Trials bike vs dirt bike/TW for hunting.

[squid-freshprints]

Yep. It’s clear that most replying in this thread have never actually owned a trials bike or spent any time on one. I’ve had a trials bike or two in the garage for the last 20 years and have put a lot of time on them riding and exploring as well as competing on them.

Much respect, anyone who has been riding trials bikes for 20 yrs. is better than me on a dirt bike. I don't think I need trails bike experience though to know I get can everywhere, for a full day, on my dual sport, plus highway between trails, plus store runs and such. If I hunted anywhere that you could do off trail climbs, where others had not, legally, then a trials bike would be a dream for saving energy. Just having a hard time seeing the utility of one as your one hunting rig. perhaps cost? Quiet? Still I'm jealous of those who have one, looks fun!

 

[COLD SMOKE]

I got a heavily modded wr250 it’s a nice dual sport that will do easy to slightly harder trails. It’s not a dirt bike by any means. But you could modify it for hunting and get pretty far back.

I run street legal tires on it but the harder DOT compound doesn’t hook up like proper tires( Dunlop 606 rear/ pirelli mt21 front is my combo that is a dual sport standard )

As soon as it gets technical steep or rutted your SOL. If you put dirt tires on it would go a lot further.

I’d get a 2023 Yamaha YZ 250 FX for a more ripper bike. Blue has always been reliable for me and new it’s 10k ish

DRZ 400 for a cheaper alternative
KDX220 for a fixer upper if your really in a budget

I’ve never ridden a ktm 350 but would like to and from what I’ve heard are pretty much the pinnacle.

Post what you get

 

[IdahoElk]

Those electric bikes look awesome, the range would be fine for most stuff but the recharging is an issue. I'm doing a hunt down by Nevada next fall and have to pack fuel for my truck. The bike will only be used for 10 - 20 miles each day but the ability to refill the bike when spending a week down there is a must.

I've always thought the same for electric vehicles, they would be awesome if you could just get to camp and set up a solar charger to top them off. I think with a sprinter or decent-sized enclosed trailer a person could build a pretty sweet solar charging station and electric motorbikes would be awesome. If you could set up a decent-sized battery bank to use for charging at night it would be great and the panels could just recharge the bank every day while you go hunting or riding.

Pretty sure I read that the bike in the video gets 40-60 real world single track miles which is quite a bit but still not enough for a week of off the grid use.

 

[COLD SMOKE]

What about running trials tires on a trail bike? Seems like it could be a lot of fun.

Wr250f with some dunlop D803gp trials spooned on

 

[jowens]

It depends on your needs.

10 miles in a day on a trials bike is doable, 20 would be a stretch standing full time.

You will need to carry fuel, a spare front tube + spoons, and a plug kit + co2 air. Riding a flat trials tire is way worse than a flat knobby.

If you plan to run high speeds (30 mph +) I would be weary of it on a trials bike. They will do it, but their suspension and rake angle aren’t made for it which make them unstable at those speeds and things can get out of hand quickly. Your tw will make the trials bike look like a fork lift at speeds mentioned.

For getting into the gnarly places, there isn’t anything better. A trials bike will make your TW look like a forklift when the going gets rough and take you up/down/over things that most folks won’t walk over on foot (if you have the skill.)

My riding Background

I’ve ridden dirt bikes for 25 years, 3 years of that were solely extreme enduro.

I’ve ridden trials since 2018 and now no longer own anything but a trials bike.

I owned a 2016 montesa for 4 years. Sold it this year and went to a Beta (the beta is a better bike for me, riding observed trials……I would still own the montesa if I was hunting on it.)

The montesa is 100 percent the correct trials bike for you. They are bullet proof, run at any elevation due to efi, start easily. Their long ride seat kit is the best I’ve seen (had it on mine when I used it for trail riding.)

What would I pick? To burn up fire roads and hike in I would pick the Tw. To run slow in the fire roads and get into gnarly places without hiking I would choose the trials bike. All depends on what you want to do with it.

Ps, the montesa is worth more than your TW.

 

[nphunter]

It depends on your needs.

10 miles in a day on a trials bike is doable, 20 would be a stretch standing full time.

You will need to carry fuel, a spare front tube + spoons, and a plug kit + co2 air. Riding a flat trials tire is way worse than a flat knobby.

If you plan to run high speeds (30 mph +) I would be weary of it on a trials bike. They will do it, but their suspension and rake angle aren’t made for it which make them unstable at those speeds and things can get out of hand quickly. Your tw will make the trials bike look like a fork lift at speeds mentioned.

For getting into the gnarly places, there isn’t anything better. A trials bike will make your TW look like a forklift when the going gets rough and take you up/down/over things that most folks won’t walk over on foot (if you have the skill.)

My riding Background

I’ve ridden dirt bikes for 25 years, 3 years of that were solely extreme enduro.

I’ve ridden trials since 2018 and now no longer own anything but a trials bike.

I owned a 2016 montesa for 4 years. Sold it this year and went to a Beta (the beta is a better bike for me, riding observed trials……I would still own the montesa if I was hunting on it.)

The montesa is 100 percent the correct trials bike for you. They are bullet proof, run at any elevation due to efi, start easily. Their long ride seat kit is the best I’ve seen (had it on mine when I used it for trail riding.)

What would I pick? To burn up fire roads and hike in I would pick the Tw. To run slow in the fire roads and get into gnarly places without hiking I would choose the trials bike. All depends on what you want to do with it.

Ps, the montesa is worth more than your TW.

Thanks, I’m going to make the trade. I think I’ll probably pick up a trail seat, it would be a good place to store a tire repair kit too. I’ve seen some handlebar mounted fuel tanks too which would be nice for a reserve. I doubt I’d ever do 20 miles at one time. Maybe a few, stop and glass or hunt and then continue on for a total of 20 in a long summer day.

 

[TheGDog]

Doing it on an actual Trials Bike?... No Way... would not be comfortable to you at all, very early on. With a pack on too?. No way.

You're going to need a more traditional dirt bike seating position. Where you can lock your knees onto the tank decently (todays modern bike geometries offer less of this in many instances, so guy put skater tape on the frame rails or radiator guards for more traction against your leathers ("racing pants")).

Just ditch those wide style tires. And you if you purchase a full on Enduro machine, you might even want to look for ones that for instance make use of a slightly heavier flywheel, so the power can come on less violently for more tight/technical riding being made easier, harder to stall the engine out when lugging it or creeping in slow-going. Also research getting one with a Rekkluse Clutch system installed in it. Supposed to be harder to kill the engine, lighter clutch pull too, if I recall.

 

[TheGDog]

Thanks, I’m going to make the trade. I think I’ll probably pick up a trail seat, it would be a good place to store a tire repair kit too. I’ve seen some handlebar mounted fuel tanks too which would be nice for a reserve. I doubt I’d ever do 20 miles at one time. Maybe a few, stop and glass or hunt and then continue on for a total of 20 in a long summer day.

Try to avoid mounting anything on the bar/front-forks if you can help it. It'll affect steering characteristics negatively to varying degrees. Plus in case of crash/fall, might not want gas showered on ya. They make rear pannier systems, and some have neat custom made gas container systems, for the ADV rider guys.

In fact.. all you guys considering hunting from moto could probably benefit from seeing the varying range of motos chosen by those guys and how the set them up. For your needs would be very similar. (On the lighter, more like Enduro model or Dual Sport model side of the fence... not the guys with windshields and all that side of that ADV fence.)

 

[TheGDog]

OH.. Important!!.. if you get a DualSport, with an Electric Start!!...

You gotta make sure to get ahold of the ignition switch schematics and study them! That way.. if you have a fall that bashes the ignition switch... if you had to.. you could splice the wires to bypass a broken switch and be able to start your bike again.

Otherwise without that knowledge of how to splice the connections back together, you won't be able to start it back up and get out of there. Even if you could attempt a Bump-Start, with the switch busted.. you need to make that electrical connection that your ignition switch can disable when you turn turn your key and remove it. Otherwise, you're dead in the water.

An Important extra detail you need to know when it's a DualSport bike with a keyed ignition.

 

[Bluefish]

What about running trials tires on a trail bike? Seems like it could be a lot of fun.

Wr250f with some dunlop D803gp trials spooned on

They do work well depending on how and where you ride. They don’t like to be spun, so in sand you have to let off, let the tire hook up, then feed power slowly. If you ride it like a knobby and spin the tire it won’t work.

 

[TheGDog]

Also... lotta DualSports don't initially come from the showroom floors with RimLock on them to lock the tire to the rim. If you're plan is offroading it significantly... You'll need to get rimlocks too.. otherwise in a set of whoops OR in rocky terrain there's a chance the tire might slip within the rim and your inner tube valve stem gets cut by the whole thru the rim.

Only down side to having rimlocks mounted on your DualSport bike is that it'll headshake up and down when droning at speed on street/hwy. But ya just gotta have em if pushing it at all offroad. Also they allow you to elect to air-down if needing, since it still locks the tire bead to the rim.

 

[nphunter]

Well I made the trade for the Montesa 4RT, it’s in great shape, was never a competition bike, I traded it to a guy who used it very little to run out game trails. He bought it from an older guy who bought it new.

It starts first or second kick and is a blast to ride around the property. 1-3 are very low geared and it will pull up the front tire on demand with just a little throttle. 4-5 are higher and it will go as fast as the TW easily and is probably more road worthy than the TW with the big knobby i had on the front side down. It has a brand new front knobby tire, I’m considering ditching it for a trials tire, my only concern is running on a flat. I know the trials tires are better tires and it has a rim lock.

I found a great deal on a like new trail tank/ seat for it and ordered oversized foot pegs since I will be riding in hiking shoes or light boots. It also has new heated grips and pro taper style bars and brush guards.

Next things on the list, fuel can for under the seat, I’ll be able to carry about 1.5l that will essentially double my mileage. The previous owner said he could do about 40 miles on a tank. I might also buy narrower bars, the ones on it seem wide to me. I’m also planning on buying a headlight of some sort. The previous owner said they ride regular dirt bikes a lot at night and just use a good headlamp? I also want to buy an open face helmet to make ridding around and seeing what I’m doing easier. After that just practice with the bike, I have a couple acres and have ridden it a couple times now in the field. I can easily drive up to my creek which is like 15” wide and over a foot deep and with a little throttle I can pickup the front tire and wheelie across it. I’ll probably toss out some RR ties and mess around with going over them like downed logs.

I can already tell this bike will the 10 times better than the TW in the woods. I’ve only had it a couple days and would already feel comfortable taking places where I wouldn’t have dared taking the heavy TW. I can’t believe the build quality of this thing compared to the TW, billet everything, tubeless rear tire, and just very neat and tidy, the fuel injected 4 stroke runs so much better than the old 1988 200 the TW has been using forever.

The guy who got my TW couldn’t believe that it still had drum brakes in 2009. It was a little sad saying goodbye to the TW since my kids grew up ridding on the back checking trail cams. They are too big to ride double on it and honestly, it’s has too shitty of a suspension to safely ride double with the wife anyway, unless it's just running to the gas station here in town. I’m going to keep my eye out for another good deal on another or maybe a TTR or something for the wife just incase she wants to go mess around.

This bike is about 160lbs dry and will be under 170lbs with the seat kit.


Here is a pic of the seat kit I’m getting.

 

[COLD SMOKE]

Nice write up and looks like fun bike..
In regards to open face helmet

ScorpionEXO

www.scorpionusa.com

I use EXO-AT960
It’s modular so the chin bar flips up. You can ride open face at low speeds with sunglasses on, or have a closed face helmet.


Not sure it’s applicable for you as the trials bike is primarily low speed and just having an open face might be easier.
I use mine for dual sport and it’s been a good helmet..

As far as off road lighting

Check out these

Lookos Evo - Headlight Red and Black with Battery

LED motorcycle headlight with solar panel and battery included. Long-lasting, fast-charging battery. Adapt your Motocross or Cross-Country motorbike to Enduro with Lookos Evo.

www.polisport.com

Has a solar panel attached and a lithium battery, I haven’t used them but was curious about how bright they would be. Could be a solution that is easy and gives a little extra light if your getting back late.

Congrats on the bike

 

[prm]

OH.. Important!!.. if you get a DualSport, with an Electric Start!!...

You gotta make sure to get ahold of the ignition switch schematics and study them! That way.. if you have a fall that bashes the ignition switch... if you had to.. you could splice the wires to bypass a broken switch and be able to start your bike again.

Otherwise without that knowledge of how to splice the connections back together, you won't be able to start it back up and get out of there. Even if you could attempt a Bump-Start, with the switch busted.. you need to make that electrical connection that your ignition switch can disable when you turn turn your key and remove it. Otherwise, you're dead in the water.

An Important extra detail you need to know when it's a DualSport bike with a keyed ignition.

True!

Factory motocross bikes have an additional start button hidden in a safe spot.

 

[nphunter]

Nice write up and looks like fun bike..
In regards to open face helmet

ScorpionEXO

www.scorpionusa.com

I use EXO-AT960
It’s modular so the chin bar flips up. You can ride open face at low speeds with sunglasses on, or have a closed face helmet.


Not sure it’s applicable for you as the trials bike is primarily low speed and just having an open face might be easier.
I use mine for dual sport and it’s been a good helmet..

As far as off road lighting

Check out these

Lookos Evo - Headlight Red and Black with Battery

LED motorcycle headlight with solar panel and battery included. Long-lasting, fast-charging battery. Adapt your Motocross or Cross-Country motorbike to Enduro with Lookos Evo.

www.polisport.com

Has a solar panel attached and a lithium battery, I haven’t used them but was curious about how bright they would be. Could be a solution that is easy and gives a little extra light if your getting back late.

Congrats on the bike

That looks like a nice helmet, but I’ll probably just end up with a cheap light one I don’t have to worry about when leaving it in the woods. I have a couple nice full face helmets I’ve always worn. However riding around my grass field at home with no helmet is so much easier on this bike, it think a light open face will be great. If I do along of road riding at speed I can just wear my full face.

Some of the 4RT’s has a factory headlight ran off if the stator. I think I’ll just end up with a cheap LED unit similar to what you have above and splice it into the harness with the hot grips, maybe in place of the hot grips. I’m not sure a person would ever need them in a bike with hand guards and riding gloves, I’ve never felt the need for them in the past.

 

[nphunter]

True!

Factory motocross bikes have an additional start button hidden in a safe spot.

Not a worry with this bike it only has a kill
switch.

 

[TheGDog]

Highly recommend you continue to rock a Full-Face Helmet.

Rocks don't care how fast you were going.

 

[nphunter]

Highly recommend you continue to rock a Full-Face Helmet.

Rocks don't care how fast you were going.

Thinking of going to a downhill full face bicycle helmet. I doubt I will be going as fast as a downhill bike and am probably a lot less likely to crash? Seems like a good lightweight option although not DOT.

 

[TheGDog]

Thinking of going to a downhill full face bicycle helmet. I doubt I will be going as fast as a downhill bike and am probably a lot less likely to crash? Seems like a good lightweight option although not DOT.

It's lighter because it's meant to deal with speeds less than motos are capable of. Should be fine for most trail riding though I'd imagine.

You want to look for a helmet where where vents can be closed/shut/plugged when needed for the cold vs hot.

 

[nphunter]

I bought a TW200 this year for hunting and used it with a full pack on some ATV trails and two tracks. IMO the TW didn't have sufficient torque when I was going up steep inclines in 1st gear to feel safe. I couldn't imagine using it with gear and an elk quarter. I currently have it on FB marketplace and plan on getting a fuel injected ATV for the future.

View attachment 633758

That was a major downfall, power to weight was horrible, and I was geared way down on my TW. Even geared down and going up a long steep section the TW would stall out because I would constantly be going from 2-3rd gear, 2nd was too low with my gearing and 3rd it would run out of steam. I'm talking about a 2 track with some ruts and steep sections not necessarily down a road. I had mine so low geared you could walk beside it in first gear which almost made it unusable.

On single-track stuff it would stall out frequently or I'd have to make high rev movements using a lot of clutch. I'm definitely glad to be rid of the bike, ATV's are nice but in the areas I hunt I can pretty much take my pickup everywhere an ATV will go legally and places that have a lot of single track bikes are awesome!