Project 2025 and public lands and environment

[elkhunter505]

You do have a point with the Fauci comment though. Not much I can argue with there.

Now that I think more about this, I don’t think this was a valid response. Fauci was in charge of that department since 1984. You’re telling me he went through both republican and democrat presidents after being appointed by Ronald Reagan and didn’t get removed? That’s because he was doing a good job and the right thing in my opinion.

 

[TaperPin]

Corruption is corruption and it doesn't make it OK because R's are paying them off too, or I guess you're saying it does?

Do you even hear what you’re saying? God help us all if that is the reasoning behind the most important decisions being made in America today.

 

[Gila]

This thread reminds me of the quote, “They want you to fight a culture war instead of fighting a class war.” Insert whatever wedge issue into the mix and you can bet your butt the common person will argue to the end of the earth about it. Unfortunately, the middle class, the real people who run this country are too busy trying to make ends meet and fighting with each other. As long as this keeps happening the vote will always be split and no real change that helps the middle class can ever come about. This is exactly the playbook in my opinion.

I would hope that from whatever side of the isle you sit one would be weary of the richest man in the entire world having this much power and access within our government. The way things have gone in recent weeks it does seem that congress’s power of the purse has been usurped. I am not a constitutional scholar however I do know that it was designed to prevent an oligarchy and this could be another step in that direction.

To me this forum highlights the fact that we have a lot more in common than we give each other credit for and I hope that if or when the time comes that our public lands are in jeopardy we can all come together and raise hell in order to stop it.

Over 40 years ago now that I first became involved with promoting hunting and sport-fishing opportunity. The political “divisions” of today did not exist then.

Why is it that you think that Elon not being elected holds any weight? Have any of you actually thought about this, or are you just parroting the left wing talking heads? Was Fauci elected? Elon and Trump were on the campaign trail months-on-end before Election Day and promising to do exactly as they are doing now. Americans voted knowing this, and Trump won handily.

As for billionaires, do you understand how capital works? The wealth of Bezos, Elon, etc. isn’t just sitting in a bank account. There are a lot of people directly and indirectly reliant on business generated by that capital and assets. Billionaires trying to make more money and “being greedy”, in reality, is them increasing the success of their business and the people that work for and with those businesses.

If you trusted Biden, then you have no issue with trusting a draft dodger. The idea that the state has ownership of your service and life involuntarily, i.e. a draft, is nothing short of heinous.

Fundamental flaws in your post but Dr Anthony Fauci is an American Hero and thank God for Fauci. He isn’t even in the same league. Biden is the most knowledgeable American alive on foreign affairs and if you dig into it, you will find out the facts.

Fauci served the American public health sector for more than fifty years and has acted as an advisor to every U.S. president since Reagan. He was awarded the Medal Of Freedom by Dubya. And by the way the collective value of Musk’s corporate holding isn’t the same as his personal wealth. There are for profit government owned corporations like Amtrak. If Musk refused to serve his own country, how is he going to serve ours?

 

[D S 319]

Fauci being there since 1984 should raise more concerns than anything.

and now, we are now saying Fauci is an American Hero?

 

[TristanJH]

Well the government is ultimately the reason for inflation due to the printing of more fiat, right? America is the best at crony capitalism.

Maybe not — attributing inflation solely to government fiat printing oversimplifies the issue significantly. Economist Steve Keen would argue that, historically, private sector factors—namely the accumulation of debt and subsequent pricing adjustments—have played a larger role. The burst of money printing in 2020 contributed to a perfect storm of inflationary pressures but wasn’t the sole cause. Moreover, trimming the budget the way they are won’t make a dent; it’ll only fuel the claim that OUR land and OUR wildlife can’t be effectively managed in the public trust—potentially leading to irrevocable decisions.

 

[TristanJH]

Why is it that you think that Elon not being elected holds any weight?

Also, none of these actions are FOIA-able. I like my government transparent and accountable.

 

[Gila]

Fauci being there since 1984 should raise more concerns than anything.

and now, we are now saying Fauci is an American Hero?

History should be so kind to Trump and Musk.

 

[Pony Soldier]

This is starting to look like the gripe thread. Not sure how replanting has anything to do with management when the forest service has a "let it burn"policy. A fire near where I grew up wiped out all the planted trees for the last 70 years. If they went back to the management of select cut and sustainable yield of the 60s and before we might have habitat for the game.

The state seems to manage the land they can't sell reasonably well but depending on which party is in power, the likelyhood of land being sold off is a high risk unknown.

Maybe the option to consider is to maintain federal ownership but contract the states to manage it. That way you might be able to remove the politics out of it and interject some science.

The BLM manages rangeland fairly well and minerals or at least they can follow their own regulations.

Today we seem to have so many agencies all trying to do each others jobs there is more squabbling than success. Many of them trying to do enforcement and research spend their time fighting instead of finding solutions.

I worked for the US Bureau of Mines for a third of my working career. The democrats hated us because we supported industry, the republicans hated us because we were part of government, industry loved or hated us dependent on what they needed at the time. Our DC office needed to die while the field and research offices were made up of the best industry had to offer. How is that for conflict?

 

[CJ19]

This is starting to look like the gripe thread. Not sure how replanting has anything to do with management when the forest service has a "let it burn"policy. A fire near where I grew up wiped out all the planted trees for the last 70 years. If they went back to the management of select cut and sustainable yield of the 60s and before we might have habitat for the game.

The state seems to manage the land they can't sell reasonably well but depending on which party is in power, the likelyhood of land being sold off is a high risk unknown.

Maybe the option to consider is to maintain federal ownership but contract the states to manage it. That way you might be able to remove the politics out of it and interject some science.

The BLM manages rangeland fairly well and minerals or at least they can follow their own regulations.

Today we seem to have so many agencies all trying to do each others jobs there is more squabbling than success. Many of them trying to do enforcement and research spend their time fighting instead of finding solutions.

I worked for the US Bureau of Mines for a third of my working career. The democrats hated us because we supported industry, the republicans hated us because we were part of government, industry loved or hated us dependent on what they needed at the time. Our DC office needed to die while the field and research offices were made up of the best industry had to offer. How is that for conflict?

its a shame this post is on page 24. passersby should read this post because it really does describe the within government experience better than any other post in this thread.

 

[Gila]

This administration’s dystopian ideals based on disinformation, misinformation and conspiracy theories will hamper conservation of the resources going forward. That is a given. America has always been great because of our Democratic Institutions. Having said that, the consumptive leases with our public lands has been good for our economy as well as our enjoyment. Selling off public lands makes no good business sense what-so-ever. Sportsmen and Sportswomen need to make allies with some of the environmental groups even though those groups may have different agendas. Historically speaking, all of the successful conservation bills had bi-partisan support. Radical elements of the left as well as the right, erode bipartisan support.

 

[Gila]

its a shame this post is on page 24. passersby should read this post because it really does describe the within government experience better than any other post in this thread.

Replanting usually only occurs after logging operations (cutting trees down). Wild fires are a natural and needed event in the forest. Prescribed burns are a way to channel fires away from inhabited areas and into areas of needed regrowth. Fires in the national forests spur on healthy forests period. Go into an area just a few months after a burn and you will see saplings and lush green growth. Smart hunters focus on burn areas.

 

[ScreamingPotato]

Today's DOGE wins.

 

[CJ19]

This administration’s dystopian ideals based on disinformation, misinformation and conspiracy theories will hamper conservation of the resources going forward. That is a given. America has always been great because of our Democratic Institutions. Having said that, the consumptive leases with our public lands has been good for our economy as well as our enjoyment. Selling off public lands makes no good business sense what-so-ever. Sportsmen and Sportswomen need to make allies with some of the environmental groups even though those groups may have different agendas. Historically speaking, all of the successful conservation bills had bi-partisan support. Radical elements of the left as well as the right, erode bipartisan support.

Replanting usually only occurs after logging operations (cutting trees down). Wild fires are a natural and needed event in the forest. Prescribed burns are a way to channel fires away from inhabited areas and into areas of needed regrowth. Fires in the national forests spur on healthy forests period. Go into an area just a few months after a burn and you will see saplings and lush green growth. Smart hunters focus on burn areas.

U been in a burn in an over the counter lately? Looks like a pumpkin patch.

 

[CJ19]

Today's DOGE wins.
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Don't forget almost a billion dollars to plant trees in inner cities. I think thats a forest service project

 

[Pony Soldier]

Gila - nice thought but not in our country. Three years since a local fire - little to nothing. Burned so hot it even exfoliated the rocks. All that is left is sand and outcrop. Maybe in the next century.

In the one where I grew up - miles and miles of black stobs. How about the 1910 fire- after over 100 years the best you can hope for is brush and woody forbs. I think its time to dissolve the forest circus and start over while a few trees are left.

 

[Ozarkansas]

Today's DOGE wins.
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The problem what Doge.gov (other than being a terrible name) is that there’s very little proof there. It’s literally links to tweets of screenshots, or links to Musk tweets, if there’s any evidence at all. And in some cases (“condoms for Gaza”) we know that what they claim the money was being used for, isn’t really an accurate summary of how it was being used.

They keep a page up that says “receipts coming by xxxx” but they keep pushing back the date they’ll provide proof by.

 

[elkhunter505]

The problem what Doge.gov (other than being a terrible name) is that there’s very little proof there. It’s literally links to tweets of screenshots, or links to Musk tweets, if there’s any evidence at all. And in some cases (“condoms for Gaza”) we know that what they claim the money was being used for, isn’t really an accurate summary of how it was being used.

They keep a page up that says “receipts coming by xxxx” but they keep pushing back the date they’ll provide proof by.

This is even funnier than that.

 

[Ozarkansas]

@elkhunter505 that reads like a request for recipes on an influencer’s instagram account.

Anyway, it’s good burn weather here in Arkansas but there hasn’t been a federal burn since February 3rd. I’ve heard there’s an exemption from the firings for fire fighters, but no word on burn crew or foresters yet (burn crew might overlap with firefighters I suppose)

 

[Loo.wii]

Today's DOGE wins.
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The only reporting on this is in EADaily - A russian Media organization. The first wiki page on EA daily is literally in russian, LOL you cant make this up. https://www.propastop.org/en/2020/12/01/eadaily-a-worker-bee-in-the-kremlins-information-war/

 

[Jimbee]

The problem what Doge.gov (other than being a terrible name) is that there’s very little proof there. It’s literally links to tweets of screenshots, or links to Musk tweets, if there’s any evidence at all. And in some cases (“condoms for Gaza”) we know that what they claim the money was being used for, isn’t really an accurate summary of how it was being used.

They keep a page up that says “receipts coming by xxxx” but they keep pushing back the date they’ll provide proof by.

It's a problem because people accept it as true because that's what they want to believe and the alternative is that they've been lied to or misled by their idols.