Anyone want to talk some sense into this guy?

[Mt_elk]

Agreed...

If you think wolves are a good idea and that soon we’ll have wolf management to control their numbers look no further than california and lions. No hunting, no management, voted on by the wildlife experts of San Francisco and Los Angeles. Hell, you can’t even get a depredation permit anymore.

Exactly. It'll only end up costing CPW money for the removal of "problem wolves"

 

[Customweld]

I looked into these wolf-advocacy groups a few months back and was shocked to see how many of the various organizations employees are from Tuscon, Arizona and Oakland, California. I find it interesting that these folks, living in big cities and states with little-to-no wolf populations, are the supposed "experts" on wolves, their impacts, and where/how they should be.

War over wolves: Opposing sides of wolf reintroduction argue their cases ahead of November ballot proposition

While other Routt County residents spent their stay-at-home days binge-watching Netflix shows or trying to bake Instagram-worthy loaves of bread amid the COVID-19 pandemic, Larry Desjardin developed an obsession with wolves. More specifically, Desjardin, a...

www.craigdailypress.com

This article is kind of interesting, with a statistical analysis showing that 100 wolves would require a 5% reduction in elk tags in CO to off-set wolf kills. So what happens when they get to 1,000 wolves like Idaho, a 50% reduction in tags? No more revenue from hunting because nobody wants to hunt surrounded by wolves?

Will be interesting to see how this plays out, I don't see us hunters winning this one in the long term unless ranchers organize and sue en masse, unfortunately.

I can tell you what we are seeing in Idaho. The Central Idaho units are way under objective for cow elk . Quite a few of those units are below objective for bull elk. The units that are urban/ag interface are over objective with the herds causing substantial damage to ag/cropland. We have had wolves here since '94 and met population objectives by 2000. It took almost 11 years to wade through lawsuits and litigation to finally delist. By the time the tools were available to manage, the damage was done.

 

[WCB]

I have two views on this....

If we could manage them I don't have a problem with them on the landscape at all. Problem is thats a hard row to hoe....look at here in MN...we have more estimate Wolves than MT ID and WY combined add in another 1,000 in WI and it makes those three states look like a joke. Now try to get something done in CO with how the political climate is there now.

My other view is how many guys on here or do you know that curse wolves every chance they get but jump on the opportunity to shoot 4 antelope does, participate in an elk shoulder season, or like here in MN this year shoot 4 or 5 does along with the other 4 or 5 or 8 guys in there hunting party then bitch the next year when they aren't seeing as many animals?How about doing the same thing and then are astonished when a bad winter hits and numbers are WAY low. HMMM maybe you shouldn't have shot 7 does Darryl.

I know I know...guys will come with the "well the DNR/G&F set goals and if they allow the tags than that is the amount of animals that can be safely taken out...." same departments like here in MN that won't even admit that there is an establish MT lion population.

 

[IdahoElk]

Just because he claims to be a hunter doesn't mean he is.
He seems to have a creative imagination of how this hole Wolf thing eventually ends, just look at Idaho.

 

[IdahoElk]

If you are a hunter and support managing game that should naturally live in an environment, either historically or currently, then you can’t distinguish between predators and game animals. You treat them all the same and manage them appropriately. That is my take on it.

That environment has been highly manipulated to the point that we can't treat them all the same.

 

[5MilesBack]

Bringing in more wolves to CO is like me killing the 700+ squirrels that I have at my house over the last 14 years, and then deciding to bring in more squirrels because there aren't anymore here. That is idiotic. There's a reason why they were decimated and removed from the population in the first place. If you're for bringing in new wolves, then you should also be for bringing smallpox back too. After all, it was here naturally before and decimated and removed for a reason.........just like wolves.

 

[Where's Bruce?]

The "alleged reintroduction" of wolves has nothing to do with conservation. These wolf experts are funded by anti-hunting groups who are connected to gun control groups. They are only interested in restricting your rights for money and power. They are Leftists which is why you seen them based in Commiefornia's biggest cities.

 

[sndmn11]

Far from coincidentally, the yahoo "hunter" who spearheaded Colorado's bear hunting restrictions is also from Durango.

 

[Mt_elk]

I have to views on this....

If we could manage them I don't have a problem with them on the landscape at all. Problem is thats a hard row to hoe....look at here in MN...we have more estimate Wolves than MT ID and WY combined add in another 1,000 in WI and it makes those three states look like a joke. Now try to get something done in CO with how the political climate is there now.

My other view is how many guys on here or do you know that curse wolves every chance they get but jump on the opportunity to shoot 4 antelope does, participate in an elk shoulder season, or like here in MN this year shoot 4 or 5 does along with the other 4 or 5 or 8 guys in there hunting party then bitch the next year when they aren't seeing as many animals?How about doing the same thing and then are astonished when a bad winter hits and numbers are WAY low. HMMM maybe you shouldn't have shot 7 does Darryl.

I know I know...guys will come with the "well the DNR/G&F set goals and if they allow the tags than that is the amount of animals that can be safely taken out...." same departments like here in MN that won't even admit that there is an establish MT lion population.

Agree. The elk shoulder seasons absolutely kill me. You would think Montana hates elk given the fact they encourage hunting them for 6 months straight.

 

[Stalk’nAwe]

Wrote a research paper in college on elk and wolves..cited a study multiple times that found a direct correlation to being pro wolf and the proximity to which you live to wolves..city people love em and want em since they won’t have to deal with em...ranchers and most hunters damn sure don’t want em...hard to make a living with wolves around..I think our forefathers proved that when they shot em out

 

[Chesapeake173]

The recent research that my company has completed actually indicates that the majority of wolf kills are on prey whose bone marrow indicates the presence of illness, disease or lameness. This study was confined to a 50k acre area populated with grizzly, wolf, lion, bison, elk and deer in Montana. Healthy animals are killed as well, but they represent a proportionately smaller data set.

Many biologists that I am colleagues with would argue in favor of apex predators. The major sources of contention would be inability to manage predator populations due to protected status and that the Feds get involved which adds a lot of unnecessary red tape.

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Out of curiosity who / how was this study funded?


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[Opah]

I refuse to have a battle of wit and sense with someone so unarmed !

 

[jolemons]

Out of curiosity who / how was this study funded?


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Private study conducted jointly between the ranching operation and a conservation foundation. I am not at liberty to disclose details until/if the data is published. Study area is Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem in MT south of Bozeman. The basis of the research was to see what effect wolves and griz are having on a large ranch that has substantial hunting revenue from the elk resource.



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[Fatcamp]

Private study conducted jointly between the ranching operation and a conservation foundation. I am not at liberty to disclose details until/if the data is published. Study area is Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem in MT south of Bozeman. The basis of the research was to see what effect wolves and griz are having on a large ranch that has substantial hunting revenue from the elk resource.



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Hmmmmm....... Sounds legit. Lots of that going on around here lately.

 

[jolemons]

Hmmmmm....... Sounds legit. Lots of that going on around here lately.

You caught me... I've been. Rokslide member since it's inception in order to gain everyone's trust. Then my plan was to plant the seed in order to gain hunter support for wolves. Foiled again!

In all seriousness, I am a member of the Stop the Wolf Coalition. Not because I don't want wolves, but because I don't feel that CO is prepared for their reintroduction and because I know that there will likely be little support given to CPW to manage them.

I'm hoping that in my lifetime there will be apex predators thriving in a balanced ecosystem in all suitable habitat, managed by the States, with fair and equitable compensation given to livestock owners for mortalities and morbidity associated with predation.

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[Fatcamp]

That last paragraph is fantasy and you know it. As was your statement about there always being sick and injured animals for wolves to feed on. That's just not reality.

 

[jolemons]

That last paragraph is fantasy and you know it. As was your statement about there always being sick and injured animals for wolves to feed on. That's just not reality.

May be fantasy, but definately an ideal that I'm willing to fight for.

As far as the sick and injured animal.comment, you should check yourself on your lack of biological knowledge. Prey mortality not associated with predation will vary greatly with region and ecosystem, there are a lot of variables. Morbidity associated with disease, injury, nutrition, weather, etc. is a constant in any wildlife population, including predators themselves.


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[Chesapeake173]

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[Carpenterant]

At least the wolves can go on the private land driving the elk back out to public, then hunters pushing them to private

 

[BrentH]

The recent research that my company has completed actually indicates that the majority of wolf kills are on prey whose bone marrow indicates the presence of illness, disease or lameness. This study was confined to a 50k acre area populated with grizzly, wolf, lion, bison, elk and deer in Montana. Healthy animals are killed as well, but they represent a proportionately smaller data set.

Many biologists that I am colleagues with would argue in favor of apex predators. The major sources of contention would be inability to manage predator populations due to protected status and that the Feds get involved which adds a lot of unnecessary red tape.

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It's around 50%, but I don't have the white paper in front of me. The study was done 10 years after they moved into the ranch that was studied. There will always be sick and injured animals available that would have otherwise died.


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50% is now a majority?