Trials bike vs dirt bike/TW for hunting.

[Bluefish]

Trials bike are not pleasant to trail ride. Had one and tried it. Won’t do it again. The lack of seat is the big deal breaker.
those that recommend an xt, that bike is smaller than a dirt bike, but not much. Maybe 7/8 sized. Would still need to be lowered to fit. My wife rides ones and it’s a good trail bike.
maybe a crf230/250 or ttr 230 may work, but they are pretty heavy. Not sure why no one makes a light small trail bike. The technology is there.

 

[ID_Matt]

Between the seat, suspension an the gearing, a trials bike would suck for trying to go anywhere.

Grab a normal dirtbike like everybody else has. Lower it and shave the seat if you need to. Beta Xtrainer might be worth a look too

Agree. Beta Xtrainer would be a great compromise, they are fairly short to begin with and you can go even lower with a seat swap.

I went down the road of the big wheel bikes and felt they were extremely sketchy in single track. Hard to maneuver, big tires want to wonder and are bouncy. Then went to a honda crf230 - which is a great option as well as a ttr230. I now have a beta xtrainer and absolutely love that thing for hunting and trail riding. Extremely light with torquey but smooth power. Have brought out many elk quarters with it.

 

[ORJoe]

If you buy a trials bike despite everyone telling you not to, it's not the end of the world.
You use the trials bike to build your dirt riding skills, then you get a regular dirt bike and can do anything. Being only 5'6" doesn't matter because your new abilities will transcend the normal height rules of parking lot posers.
But that's definitely not the easy button of getting an elk out of the woods, it's the beginning of a years long process.

 

[nphunter]

As a fellow Tee-Dubber, would you maybe consider a few trail friendly modifications? It'll save you a good bit of cash & transform the bike.

1: Stiffer fork springs, balance the oil correctly & upgrade the rear spring.

2: Shitcan the Cycleracks rear rack & replace it with a Tusk. Stronger, more streamlined & just all around nicer. Trash the front rack entirely.

3: Switch out your (presumably) stock, 50 tooth rear sprocket for a 54 or 55 tooth. It'll make first gear useless on the road & bring your top speed down to around 45, but you'll be able to climb like a Spider Monkey on PCP.

4 If you're ok spending the money: Put a Shinko 241 tire up front to replace that heavy, uneven tread MotoX number. Do a trailer wheel conversion at the back. That opens up an entire world of 12" ATV tires with a far more suitable tread.

All said, that's going to run you about a grand. $500 of that is the rear wheel conversion.
However, you will be literally floored by how much better the bike is at handling single track, mud, rock, off-trail, snow & sand. The rear wheel alone inspires 100% more confidence.

I used to ride competitive technical trials back in England & I honestly couldn't imagine a worse bike for carrying any kind of load.

The TW has low gears and an upgraded rear spring. Don't really want to dump another grand into the bike, it's not like it's a bad bike, it does great off road, on road and across country with no road or trail but when I get on technical single-track stuff or anything I need to be nimble on it sucks. It has done ok over the last 6 years I've owned it and I've probably put close to 1K miles on it. When i put saddle bags on the bike and offload my gear onto the bike it make it 10X worse to ride than if I just put the gear in my pack and ride with it on my back.

 

[nphunter]

I’ve had a montessa trials bike with a seat! Would work great for what you are describing and surprisingly enough they’ll do 50+ on a gravel road.
I also had beta 200 with tank and seat kit that I actually liked better than the montessa.

I found a guy with a Montesa that will trade me straight across, it's super clean and he just uses it to dink around on and has a big KTM enduro for cross-country riding. He wasn't the TW for something to legally drive around town on. The Montesa was $8000 new and the TW was $3500 new, the trade seems like a pretty good deal to me. I like the idea of a fuel-injected four-stroke for torque and ease of maintenance compared to a two-stroke, it will also make hauling spare gas and borrowing gas easier.

I think I could probably sell the Montesa for more than the TW if I decided I wasn't something different.

 

[nphunter]

How much seat time do you have on the TW? I loved my KTM 350 for single track riding, but I did not like it for hunting. I preferred the low gearing of the TW and the racks for strapping quarters too. Its a different style of riding, slower, lower to the ground, sometimes you walk it over obstacles, it can get annoying. The end goal is to keep the weight off your back.

You also could look at an older WR or XR that has a larger frame, motor, and the ability to add a rear rack.

I've had 4 TW's, I've probably put 1K miles on this one. Grew up as a kid on bikes but rode in more open terrain and race tracks. I actually prefer having the weight strapped to my back and not on the bike, I'd rather make a couple of trips with a lighter pack than try to slap a couple of hundred lbs of meat on motorcycle racks.

I just feel like when I'm in areas where dirt bike only the TW is too clunky, an old Trail 90 would be OK but they have like zero suspension or ground clearance, I actually just sold a couple of those as well. On regular 2 tracks or mountain roads the TW is great, but in those areas I don't really need a bike.

 

[Blockcaver]

I've owned two Honda TL250 trials bikes (1975 and '76 models) and a TL200 (mid '80's model?). The TL250s had a magnesium 4-stroke engine and weighed 212# dry weight as I remember them. I used them for access to hunt CO sheep and mulies on old mining roads in the high country. Also to bait spring bears when the back roads were still soft an muddy. Worked pretty well for me.

Pluses:
---Low seat height so you could put a foot down in any terrain. Huge deal vs a later Honda XR250R that I owned for a few years.
---Light weight to muscle it around, load in the truck, maneuver it, etc
---Great low gearing to ride on the old grown in mine roads, maneuver around boulder and rock slides, climb steep grades safely.
---Great fuel economy
---Very quiet muffler
---Extremely reliable, never did anything more than change the oil and clean the air filter on any of them
---Adequate suspension for my purposes...low speed riding
---No depreciation on any of them between purchase and sale years later

Minuses:
---Poor seat
---Small Tank
---No rack
---No lights...had to add them
---Parts availability as they got older (26 years old in the case of my last TL250).

I'd get the trials bike for what you want to do with it. I took a few minute ride on a fat tired Yamaha 200 once back in '95 that belonged to a bowhunter from Idaho that I was camped near in NV. It handled "terrible" compared to what I was used to...almost dumped it right away. Took them off my list of what I ever would own.

Oh, and that Honda TL200 from the 80's was a very poor imitation of a trials bike vs the Honda TL250s. Heavy and underpowered in my experience.

 

[MaraviaDave]

4 If you're ok spending the money: Put a Shinko 241 tire up front to replace that heavy, uneven tread MotoX number. Do a trailer wheel conversion at the back. That opens up an entire world of 12" ATV tires with a far more suitable tread.

All said, that's going to run you about a grand. $500 of that is the rear wheel conversion.
However, you will be literally floored by how much better the bike is at handling single track, mud, rock, off-trail, snow & sand. The rear wheel alone inspires 100% more confidence.

Another TW’er here.

OP - Here’s a link to an ATV rear wheel conversion. Which may be similar to what robtattoo was mentioning. Check it out, along with all of the other TW products. Give BPP a call….he’s a good dude, who’s willing to discuss the pros/cons for all of his TW mod products.

Yamaha TW200 ATV Fat Tire Conversion Kit with 25" tire and 12" wheel | bradley performance

This PATENT PENDINGkit converts your TW200 into a mountain goat! Massive traction! No tubes! No spokes! Features: More traction. More Flex. More tire choices. Allows the use of a common, spoke free, tubeless, ATV wheel and tire. No more demounting to fix a flat. Over 10 years of testing...

www.bradleyperformanceproducts.net

I’d recommend getting a 60-tooth rear sprocket.

 

[nphunter]

Been a while since you were on a 2stroke eh?

Yes, 20 years, I've never been on any fuel-injected 2 strokes except snowmobiles. I assume most of the used market is going to be carburated bikes. Not really looking to spend a bunch of money on a brand-new bike. The TW is worth about $3500 bucks so that is what I would have to spend to upgrade.

 

[Pacific_Fork]

This is why ATVs are superior in just about every way. Single track trails mean go for a hik for me. I’ve thought about a TW but the highway speed is lame and bigger bikes are sketchy on a lot of trails unless you’re an expert rider.

 

[nphunter]

This is why ATVs are superior in just about every way. Single track trails mean go for a hik for me. I’ve thought about a TW but the highway speed is lame and bigger bikes are sketchy on a lot of trails unless you’re an expert rider.

Been there and done that. I have zero use for an ATV or UTV, I can take my Tacoma 99% of the places I can legally take an ATV around here. The areas I’m worried about taking a bike an ATV would be upside down in short order, they are literally single track trails in shitty steep terrain.

The only place I’d want an ATV is if it had tracks for shed hunting.

I walk plenty already, there are places I can take a bike and easily get 10+ miles deeper than any other motorized vehicle. Then put miles on boots from there, a lot of times we just use them to get to camp and then hunt from there. 95% of my hunting is done on foot, there are places though where a bike can get you away from people.

 

[Pacific_Fork]

Been there and done that. I have zero use for an ATV or UTV, I can take my Tacoma 99% of the places I can legally take an ATV around here. The areas I’m worried about taking a bike an ATV would be upside down in short order, they are literally single track trails in shitty steep terrain.

The only place I’d want an ATV is if it had tracks for shed hunting.

I walk plenty already, there are places I can take a bike and easily get 10+ miles deeper than any other motorized vehicle. Then put miles on boots from there, a lot of times we just use them to get to camp and then hunt from there. 95% of my hunting is done on foot, there are places though where a bike can get you away from people.

Yea I get it, to each their own. Terrain that will turn an ATV upside down makes me cringe at the thought of hauling an elk off that same mountain on a dirt bike though. You must have giant cojones

 

[IdahoElk]

I’ve had a montessa trials bike with a seat! Would work great for what you are describing and surprisingly enough they’ll do 50+ on a gravel road.
I also had beta 200 with tank and seat kit that I actually liked better than the montessa.

You rode a trials bike 50+mph?

 

[akcabin]

Be nice if I knew you a TW was

 

[Baddog]

Yep. It’s clear that most replying in this thread have never actually owned a trials bike or spent any time on one. I’ve had a trials bike or two in the garage for the last 20 years and have put a lot of time on them riding and exploring as well as competing on them.

 

[Baddog]

At 5’6” that the op is a montessa/trials bike with a seat is a very good option in my opinion having owned one.

 

[jimh406]

I used to ride trails a lot. Occasionally, one of our friends would bring his trials bike. He could navigate the same trails, but they aren't really made to ride long distances and don't have a seat or any place to add a luggage rack. Maybe you want to stand up the entire time and ride with a pack so that won't matter.

I'd buy a small (250) or so street legal dual sport with electric start. 4 strokes are notorious for being hard to start hot (as in after tipping over). Pushing a button is easier than kicking. 250 instead of something larger because the extra weight of a 350-400 is not your friend when you need to pick it up/move it. Sure, the larger displacement engines have a lot more power. You'll probably need to upgrade the tires to something with more traction.

I loved riding trails with a KDX 2 stroke, but the advantage of being able to ride forest service roads legally is well worth going 4 stroke unless you can make the KDX street legal, too.

Btw, softer springs or backing out the compression can make it easier to get on even if you are 5'6".

 

[IdahoElk]

Currently I use a Scorpa Trials bike but if I was starting out today, I'd go electric.

 

[nphunter]

Currently I use a Scorpa Trials bike but if I was starting out today, I'd go electric.

Those electric bikes look awesome, the range would be fine for most stuff but the recharging is an issue. I'm doing a hunt down by Nevada next fall and have to pack fuel for my truck. The bike will only be used for 10 - 20 miles each day but the ability to refill the bike when spending a week down there is a must.

I've always thought the same for electric vehicles, they would be awesome if you could just get to camp and set up a solar charger to top them off. I think with a sprinter or decent-sized enclosed trailer a person could build a pretty sweet solar charging station and electric motorbikes would be awesome. If you could set up a decent-sized battery bank to use for charging at night it would be great and the panels could just recharge the bank every day while you go hunting or riding.

 

[jimh406]

The only problem with electrics is range, and range that is affected by temperature.