What do you consider a "chip shot"

[wind gypsy]

Yes. Max scope power, remove the ability to use BDS rangefinders and binos. Hell, I would be fine getting rid of range finders in general

I'd rather just have a max legal distance. No rangefinders is going to wound just as many or more animals. I think we've come a long way in a hunter's ability to make clean ethical kill shots with knowledge and equipment. I'd rather not take that away and having people thinking a 300 yard deer is 200 yards away.

 

[huntnful]

I wonder how these "chip shot" distances would change if 25K was on the line and not an animal....

What’s the parameters?? 500 yards, 10” circle?

 

[S.Clancy]

What’s the parameters?? 500 yards, 10” circle?

Seems reasonable. 10" covers pretty much all animals kill zones.

 

[huntnful]

Seems reasonable. 10" covers pretty much all animals kill zones.

I would honestly take a $25k bet I get a first round impact inside the circle. Not out of arrogance. Just a reasonable bet IMO. Probably win it 95% of the time. Be dumb not to take it lol

 

[hereinaz]

This isn’t a condemnation, just a discussion that needs to be had a lot, which made less clear than it should be, by virtue of the interne

Good point and I agree. We are differing by definition maybe?

What percentage is a chip shot?
What percentage is a gimme?

For discussion purposes, rather than calling it a “chip shot” what’s your standard required confidence before you take a shot?

When you point to my 80% in the field, it is only a sample size of 5. Predictions of the future based on a small sample size are hard.
It’s true, I could miss the next 3 or kill the next 3.

And, after my 1/5 miss, I did an honest evaluation and changed my rifle system and practiced more. I killed two after that change.

Assume I am practicing and have my rifle system doped. I have shot dozens of cold bore shots in field positions on rocks. I hike and I haven’t repeated spots so it is new wind, light, etc. I follow them up with more shots to practice from the position I built, so hundreds of shots in the field.

I practice maybe 3 fully supported positions off a tripod, and have high confidence in them. So, my shot process is repeatable.
I am using time and opportunity to build a position in light/steady wind conditions before I press the trigger.
What would you suggest that I do to improve my pre hunt preparations?
How confident can a person get if they focus?

 

[parshal]

I would honestly take a $25k bet I get a first round impact inside the circle. Not out of arrogance. Just a reasonable bet IMO. Probably win it 95% of the time. Be dumb not to take it lol

Prone on a square range or shooting across a canyon off a rock with an 8 mph wind at 4 o’clock (at your shooting position)?

 

[S.Clancy]

I would honestly take a $25k bet I get a first round impact inside the circle. Not out of arrogance. Just a reasonable bet IMO. Probably win it 95% of the time. Be dumb not to take it lol

That's impressive.

My comment was based on how I've seen pressure affect people when fine motor control is needed.

 

[hereinaz]

If a hunting "chip shot" means the same chances of being one and done as a golf "chip shot" - I'd say about 1600 yards.

If "chip shot" means its pretty much a sure thing, I'll say maybe 250-300 yards with good conditions, a good rest, and calm breathing/heart rate?

Hahaha, so true. This thread needs some good definitions…

A chip shot in golf is an “easy” ball to hit, as in execution isn’t difficult. Hitting a long wedge is hard, lots of variables, hook, slice, etc. A chip shot is a simple shortened swing, short shot. It’s not a stroke that ends in the cup.

I suck at chip shots in golf, we’ll, everything in golf really. Does that mean my chip shots are not chip shots?

To me, with my gear and practice, execution of a 400-500 yard shot with time and opportunity in good conditions is a low difficulty shot.

It’s a 2 moa shot at 500 yards on a 10 inch square plate.

That’s not a gimme, but a 2 moa shot with time and opportunity in good conditions?

In golf, a gimme is a shot that the other players agree can count automatically without being played.

Chip shot (idiom), a phrase denoting that an attempted action has a low degree of difficulty

 

[hereinaz]

I have learned to not take any shot at any range for granted.

Amen, there is no gimme…

 

[huntnful]

Prone on a square range or shooting across a canyon off a rock with an 8 mph wind at 4 o’clock (at your shooting position)?

Preferably the former. But I would honestly take both. See how much a .4 G7 bullet drifts at 3100fps with a quartering 8mph wind. Hold 5” right of the bullseye and its landing within that 10” span to the left, more than likely, despite any wind variances. Theres a fair bit of forgiveness at 500 yards honestly.

 

[huntnful]

Amen, there is no gimme…

Ain’t that a freaking fact. I’ve missed at 100 yards, and killed at 1000 yards. Also missed a few shots in between.

I would without an absolute doubt, rather take a 500 yard prone shot, than a 100 yard off hand shot. Not even close in questioning that lol. Learned that the hard way haha.

 

[Novahunter]

First bull moose I ever saw was 80 yards in front of me, and I sent the bullet a foot over it's back. He just trotted off.

I've killed deer, moose, and Coyotes out past 300 yards, and I used to shoot 6 to 10 PRS marches a year.

"Chip" shots totally depend on conditions, shooting position, and mental/physical preparedness. But as they say "shit happens".

 

[huntnful]

Here’s a good example at 540 yards. I was totally sheltered from the wind. But knew it had some good speed to it. I held 5” left of where I wanted the bullet to hit. And impact was about 3-4” further right than I’d planned. Came out right in the pocket of the opposite shoulder. Would have preferred it to be a little further forward. But none the less, it’s a big target with room for some wind error and he made it zero steps. Also, I think quartering away shots are more favorable than quartering too shots IMO.

Exit Side

 

[hereinaz]

Preferably the former. But I would honestly take both. See how much a .4 G7 bullet drifts at 3100fps with a quartering 8mph wind. Hold 5” right of the bullseye and its landing within that 10” span to the left, more than likely, despite any wind variances. Theres a fair bit of forgiveness at 500 yards honestly.

That’s a good point. The ballistics of the chosen tool matters.

Consider my choice, a .613 G1/.315 G7 BC at 3100 fps.

You can’t get much higher BC with minimal recoil pushing a 133 gr 25 cal Berger in a 10 pound rifle.

My confidence level is related to that. I know my choice buys me a bigger danger space and margin of error. Also assuming the position is solid and the wind isn’t gusting.

If you are shooting a 6.5 creedmoor, 7-08, .308, etc. then you’ve got less margin of error.

Math for math sake how I thought about my choice of caliber, bullet, and cartridge.

A wind call error of 3 mph full value wind is only 2.8 inches at 500 yards. A 4 mph error is 4.1 inches.

If my gun is a legit 1moa rifle in the field position, the vast majority are going to be within 3/4 moa, and half of them are going to be into the wind.

So, at 500 yards on a 10” target with a 1 moa rifle system including the shooter, let’s stack the error of widest lateral dispersion with the wind, which is only half MOA or 2.5 inches to the side of the aim point, plus a full 3 mph bad wind call of 2.8 inches. A .3 inch miss but the bullet is .257, so the miss is by half of .257- 3”. Yeah, it misses the plate by a hair. My point is that the wound channel of a Berger Elite Hunter is an inch or two into the hypothetical 10” vitals.

The odds of a hit with a 3mph wind error and 1 moa system are extremely high, by the math and the assumptions.

If you consider fully half of the shots will be into the wind from the aim point, then even a 4 mph error of 4.1 inches is still on the plate. A good portion of the misses of a 1 moa system are vertical as well, so you have another .9 inches with the dispersion of bullets into the wind.

For the number of shots under the bell curve of a 1 moa distribution, the animal with a 10” vital will still be dead with high probability, because only the misses with the wind will drift off the target.

Now, that’s just math, but that shows that it’s not impossible IF a shooter can zero the rifle and build a position, break the trigger cleanly, and manage recoil to keep dispersion to one moa in a solid field position.

This also shows, and I t’s been repeated here, if you are shooting your gun one MOA, you are killing. It’s practice you need in the field and in the heat of the moment.

 

[hereinaz]

All that math above is why @Ryan Avery convinced @robby denning to build a 6 UM. The 115 DTAC at 3300 and above is maximizing ballistics against recoil.

You can certainly buy a smaller margin of error, but the biggest error is still the shooter. So burn out a couple barrels.

Edited: should have said partly why, at least per the podcast…

 

[Flyjunky]

My level of precision capability offhand is probably 10 times or more worse than prone supported.

This is exactly the response I bring up when the topic of ethics of long range hunting comes up and/or weapon restrictions.

I’ll bet more animals are wounded when people are shooting offhand and/or at moving animals compared to “long range”. I’d take a person who practices shooting at distance over the avg hunter shooting offhand at a moving animal at 100+ yards.

To the original post, there is no such thing as 100% but under good conditions (wind, shooting position) I feel really good at 600. The only time I shoot less than 600 is during initial load dev.

 

[SouthPaw]

The cold bore challenge is coming. I hope to see you all there.....

I think for the 2024 CBC: in order to earn two additional shots, should be switched to one impact at 400-450, then one at 600 instead of back to back at 600. The number of first round misses at 600 last year was surprising, a bunch of data at 400-450 might be telling.

 

[ddowning]

For me a chip shot would have to be defined by a set of circumstances. Those would definitely include distance, but there are many other factors as well.

My daughter and I stalked from around 900 yards to around 225 yards to shoot a couple cull does after going 3 for 3 from 610-670 yards 2 days before and 2 for 2 around 450 yards the previous day. The difference was the wind hold at 670 was 0.3 mils and the wind hold at 225 was 0.9 mils. Much different conditions.

I will add that I can ring the 12" square target on the square range, cold bore from 800 yards with above 90% consistency. I like to go to the range to practice when conditions are harsh. I was not going to lay down and try to smack a deer at 900 yards with that kind of crosswind.

Most shots are not as easy as people claim. Most quick shots get away from me(not enough time to shoot)at over 300 yards while I'm trying to create a situation I'm comfortable with. From 300 to 500 I need even more time, but am confident in a variety of positions and conditions. Further than 500 and I want to be prone or in a very solid position with a lot of wind information and plenty of time to triple check the range to the target and everything around it. There are some scenarios where I can shoot faster or want to take longer. As I said, there are a lot more factors than just the range to the target.

 

[DangerRanger]

Depending on the model of chip, but Im comfortable that I can hit a Dorito at 100 yards prone

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

I think for the 2024 CBC: in order to earn two additional shots, should be switched to one impact at 400-450, then one at 600 instead of back to back at 600. The number of first round misses at 600 last year was surprising, a bunch of data at 400-450 might be telling.

I also like this idea.