Struggling with cartridge selection.

If you want something bigger bore, but short range, then you should look at .350 legend. Lowish recoil, lots of factory ammo, lots of options for rifles, including tikka. Can run a number of 9mm suppressors on it, just have to verify it will support it. Kills deer just fine within its range limits.
Have a AR in 350legend I built as soon as I was able to get a barrel after the release. A little bit of a jam-o-matic. Hoping the adjustable gas block I ordered will fix that problem. Just have a standard bolt face tikka looking to rebarrel.
I’m curious why the OP is going directly away from what he said he wanted? He said he wanted as many bang-flops as possible. Slow and heavy is not the way to get there. His 243 with 95 NBT is going to give as many bang flops as anything larger. Now if he just wants a big rifle, that’s cool. But he should realize that his large rifle is only going to be the same, or longer, time to incapacitation.
I have 223s, 243s, 7mm08s, 30-30s, 308s and 30-06s. Other than maybe a creedmore or the 277fury I have to go bigger. Really just looking for a short range where BC don’t matter larger bore cartridge that’s different. That’ll thump a deer. Pretty much the same reason upland hunter gravitate to 28ga or 16ga. Im just a little different and that the way I like it.

I’ve read all the small cartridge threads till I can’t physically read them anymore. They work and they work well. I’m not denying the evidence is there. Maybe one day I’ll load some 62gr TSXs(I hunt coppers) in the 223 and hunt it. We will see. I shoot all the cartridges above well and they all kill well when you put the right bullet where it needs to go.
 
I’m to the point between 338 fed and 358win. Still leaning toward 358 but not sure yet. This rifle is a 100yd brush stalker not brush buster. I like the tikka stock with a limb saver on it.
100 yard brush stalker? Never seen anything better than the original Mossberg 835 24 inch barrel with factory x-full turkey choke and 3.5 inch double Ought buckshot. I thought you were wanting the opportunity to reach out if needed.
 
Have a AR in 350legend I built as soon as I was able to get a barrel after the release. A little bit of a jam-o-matic. Hoping the adjustable gas block I ordered will fix that problem. Just have a standard bolt face tikka looking to rebarrel.

I have 223s, 243s, 7mm08s, 30-30s, 308s and 30-06s. Other than maybe a creedmore or the 277fury I have to go bigger. Really just looking for a short range where BC don’t matter larger bore cartridge that’s different. That’ll thump a deer. Pretty much the same reason upland hunter gravitate to 28ga or 16ga. Im just a little different and that the way I like it.

I’ve read all the small cartridge threads till I can’t physically read them anymore. They work and they work well. I’m not denying the evidence is there. Maybe one day I’ll load some 62gr TSXs(I hunt coppers) in the 223 and hunt it. We will see. I shoot all the cartridges above well and they all kill well when you put the right bullet where it needs to go.


Those longer high bc match bullets carry the length to penetrate and soft nose to upset much bigger than controlled expansion bullets.

I think you need to evaluate what bullet you are using more than what case behind it.

Personally for that application I’d have a hard time not shooting a 223 with a soft heavy tipped bullet and a suppressor. Shooting at animals while still hunting is chaotic enough, I want to see where I’m hitting and be able to follow/follow up. 223 or something like your 243 with a suppressor is going to create a lot less chaos in that situation.

I know it’s not what you want to hear but it is reality. I grew up shooting stuff with magnums from close range so they didn’t run. Well they ran. Now if you told me sub 200 yards is it I’m grabbing my 223 with 77tmk.

Or get a big gun if that’s fun for you, but you’re spending yourself into a worse product imo.
 
If you want to get something big and cool, .45-70, .50-70, and .50-90 are all fun. You can get a classic old rifle and even if the bullet fails, there will be a 1/2” hole through it. Of course, you can get modern JHP’s that expand wonderfully even at low velocity.

Nothing against new cartridges, but most are 90% marketing, 10% benefit. The same was true of many old cartridges too, but a combination that has survived 150 years of ruthless competition has to be doing something right. And at least those cartridges weren’t created by manufacturers working hand-in-glove with lobbyists to write our hunting regulations to open new market opportunities.


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The only deer I ever shot with a .45-70 was a 150-yard high lung shot that resulted in 400 yards of tracking with no blood until the last 10 feet. I was using the factory 350-grain JHP. The bullet did exit. Fortunately, the ground was very wet and I could follow his tracks. I was not impressed with any aspect of that kill. I like the old M1886 as a classic firearm, but I will probably never hunt with it again. I would take my Sako .243 10/10 times given the choice between the two.


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That 45-70 factory round is woefully underpowered and doesn't expand or exit at distance
 
That 45-70 factory round is woefully underpowered and doesn't expand or exit at distance

I don’t think so. The box specs matched the velocity for the “modern rifles in good repair.” It wasn’t loaded down to be safe in an old Trapdoor.


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100 yard brush stalker? Never seen anything better than the original Mossberg 835 24 inch barrel with factory x-full turkey choke and 3.5 inch double Ought buckshot. I thought you were wanting the opportunity to reach out if needed.
Unfortunately I live/hunt Minnesota. Buckshot it’s legal. But that’d be a great close range setup. Currently my longest kill is 80yds so literally anything will work in the woods I hunt.
 
I don’t think so. The box specs matched the velocity for the “modern rifles in good repair.” It wasn’t loaded down to be safe in an old Trapdoor.


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Winchester brand?
A 10 yr old kid can tell the difference between it and the Hornady fxt when shooting
 
Unfortunately I live/hunt Minnesota. Buckshot it’s legal. But that’d be a great close range setup. Currently my longest kill is 80yds so literally anything will work in the woods I hunt.
Buckshot was illegal on game management land in upstate SC until 30ish yrs ago. Dang I hated those pieplate at 50 yards slugs...and that was a good shooter 40 yrs ago. Thankfully we finally found private land to hunt
 
The only bang+flops I have ever seen that were NOT CNS hits, were done with high velocity (north of 3k FPS). Never once seen a slow+heavy bullet put one down in it's tracks without hitting the spine or brain. My wife's old 270WSM shooting 130 Accubonds at 3390 FPS muzzle velocity, my 30-06 with 150s at 3125 FPS, that kind of thing, have dropped some without a CNS hit.

So, if you want a slow heavy bullet that will go through like a drill bit and keep going, that's the opposite of a gun you can expect to bang-flop anything outside of CNS shots.
You seem ill informed. soft point bullets expand, lose some weight and if all goes well exit. Lots of damage. 2600 fps must not be all that slow as the 223 77 gr. TMK from the average 16" barrel runs about that speed. Now if you are talkiing about a 45-70 running 400 grain bullets yes.
 
I'd rather use 7mm-08 or 308 BLR to get back in the scope quicker.
Didn't much care for the 358 with BLR hockey puck pad.
I own 2 7-08 and 2 308 rifles. Since I shoot with both eyes open I get back on the animal pretty quick. The stock on my 358 BLR was made for open sights and it jumped vertically pretty hard. Still I could see what happened.
 
Winchester brand?
A 10 yr old kid can tell the difference between it and the Hornady ft when shooting

I just looked it up. I guess you are right. I was using the Remington 300-grain bullets at 1900 FPS. Obviously that’s not as hot as I thought. You can get about 300-500 FPS faster with a better load.


____________________
“Keep on keepin’ on…”
 
Buckshot was illegal on game management land in upstate SC until 30ish yrs ago. Dang I hated those pieplate at 50 yards slugs...and that was a good shooter 40 yrs ago. Thankfully we finally found private land to hunt
I grow up in the shotgun zone and even my mossberg 835 w/ a rifled barrel and sabot could only do 10” groups. Could have been the recoil, could have been the shells but was definitely me. 🤷‍♂️ went to a muzzleloader till I could move out of the zone.

Moved north into the rifle zone in high school and never looked back.
 
I own 2 7-08 and 2 308 rifles. Since I shoot with both eyes open I get back on the animal pretty quick. The stock on my 358 BLR was made for open sights and it jumped vertically pretty hard. Still I could see what happened.
I have you beat by one 7mm-08 blr. Three 7mm-08 and two 308.
Have em from 22-250 to 300wsm. Lost of fun. Play cowboy and still reach out to 400 yards to kill.
 
I grow up in the shotgun zone and even my mossberg 835 w/ a rifled barrel and sabot could only do 10” groups. Could have been the recoil, could have been the shells but was definitely me. 🤷‍♂️ went to a muzzleloader till I could move out of the zone.

Moved north into the rifle zone in high school and never looked back.
I now have a rifled barrel w cantilever scope mount for Remington 1100 that will group sabots at 3 inches. Only use it if travel to slug only area, which has happened twice
 
Truthfully it doesn’t matter, just get the cartridge that makes you happy.

No cartridge is a “brush buster” - all bullets will divert when impacting brush. How much is completely unpredictable as there are way too many variables to account for.

Again, just choose what you think is cool, because objectively, you shouldn’t be shooting anything through brush and expecting good results.

This is fact and has been tested countless times, you can google “brush busting myth” and read all day. Only shoot with a clear line of sight.
Yes, if you want a "brush busting" bullet, a smoothbore musket would probably be about the only one that would work. Other than that, a shotgun, but nothing with a rifled barrel will be reliable for "brush busting".
 
Have a AR in 350legend I built as soon as I was able to get a barrel after the release. A little bit of a jam-o-matic. Hoping the adjustable gas block I ordered will fix that problem. Just have a standard bolt face tikka looking to rebarrel.

I have 223s, 243s, 7mm08s, 30-30s, 308s and 30-06s. Other than maybe a creedmore or the 277fury I have to go bigger. Really just looking for a short range where BC don’t matter larger bore cartridge that’s different. That’ll thump a deer. Pretty much the same reason upland hunter gravitate to 28ga or 16ga. Im just a little different and that the way I like it.

I’ve read all the small cartridge threads till I can’t physically read them anymore. They work and they work well. I’m not denying the evidence is there. Maybe one day I’ll load some 62gr TSXs(I hunt coppers) in the 223 and hunt it. We will see. I shoot all the cartridges above well and they all kill well when you put the right bullet where it needs to go.
Did you ever mod a magazine? Moving the feed lips back to the center of the groove fixed all of my feed problems. I was in a hurry and used the corner on a grinder wheel. Ought to clean it up a bit with a dremel but both mags I did work just fine.



 
I have you beat by one 7mm-08 blr. Three 7mm-08 and two 308.
Have em from 22-250 to 300wsm. Lost of fun. Play cowboy and still reach out to 400 yards to kill.
I like the early steel frame BLR's. The one I had in 358 was too nice and shiny though.
 
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