High end, high cost optics... Why should I buy?

[TheGDog]

Why? Ask your opthalmologist... everybody is losing their eye-sight earlier and earlier these days... because we are subjecting them to eye strain from computer terminals and most of all... the evil smart phone small screen.

Consider that kick-butt optic an investment in you.. in yourself.... in your health.

From someone whose vision has taken a nose-dive upon turning and just passing the 50yo mark... if you know you're going to be abusing your eyes by looking thru the binos a ton... OR.. abusing your eyes by looking at screens a ton <which is me... a coder>, and chances are this statement holds true for most of us... then seriously consider to begin budgeting for the top-tier glass. It's just soo nice to use high-grade tools. I find it always seems to be the case that you end up asking yourself "OMG, Why did I wait soo long before getting this!? It's soo much easier with this!" regardless what kind of tool it is we're talking about, right?

EDIT: How about this... when you're using that top-tier glass... um.. it's kinda like the "bino" part melts away. In other words because there is this amazing image that is very forgiving in terms of your angle of view and distance from the eyepiece lenses... it's kinda like ya almost don't pay attention or notice so much the bino being in-between in the chain between you and the thing you're looking at. If that makes any sense. The depth-of-field improvement is the biggest thing that to me felt jaw-dropping in improvement. I've got some lower-middle tier 15's, and if the object is within it's more narrow depth-of-field and in focus... while not exactly the same, the definition on that focused object is still really good. But what about when the area you're panning over and gridding is more horizontal? That much longer depth of field is saving you a bunch of TIME! For right away you can see well enough thru all of the area that falls within that depth of field that you can feel very confident that you don't see anything there, and can move along now. Whereas with that mid-tier glass 15's... what I'm pointed at looks amazing... but to know for sure that there is nothing in the area behind it and in front of it a bit, it will require a small amount of fiddling with the focus wheel to confirm. Hope this makes sense. Since I very recently did a side-by-side comparison of my new-to-me ZEISS Conquest HD 10x42 vs Vortex Vultures 15x56... the visuals of that experience are still fresh in my mind. I realistically don't see me wanting/needing to bring along that particular 15x56 much anymore except for maybe in the most Open Country DesertHills type of terrain where the distances are significant. Where you can get up high a bit and then REALLY have an unimpeded FOV that reaches down for several miles in wide arc in all directions.

For example... the very first thought I had after the side-by-side comparison was..."Wow... OMG... What in the heck must it look like looking thru a Top-Tier set of 15's!!!" I was excited and bummed out at the same time because I knew right then I'd always be bummed from now on whenever I look thru the vultures.... just because I'm missing those last little degrees of change that payoff important dividends.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

I know this topic has been discussed many times, but I'm still not convinced.

I have tested many different grades of optics (binoculars, spotting scopes, rifle scopes, rangefinders, etc.). I honestly don't see a big difference between most of them. I fully admit that a $3000 piece of glass is nice to look through, and they do excel somewhat in certain circumstances, like when glassing for extended periods of time and in the lowest light conditions. But compared to the much more affordable mid-grade average consumer glass, I'm hard pressed to understand why I should spend 10 times more! Expensive glass is nice, but not 10 times nicer (at least not to my eye), and I honestly don't think it would help me spot 10 times more game in the field, or be 10 times more successful, or shoot 10 times more accurately, or help me get 10 times more enjoyment from my hunts. Maybe it makes people feel 10 times better about themselves, proud that they never settle for anything less than the best. I don't know...

Price is not really the issue to me. I can afford high grade stuff, but rarely choose to spend my money that way, because I can't justify it. If I could see a truly valid reason to do it then I would. But as long as I avoid the really low end junk, I find the decent quality mid-grade optics to be completely acceptable and usable. What more do I need?

I understand the "buy once, cry once" mentality. But I would rather buy once and not have to cry at all. I do not understand the "spend as much as you can afford" mentality because I feel it's more of a lame excuse to just spend way more than is necessary, and convince yourself that it must somehow be worth it. I have never regretted spending WAY less to get something ALMOST as good.

Feel free to try convincing me otherwise...

Once you hit Vortex Viper HD Leupold Pro Guide HD territory, it takes large dollar increases to obtain small incremental increases in glass quality. Will you notice a material difference between a $600 pair of binos and a $2000 pair of binos during daylight? Probably not. Low light or poor lighting conditions is where you notice it.

There is an awesome youtube video where some glass geeks talk about and compare the Large Vortex Viper HD and Razor HD spotters. There conclusion is what lead me to go with the Viper HD spotter and I have been very pleased, and honestly can’t tell the difference even in low light conditions.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

I would say if your hunting style is glassing intensive, $300 probably isn´t the price point to compare to $3k.

The argument becomes difficult when you´re talking about something like a Meostar HD vs something that costs 2 or 3x as much.

It seems like the offerings around the $1k price point consistently get mentioned as the best actual value in binos. I can´t imagine too many guys really need more than a Monarch HG or a Meostar HD. If a guy or gal was frugal but wanted good glass, that´s what I´d recommend. There´s nothing wrong with buying top tier, and it comes with the real benefit of having the confidence that there isn´t anything to upgrade to.

If you´re using 12x Vortex Diamondbacks for 4 hours you might get a headache. I´ve pulled some loooong glassing sessions with 12x50 Meostars. I haven´t had the pleasure of sitting behind the 12x50 EL, but I just can´t realistically imagine it´s radically different. If the Meostars give you a headache, I don´t know that a pair of binos costing $3k is going to fix it. You might just want to buy some advil.

All $1k binos are not created equal. I tried the 12x50 Razors before the Meostars because they were significantly lighter. I couldn´t deal with the CA. CA is basically non-existent in the Meostar.

Have you looked through the new diamondback HD binos? My buddy picked up a pair of 12x50’s and I was blown away at how good they were.

 

[Stubborn_bowhunter]

I've found a lot of animals over the years with cheap 10x42s.

Makes me shudder to think of all the stuff I missed though. Someday soon I'll get expensive 15s. And I won't regret it. Have actually thought about selling one of my cars to get them.

Days in the field and hunting style is my primary thought. If I spend 100 days in the field every year. That's worth it to me to have top quality gear.

If I only did a couple hunts, or only hunted if I drew limited entry tags then it'd make sense not to invest so much.

 

[sunooastspotter]

I shop for value, like you I usually don't have a budget but don't like paying for little benefit. With regards to scopes, I cheaper out and got a Vortex Viper 82HD and was frustrated by the clarity when I couldnt really see my target holes at 300yrds. Should have dropped an extra and got a mid range.

 

[LeaveMeHangin]

I shop for value, like you I usually don't have a budget but don't like paying for little benefit. With regards to scopes, I cheaper out and got a Vortex Viper 82HD and was frustrated by the clarity when I couldnt really see my target holes at 300yrds. Should have dropped an extra and got a mid range.

A Vortex Viper isn't considered a "mid range"?

 

[sunooastspotter]

A Vortex Viper isn't considered a "mid range"?

Maybe in price but not in quality IMO

 

[Hoodie]

Have you looked through the new diamondback HD binos? My buddy picked up a pair of 12x50’s and I was blown away at how good they were.

No I haven´t. Iḿ honestly not too surprised. They have dielectric coatings and ED glass. A lot of stuff in that price range does these days.

I´ve got a $400 bino right now that´s as good (to me) overall as my Monarch HG, better in some regards. Just like the stuff at $1k is close to what you get for 2-3x as much, the $500 stuff these days is damn close to the $1k stuff.

I totally agree with you that the $500 range is the point where performance gains really start to taper off. If a guy was really serious about spot and stalk hunting but on a budget, a Leupold BX-4 would probably serve him fine for a long time. Hell Maven C series glass is amazing and it´s even cheaper. It´s a good time to be a consumer in the bino market.

 

[S.Clancy]

An example. I have never owned anything more than entry level binos until the last year. I owned the original Diamondback 10x42 (Japan made) and decided to purchase some Kaibab 18x56 to pick apart country. These were well ahead of the Diamondbacks and worked great. In the last month I bought a pair of Meopta Meostar 10x42 HDs, what many consider just a shade below the true "alpha" glass.

Using both the Meopta and Kaibab off a tripod in AZ last week it wasn't even close. I already sold the Kaibab's. I could spot more deer and determine size as well with the Meopta 10x vs the 18x, which is ridiculous. That is just my experience tho.

 

[LeaveMeHangin]

...I just got a $400 pair of binos that performs every bit as well as a MIJ Razor. Probably better. I'd have a damn hard time telling a difference between it and a Meostar or Monarch HG. It controls CA better than the Nikon...

What brand/model are the $400 binos you mentioned here?

 

[wnelson14]

On a hunt I sit behind a tripod for 8 hrs a day looking for tiny grey critters that live in big grey rocks. You couldn't pry my Swaro ELs out of my hands unless you were handing me NLs. All i know is that if i ever decide to upgrade, i'll lose alot less $, if anything, when i sell mine vs Joe Vortex upgrading his. Guys bitch about $2500 optics, the single most important hunting gear you have, then think nothing of losing their ass $ wise on a new truck with all the bells and whistles. Different strokes i guess.

If you don't like to glass a lot just get a $300 pair and be done with it. More deer for me

I agree a $2500 optics is only a minimal amount per month and if you have it for years it’s well worth it, buy once cry once.

 

[jhoward8821]

Has Meostar been around long? Also is there any type of warranty? I’ve read good things about them but haven’t ever seen a pair


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[Hoodie]

An example. I have never owned anything more than entry level binos until the last year. I owned the original Diamondback 10x42 (Japan made) and decided to purchase some Kaibab 18x56 to pick apart country. These were well ahead of the Diamondbacks and worked great. In the last month I bought a pair of Meopta Meostar 10x42 HDs, what many consider just a shade below the true "alpha" glass.

Using both the Meopta and Kaibab off a tripod in AZ last week it wasn't even close. I already sold the Kaibab's. I could spot more deer and determine size as well with the Meopta 10x vs the 18x, which is ridiculous. That is just my experience tho.

This was basically my experience with the Kaibabs.

I had the 15x56 and traded them out for 12x50 Meostar HDs. Night and day difference to me. I tend to like 12x50 better than 15x56 in general. The FOV and exit pupil trump the extra 3x for me. In this case the difference in glass quality was evident.

Based on my experience with the 15x I imagine the 18x56 were pretty dark and picky about eye position.

I´ve owned the Viper HD and two Japan made Razors. Having tried other stuff now I don´t think Vortex binos are bad necessarily, but in my experience there´s almost always something better in the same price range. The Maven C series is better than the Viper to my eyes, and I think the Nikon Monarch HG and Meostar are both better than the Razor HD.

 

[Hoodie]

Has Meostar been around long? Also is there any type of warranty? I’ve read good things about them but haven’t ever seen a pair


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Meopta´s been around since 1933. They have a lifetime transferable warranty for any North American customers.

The Meostar is their top end bino model. Really good glass for the money.

 

[Hoodie]

What brand/model are the $400 binos you mentioned here?

Theron Questa HD-ED. Found out about them on Birdforum. They´re definitely the best $500 range bino I´ve looked through.

They have field flatteners, which is pretty unusual at that price range. Iḿ pretty sure the only other comparably priced bino currently in production that has them is the Athlon Cronus. Field flatteners make them very sharp edge to edge, which is one of the common complaints about most non-alpha binos.

I´d say they´re pretty comparable to the Japan made Razors. They control CA better than the Nikon so far as I can tell. To be fair, CA control is pretty much the only thing I think you can ding the Monarch HG on. They´re a super good bino for $1k.

On a money saving note, Nikon sells refurb Monarch HGs for $699.99 when they have them. Occasionally theyĺl put those refurbs on sale for 20% off.

Thanks to a tip from a guy on here I got mine for $560. I don´t know that you can get much more bang for buck than that.

 

[S.Clancy]

This was basically my experience with the Kaibabs.

I had the 15x56 and traded them out for 12x50 Meostar HDs. Night and day difference to me. I tend to like 12x50 better than 15x56 in general. The FOV and exit pupil trump the extra 3x for me. In this case the difference in glass quality was evident.

Based on my experience with the 15x I imagine the 18x56 were pretty dark and picky about eye position.

I´ve owned the Viper HD and two Japan made Razors. Having tried other stuff now I don´t think Vortex binos are bad necessarily, but in my experience there´s almost always something better in the same price range. The Maven C series is better than the Viper to my eyes, and I think the Nikon Monarch HG and Meostar are both better than the Razor HD.

I'm going to upgrade to the Meostar 12x50 HD soon. Between that and a spotter I think I'm good for a while

 

[Hoodie]

I'm going to upgrade to the Meostar 12x50 HD soon. Between that and a spotter I think I'm good for a while

They are sweet. I don´t think youĺl ever ¨need¨ more.

I ended up selling mine a few months back to switch to a 10x42 Monarch HG, mostly to save weight and gain some FOV. I love the Nikons, but I think the Meostars edge them out slightly on image quality. I think it would be tough to beat a Meostar in their price range optically.

I´ve heard good things about the Tract Toric 12.5x50 too, but I haven´t looked through them. They´re a good bit cheaper than the Meostars so they may be worth a look as well. Newer company though, which can be a gamble warranty wise. No such concerns with Meopta.

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Have any of you guys ever had to have warranty work done on your european optics? It sucks - they usually ship it back to the motherland to get fixed. Went through it once, will never mess with it again. Its easy to say that a $3000 bino won’t ever need warranty work, but anything mechanical can and will break eventually - it happens. I also really like great warranties. I hunt hard in nasty terrain, either on foot or on horseback. Anything can happen...there is some comfort in knowing companies like Vortex and Leupold have your back. I was bummed Vortex went to china for their binos, but my Leupy’s have been awesome.

 

[CorbLand]

Have any of you guys ever had to have warranty work done on your european optics? It sucks - they usually ship it back to the motherland to get fixed. Went through it once, will never mess with it again. Its easy to say that a $3000 bino won’t ever need warranty work, but anything mechanical can and will break eventually - it happens. I also really like great warranties. I hunt hard in nasty terrain, either on foot or on horseback. Anything can happen...there is some comfort in knowing companies like Vortex and Leupold have your back. I was bummed Vortex went to china for their binos, but my Leupy’s have been awesome.

Had to send my Swaro back for condensation in the eye piece. Took about 6 weeks total. Sent it to Rhode Island and 2 weeks of that was shipping. I wouldn’t say that is horrible.

 

[MuleyFever]

I sometimes feel like people may want to justify their big purchases, even though in reality the differences are not as great as they hoped. Human nature says to convince yourself you did the right thing. I guess I'm trying to do the same.

Cognitive dissonance. Once you take the leap you have to justify it. Many people have realized their error and sold their alpha glass for mid range because they saw no benefit.

I see people say they got headaches from their"cheap" binos and then they got Alpha glass. Question is, did you need alpha glass? Probably not. Some great mid range glass would have done the same thing.