Zeiss "Lifetime" Warranty - refusal to stand behind its product

[Macintosh]

The comparisons I see on here on insane

Comparing 100 retail multi tool, that if it happens to break 20 years from now can be replaced with 25 dollar production cost new model, is totally apples to oranges compared to keeping the tooling and machining’s needed to to produce a 20 year old optic. As well as expecting after 20 years of use a new or prorated replacement.

Insane? I see it differently. Its not a short or long warranty that is in question, it’s their promise that is in question. Leatherman made a clear promise and backed it up. Zeiss makes an intentionally great-sounding promise that isnt actually as good as they are trying to make it sound, and they dont even tell you the important details of what that actually means in the fine print, so as a consumer its not even possible to know what exactly to expect. How is it insane to call out a company for making their warranty sound better than it actually is?

 

[Happy Antelope]

I think that may be a happier thought for more people than you think, depending on the type of insurance.

100% no one has to buy it, you can post a bond with the state to prove you can pay for someone else's damage if you cause a car accident, health ins is always optional sort of, and home insurance is only because the bank doesn't believe you have the cash to pay them back. Just pay off the home and drop the insurance. If you want to risk a lifetime of work to pay for an auto accident, you 100% can, totally legal in most states.

Medical debt is the leading cause of bankruptcy in the US and insurers are one of the entities gouging the eyes out of the American people when it comes to healthcare. Bad example.

Yes, hence it's a good idea to buy insurance so you don't risk massive debt. You just proved my point. Gouging? Do you have numbers to back that up? Sorry the health insurance industry lives on about a 6% profit margin. United Health care for example did 6% last year, MSFT is 33%, AAPL 30%. Obviously United Health can't drop premiums 50% or they would be out of business in a few months. The healthcare debt is from people who do NOT buy insurance. Do you know why healthcare is so expensive, because it cost a lot to keep someone alive now, because we have thousands of drugs that help people. When you got cancer in 1930 you died, today you stand a chance a lot of the time. The insurance industry is not something anyone with half a brain would want to get into, the risk is high, the profits are small. Ins sales sure, bearing risk? NO WAY. Real profits and gouging are education, tech, advertising, etc. Not really a discussion for RS, but like I said you don't have to buy it. I would not be caught be dead protecting my family or other families from financial ruin. I could care less if my 500 dollar scope has no warranty, I do care if my child needs 500K of cancer treatments that it's covered.

 

[JGRaider]

Insurance is great, and has it's place. It's the agents that deserve no respect often times.

 

[Happy Antelope]

Insurance is great, and has it's place. It's the agents that deserve no respect often times.

There are some bad ones for sure....

 

[khavok]

This is a forewarning to anyone who is considering buying Zeiss product(s), in part, because of the Transferable Limited Lifetime Warranty.



I have multiple Zeiss Diascopes and Victory line scopes. I have never needed to request warranty repair from Zeiss, which is a very good thing indeed. One of the oculars for an 85mm Disacope developed a small opaque “globule” on an internal lens. The globule was static indicating that it was not water. I tried a number of possible solutions, i.e., placing the ocular in a bowl of dry rice, storing it with desiccant, etc. Naturally these efforts were fruitless because the ocular is waterproof.



Because I have multiple Diascope bodies and eyepieces to choose from and Zeiss has a Limited Lifetime Warranty I wasn’t rushed to send in the ocular for warranty repair. The warranty states in relevant section:



Limited Lifetime Transferable Warranty

"ZEISS Sports Optics Optical Systems are warranted against defects in workmanship and materials for the life of the Product.

The Optical System means (a) all the components between and inclusive of the optic’s objective and ocular lens, and (b) any functional and mechanical operating system associated with the optical performance of the Optical System.

If a defect covered by this Warranty is found, ZEISS will, at its sole discretion, repair or replace the Product with a new or reconditioned ZEISS product of comparable specifications."


The response I received was surprising: “We have completed the inspection on your Vario-Okular 15x-45x/20-60x, Serial # *****40 and have determined that your optic is either beyond economic repair or not repairable.” And with that, Zeiss would not honor the lifetime warranty even though Zeiss did acknowledge that it was not due to consumer abuse or mistreatment.



I spoke to Joseph “Joe” Israel at Zeiss whose offer to resolve the matter was to sell me a used Vario-Okular at retail price but without a warranty. He went on to explain that "Lifetime" does not really mean "Lifetime" but rather what Zeiss holds to be a reasonable period of time.

Needless to say, I will no longer be purchasing or supporting Zeiss products. Swarovski’s warranty and repair department has handled all my warranty issues without pause or issue. (the range finder in a pair of Swarovski El Range stopped working. Even though the binoculars were beyond the five year warranty, Swarovski fixed the issue and at no charge. I was fully expecting to have to pay for the service and repairs because it was outside of the warranty. The point being, one manufacturer stands behind its products, even if outside of warranty coverage, and Zeiss refuses to stand behind its lifetime warranty.

The more I read the more I'm glad I stuck with Vortex. Not the clearest but I can't beat their warranty.

 

[Calgarious]

I’m curious if their camera lens division is the same people, I only ever bought one zeiss lens but it was $1400 and towards the second year it was focusing off centre, they just told me it was customer damage and would cost too much to repair. That was 10 years ago and today I see this after trying a pair of conquests yesterday and coming online to check reviews, thanks for the reminder

 

[Happy Antelope]

I’m curious if their camera lens division is the same people, I only ever bought one zeiss lens but it was $1400 and towards the second year it was focusing off centre, they just told me it was customer damage and would cost too much to repair. That was 10 years ago and today I see this after trying a pair of conquests yesterday and coming online to check reviews, thanks for the reminder

Different people for sure, massive company many many divisions and companies.

 

[Calgarious]

Different people for sure, massive company many many divisions and companies.

Apologies I just meant same people as in same warranty management team & policies similar across depts.

 

[DMTJAGER]

Summitdog,
Truly sorry for your unacceptably poor treatment from Zeiss.
I was literally 90% sold on buying 10x42 Conquest Bono's till I read your story. I will now likely go with Meopta's or Tract Torric.
Knock on wood 10x10 but I've never needed a warranty for any of my optics, but I can not afford to spend $700-$1k on bino's who's warranty is at best questionable.
One would think in the age of forums like this that are viewed every day by very large numbers of optics enthusiast's all over the world Zeiss would re-think handling a warranty repair ZEISS admitted was NOT to owners fault so unacceptably poor.
FWIW their shoddy treatment of you just lost them around $1k from me and I will never again consider buying Zeiss optics.

 

[IrkedCitizen]

Zeiss is and will always be alpha glass. Zeiss will continue be profitable. At the end of the day this will not have an impact on Zeiss. This will only leave a lingering bad taste in the OP's mouth.

The reason this will have no impact is that the amount of birders in this world who use NEW Zeiss dwarf the amount of hunters that use NEW Zeiss. Zeiss is not worried about upset hunters even in today's age of forums. They are also not worried about missed sales of their lower level optics sales (conquest, terra) to hunters. They basically offer the lower tier as an affordable option for birders children. Because kids want to use the same things as their parents.

For the most part Birders are not using 10+ year old equipment, they regularly upgrade and sell off their old optics thus always have a revolving valid warranty. Therefore the birders searching for reviews online really don't care about issues a hunter had with old optics that they will not be using. So Zeiss will continue to get business.

It's unfortunate but that's just how the cookie crumbles.

 

[JGRaider]

Zeiss is and will always be alpha glass. Zeiss will continue be profitable. At the end of the day this will not have an impact on Zeiss. This will only leave a lingering bad taste in the OP's mouth.

The reason this will have no impact is that the amount of birders in this world who use NEW Zeiss dwarf the amount of hunters that use NEW Zeiss. Zeiss is not worried about upset hunters even in today's age of forums. They are also not worried about missed sales of their lower level optics sales (conquest, terra) to hunters. They basically offer the lower tier as an affordable option for birders children. Because kids want to use the same things as their parents.

For the most part Birders are not using 10+ year old equipment, they regularly upgrade and sell off their old optics thus always have a revolving valid warranty. Therefore the birders searching for reviews online really don't care about issues a hunter had with old optics that they will not be using. So Zeiss will continue to get business.

It's unfortunate but that's just how the cookie crumbles.

LOL.......in reality, Swarovski sells more optics in 6 months than Zeiss does all year, and in the CS department, Swarovski has been kicking every alpha makers assss for years. It's why Swaro is the king of the alpha market. Zeiss' pathetic "lifetime warranty" is just that......absolutely pathetic.

 

[S.Clancy]

How old is this spotting scope in question?

Still waiting....

 

[IrkedCitizen]

LOL.......in reality, Swarovski sells more optics in 6 months than Zeiss does all year, and in the CS department, Swarovski has been kicking every alpha makers assss for years. It's why Swaro is the king of the alpha market. Zeiss' pathetic "lifetime warranty" is just that......absolutely pathetic.

Zeiss is okay with that. Sport optics are not their bread and butter. Zeiss makes their money by manufacturing equipment for the medical industry. That lense technology from those machines then trickles down to their photography division and then eventually makes its way to sports optics. Zeiss is not hurting for business.

 

[JGRaider]

Never said they were. The argument here is that their own "Lifetime Warranty" is a bald faced lie and they should own up to it but they refuse. That's bush league any way you want to color it. In the modern sport optics market, they are becoming largely irrelevant and rightfully so.

 

[Tmcgarrigle]

Zeiss reps told me that having the Outdoorsman's stud installed on my victory SF's would void the warranty. Outdoorsman's website specifically states it would not void the warranty. I went back and forth with Zeiss on the phone about this all for them to basically say you'd have to see how it would shake out if I sent them in for warranty work. They also told me just keep using them when I had a noticeable grittiness in the focus wheel. The glass was spectacular in the Victory SF's but the other issues made me sell and switch to Swaro. And on the Birding forums, people have expressed concern over Leica and Zeiss warranty as well. They have talked about how Leica has gotten better but Zeiss is hit or miss.

 

[Trial153]

Still waiting....

Pertinent information is not needed. Break out the pitchfork, boycott and cancel everything. Facts be dammed

 

[Macintosh]

Pertinent information is not needed. Break out the pitchfork, boycott and cancel everything. Facts be dammed

The only relevant piece of info thats missing is how many years zeiss’s “lifetime of the product” warranty is valid. Because it aint written down anywhere in their published warranty policy. Until there’s a number in their policy that a customer could hold them to, it’s all smoke and mirrors if they’re going to err on the side of not covering legit problems. You dont need a 100-year warranty to have a clear policy that a customer can rely on and that works with the company’s production schedule, business model, etc.
One example of another companies policy which is far more straightforward:

With this Schmidt & Bender product, you are purchasing a high quality, handcrafted product for which we provide a warranty in accordance with the following terms and conditions:
Guaranteed twenty (20) years spare parts availability. Worldwide manufacturer‘s warranty for the period of ten (10) years from the date of purchase (end customer)…. Product registration can extend the manufacturer‘s warranty period by an additional two years to twelve (12) years.

Why is it so hard to just come out and tell people what your warranty policy actually is, instead of hiding behind disingenuous BS like a completely indefinite, and therefore meaningless, “lifetime of the product”???

 

[Summitdog]

The Okular is less than 20 years old.

I am seriously considering changing me optics from Zeiss to Leica. At least the warranty with Leica is pretty well defined.

QUOTE:
All Leica Sport Optic products shipped from Leica Camera Inc. to an authorized USA or Canadian dealer since Jan 1, 2021 will now feature a fully transferable 10-year Passport Protection Plan plus a 30-year Manufacturer’s Warranty. Both aspects of our commitment to you compromise the following:

Fully Transferable
No Warranty Card Required
No Receipt Required
No Charge
Valid only on products purchased from authorized Leica dealers in USA or Canada*


10 Year Passport Protection Plan

For a period of 10 years we will repair or replace your Leica Sport Optic product purchased from an Authorized USA and Canadian dealer in the event it becomes damaged or defective, at no charge to you. If we cannot repair your product, we will replace it with a product in perfect working order of equal or better physical condition. It doesn’t matter how it happened, whose fault it was, or where you purchased it in the USA or Canada.
Please note that our Passport Protection Plan excludes coverage for intentional damage, misuse, cosmetic damage that does not affect the performance of the optic, fire, loss, theft, or unauthorized repair or modification.

This Passport Protection Plan is void, if damage is caused by the use of accessories not sold or authorized by Leica Camera Inc. or from service by persons not authorized by Leica Camera Inc. It will be at Leica Camera Inc.’s sole discretion to extend service under this Warranty for damage arising from the above-mentioned conditions.


30 Year Manufacturer’s Warranty

Beyond the 10-year Passport Protection, Leica Sport Optics offers a 30-year warranty on the optical system of our products for products purchased in the USA and Canada from an authorized Leica Camera Inc. North American dealer. Once examined, if it is determined that the optical system is defective, we will repair or replace the instrument or defective part. All non-optical products (i.e. accessories) are warranted for two years from date of purchase. This warranty is void if damage results from unauthorized repairs, accident, alteration, misuse, abuse, neglect, fire, flood or other force majeure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Macintosh]

I contacted zeiss via their website contact form twice, once when this thread first came up, and again a week and a half ago when I last posted. Both times I asked how long their “lifetime of the product” warranty was good for, and if they used a judgement based on wear, what criteria they used. I have heard nothing back from either contact.

 

[Pronghunter]

I didn’t read through all 7 pages, but I’ve sent in 3-4 Zeiss items over the last 3-4 years. One recently. Almost all issues were caused by me. I’ve never had to pay for a repair and their communication and response time was phenomenal. My last spotter was in for repair for 6 weeks and back in my hands. January 2023. Sorry about your experience. I don’t believe that is typical of Zeiss.