy something else.

 

[The Guide]

Thanks for the detailed explanation. Before I joined the RokSlide I used basically those same steps to decide on a 6 CM. Just bummed Tikka doesn’t make one. So now I have to re barrel my 30-06 T3 Lite or buy something else.

I'm a Tikka guy but I'm also a buy cheap shit that works guy. You can get Ruger American Predator Gen 1 6mm Creedmoor for less than the price of a barrel. Mine shoots exceptionally and I'd buy another one today. They are still available and 2 guns is always better than one...

Jay

 

[UngulateGuardian797]

I'm a Tikka guy but I'm also a buy cheap shit that works guy. You can get Ruger American Predator Gen 1 6mm Creedmoor for less than the price of a barrel. Mine shoots exceptionally and I'd buy another one today. They are still available and 2 guns is always better than one...

Jay

I’m in the same boat Jay! That’s what I did! My Ruger American Predator in 6 Creedmoor is an accurate little gun and stuff keeps dropping with it.