Patched roundball range day

[Natty]

With that, this thing really wants the bore swabbed between shots. 1, it gets very hard to seat the patch and ball past that “ring” if you don’t swab the shots go haywire consistently.

I have fought this before. Very similar experience with accuracy once a persistent crud ring has formed. Not sure what rifle/barrel you are shooting but the more stubborn cases of this I have had have been in percussion t/c rifles. First step is always thorough cleaning then start evaluating/changing variables to try to eliminate the ring formation.

Was the ring there to some degree when you started shooting and then got progressively worse or did it appear suddenly?

Based on previous posts, looks like you are shooting 70gr 3f swiss, .015 prelubed traditions patches and .490 swagged hornady balls correct?

Any history on cleaning methods/schedule used on this rifle?

 

[mtnbound]

Preluded patches so far.

I recall my dad using:
Damp/spit patches.
What he called Dry patch but was a water and oil blend.
Wet/greasey patches which was melted mink oil. Which he also used on his boots.
He had to swab after every shot with the Dry patch.
Spit patch, if I remember correctly he could get by with 2-3 shots before he would swab so long as he had chew in his mouth.
Wet/greasy he could get by with 5-6 and I remember seeing him go as high as 10. He stayed with the Wet/greasy patch but I don’t remember what thickness of patch he used.
I remember him saying “there are so many ways to do this shit I just have to find my way and you need to do the same”. That has stuck with me, **** I miss that old man.

 

[longrangelead]

It's an old kit gun.
my buddy inherited it, he and i went out and he killed a deer with it.
unintentionally, it sat loaded in his safe for 15 years.
He gave it to me when Montana started the "heritage" muzzleloader season that requires a side lock and open sights, etc.

I haven't spent enough time on it yet. I want to change the sights and find a conical load for it.

Form has probably shot it more than me at this point.

 

[BAKPAKR]

View attachment 989061
It's an old kit gun.
my buddy inherited it, he and i went out and he killed a deer with it.
unintentionally, it sat loaded in his safe for 15 years.
He gave it to me when Montana started the "heritage" muzzleloader season that requires a side lock and open sights, etc.

I haven't spent enough time on it yet. I want to change the sights and find a conical load for it.

Form has probably shot it more than me at this point.

If you are going to stick with an aperture sight, you definitely need to get that sight back a ways.

 

[FrontierGander]

Wows that's a very early cva hawken with the walnut stock!

I restored one myself and still enjoy it

 

[longrangelead]

If you are going to stick with an aperture sight, you definitely need to get that sight back a ways.

What do you prefer for eye to sight distance?

I've found it depends on aperture size.
If the rear aperture is too close or too large, I'm looking at the whole front sight through the hole.

too small or far away, not enough of an aiming point or clarity.

I agree, closer to the eye is better to a point.
I either adjust position or aperture size so the front hood is just slightly a ring inside the rear aperture. Stacking ring in ring for precision is the idea.

I need a taller front sight on this rifle and plan to change the rear to a MVA flip up aperture.

 

[longrangelead]

Wows that's a very early cva hawken with the walnut stock!

I restored one myself and still enjoy it

I browned the barrel and touched up some details when I got it as it was poorly fitted and the barrel still raw.

It's fun to shoot and hunt with as is though.

 

[BAKPAKR]

What do you prefer for eye to sight distance?

I've found it depends on aperture size.
If the rear aperture is too close or too large, I'm looking at the whole front sight through the hole.

too small or far away, not enough of an aiming point or clarity.

I agree, closer to the eye is better to a point.
I either adjust position or aperture size so the front hood is just slightly a ring inside the rear aperture. Stacking ring in ring for precision is the idea.

I need a taller front sight on this rifle and plan to change the rear to a MVA flip up aperture.

I like it closer to the eye and then just use a smaller aperature. The old T/Cs side hammers I have seen with an aperture sight had the sight mounted on the tang.

Here are a couple of photos from the internet:

 

[Formidilosus]

I have fought this before. Very similar experience with accuracy once a persistent crud ring has formed. Not sure what rifle/barrel you are shooting but the more stubborn cases of this I have had have been in percussion t/c rifles. First step is always thorough cleaning then start evaluating/changing variables to try to eliminate the ring formation.

I gave it a good cleaning last night. We shall see if that helps.

Was the ring there to some degree when you started shooting and then got progressively worse or did it appear suddenly?

It was there on my first loading. Swabbing with spit patches made it feel like it went away for the one shot. The second shot it would be back.

Based on previous posts, looks like you are shooting 70gr 3f swiss, .015 prelubed traditions patches and .490 swagged hornady balls correct?

Yes sir.

Any history on cleaning methods/schedule used on this rifle?

@longrangelead posted the history- it’s his rifle.

 

[Formidilosus]

If you are going to stick with an aperture sight, you definitely need to get that sight back a ways.

You know, it actually works quite well where it is. It perfectly fits the front globe.

 

[Formidilosus]

Haha. I just thought about it- @longrangelead got me to clean a barrel.

 

[FrontierGander]

If you take your time and strip that finish off. You'll discover some real pretty walnut under there.

No stain, just many many coats of Birchwood Casey genuine oil. Slow rust browned barrel. Bedded stock.

 

[BAKPAKR]

What do you prefer for eye to sight distance?

I've found it depends on aperture size.
If the rear aperture is too close or too large, I'm looking at the whole front sight through the hole.

too small or far away, not enough of an aiming point or clarity.

I agree, closer to the eye is better to a point.
I either adjust position or aperture size so the front hood is just slightly a ring inside the rear aperture. Stacking ring in ring for precision is the idea.

I need a taller front sight on this rifle and plan to change the rear to a MVA flip up aperture.

Are you thinking about an MVA sight like on Matthew Quigley’s Sharps or the simpler Marbles type?

I have a Marbles sight on my 22.

 

[longrangelead]

If you take your time and strip that finish off. You'll discover some real pretty walnut under there.

No stain, just many many coats of Birchwood Casey genuine oil. Slow rust browned barrel. Bedded stock.
View attachment 989089
View attachment 989093
View attachment 989096

nice.
I've considered making a REALLY nice stock for it just because...but then I start thinking about a Gibbs instead...

 

[Formidilosus]

nice.
I've considered making a REALLY nice stock for it just because...but then I start thinking about a Gibbs instead...

This things fun. I’m sure a conical would shoot better, but the PRB’s shoot pretty decent when the bore is swabbed. Hopefully the cleaning helped.

 

[longrangelead]

Are you thinking about an MVA sight like on Matthew Quigley’s Sharps or the simpler Marbles type?

I forget what they call it, but this one. it's a universal type for reciever/barrel flat mounting.
works very well as a backup under a scope too.
comes with three aperture sizes.