Low T replacement

[Formidilosus]

I have not responded in this thread because there is more 100% bullchit with T knowledge and belief than any health subject save diet. I am not a doctor, however this is a subject that I know quite a bit about for various reasons (and no, I am not on TRT). Being that it is health related, I will say a couple of points and you can do what you want with it. If you want info from one of the best open source doctors- google Dr. Brendan Witte. Hunt, harvest, health has a good podcast with him on it.


First, yes there are controlled studies that have been done on TRT/hormone therapy. No, they are not open source... Yet.

Two, your family doctor has almost guaranteed ZERO knowledge of testosterone production, needs, and consequences.

Three, it is total nonsense that a 40 year old should not have the T levels of a 20 year old. If you are a 35 year old male in the US, you have the T levels of a 70 year old afghan male. Think about that.

Four, our very environment is killing testosterone in men. Plastics, herbicides, and yes even birth control in water.

Five, the “normal range” is the “range” that includes 80 year olds. You have a 450-500 T level... sweet you have as much as a healthy 3rd world septuagenarian. Fifty years ago the normal range went to 2,500 naturally. We have consistently been losing Test for the last 5-6 decades. No, it does not matter how healthy you are. There is almost no male that has optimum T levels naturally anymore.

Six, done correctly, and combined with a couple others, your body will continue to produce Test naturally and it is not a life “sentence”.

Seven, the consequences of chronically low T are WAY beyond any consequence of proper TRT. It’s not even close.



Optimized testosterone levels is one of the best things for quality of life, overall health, sanity, and relationships that a male (and female) can have. You dudes that are sticking with the “Test is bad cause doctors say so” nonsense and your ego need to remember that it’s coming from the same source that pushes/pushed grains and carbs as the staple of your diet....

Enjoy your man boobs, love handles, lack of sleep, mood swings, muscle degeneration, and cognitive decline all directly linked to lower than optimum T levels.

 

[KHNC]

I disagree with most all Low T recommendations. But, i dont do Keto either. I am 50, train 4 days a week, all year. I believe working out ...running, lifting, cross training, and a decent diet will cure most anyone. People are too quick to jump on the TRT these days. But what do i know, im not a doctor.

 

[7Bartman]

I have not responded in this thread because there is more 100% bullchit with T knowledge and belief than any health subject save diet. I am not a doctor, however this is a subject that I know quite a bit about for various reasons (and no, I am not on TRT). Being that it is health related, I will say a couple of points and you can do what you want with it. If you want info from one of the best open source doctors- google Dr. Brendan Witte. Hunt, harvest, health has a good podcast with him on it.


First, yes there are controlled studies that have been done on TRT/hormone therapy. No, they are not open source... Yet.

Two, your family doctor has almost guaranteed ZERO knowledge of testosterone production, needs, and consequences.

Three, it is total nonsense that a 40 year old should not have the T levels of a 20 year old. If you are a 35 year old male in the US, you have the T levels of a 70 year old afghan male. Think about that.

Four, our very environment is killing testosterone in men. Plastics, herbicides, and yes even birth control in water.

Five, the “normal range” is the “range” that includes 80 year olds. You have a 450-500 T level... sweet you have as much as a healthy 3rd world septuagenarian. Fifty years ago the normal range went to 2,500 naturally. We have consistently been losing Test for the last 5-6 decades. No, it does not matter how healthy you are. There is almost no male that has optimum T levels naturally anymore.

Six, done correctly, and combined with a couple others, your body will continue to produce Test naturally and it is not a life “sentence”.

Seven, the consequences of chronically low T are WAY beyond any consequence of proper TRT. It’s not even close.



Optimized testosterone levels is one of the best things for quality of life, overall health, sanity, and relationships that a male (and female) can have. You dudes that are sticking with the “Test is bad cause doctors say so” nonsense and your ego need to remember that it’s coming from the same source that pushes/pushed grains and carbs as the staple of your diet....

Enjoy your man boobs, love handles, lack of sleep, mood swings, muscle degeneration, and cognitive decline all directly linked to lower than optimum T levels.

You do realize that "Dr" Witte isn't really a physician. He has some scam degree as an "ND" not an "MD". You might not realize it, but there is a huge distinction, primarily in training, oversight, licensing, and prescribing ability. I can usually pick up on these types pretty quickly as they constantly refer to themselves as "Dr". Many of the things you point out above are incorrect, but I don't have the time to address them now. All I say is "caveat emptor".

 

[magnum44270]

At age 30 i got my levels tested for the first time, 113. No wonder i was feeling like shit; tired all the time, falling asleep while driving, falling asleep anytime i sat down. No drive to do the things i used to love and live for....started T injections weekly and also got tested for sleep apnea, which i had and is a major contributor to low T......i feel better now, but even with weekly T and cpap i dont feel as good as the Drs and people say i should. It takes the edge off. Wish it did more.

 

[magnum44270]

I started TRT 5 weeks ago my t count was 525 and estrogen count was 87. I take 150 mg in intramuscular shot every Wednesday and 1/2 pill of estrogen blocker. I did my blood work last week and my T count is now 1236 and my estrogen level is 16.7 and I feel great.

Shit, id love 525.. 113 at age 30 sucked

 

[magnum44270]

"Low T" is essentially a made-up patho-physiology by pharma. Aside from a few unique cases of hypogonadism, declining testosterone is a normal part of ageing. While testosterone injections will certainly make you feel better/younger/more virile, you have to remember that you're suppressing your endogenous testosterone production and will need additional drugs to get things back up and running once you cycle off. In addition, increased testosterone has been associated with a number of rare, but serious complications, including increased risk of clotting and subsequent CV risk. Last, you're going to basically have to stay on this for life. Not saying it's the worst option for many, but it's important to consider the long game in this algorithm."

Unless you live in a big city or have deep pockets its actually pretty ******* hard to get a doctor To start trt.....Its not like depression meds or pain killers, they just dont hand them out.

Long term issues beat the alternative of feeling like shit, sleeping all the time and dealing with depression.

 

[Mike Islander]

At age 30 i got my levels tested for the first time, 113. No wonder i was feeling like shit; tired all the time, falling asleep while driving, falling asleep anytime i sat down. No drive to do the things i used to love and live for....started T injections weekly and also got tested for sleep apnea, which i had and is a major contributor to low T......i feel better now, but even with weekly T and cpap i dont feel as good as the Drs and people say i should. It takes the edge off. Wish it did more.

Are you lifting heavy weights with large muscle groups a few times a week? Nothing else you can do will raise more T, and also will make you feel better.

 

[magnum44270]

Are you lifting heavy weights with large muscle groups a few times a week? Nothing else you can do will raise more T, and also will make you feel better.

10.5 years in the military, lifted and worked out like crazy. Was a personal trainer and fitness instructor for 7 of those years. I'm 5'7 .At 23 i was 172lb and 9%bf lifting heavy. At 25 was 168lb, cut and fought amature mma at 155..... Somewhere around 27 things went down hill; tired all the time, would fall asleep anytime i sat down and while driving. Drive to do the things i enjoyed was gone. Drive to workout was gone; still continued to force myself as i had to pass pt test. Ate clean and Even with workouts weight crept up. At 29 i got out of the Mil, weight was 190-200. Started a new career and did my first insurance blood draw. Found my T levels were 113, doctors pointed it out but didnt do or say anything to fix it. At 32 i was feling like dog shit. Falling asleep while driving at work, fatigued and depressed. I finally decided to search out a doctor to look at addressing my low T. Had levels ran again, 132. Started weekley injections and things started to get better, not great but better. Not a night and day difference but not wanting to crawl into a hole and die anylonger....35 now and i continue with weekly injections. Still workout 4-5 times a week. I light heavy, squats, deadlifts, sprints weighted pack inclines... Weight is currently 182

 

[jorgensen.travis]

Our healthcare and insurance system are set up to fix things that are wrong with us. That’s why this discussion is based on whether or not people “need” TRT. I approached the subject from an enhancement point of view. I was in good shape and performing at a high level, and felt good when I started it. I was getting into my late 30’s, and knew things were going to get harder and harder for me to maintain or improve physically. So I started it with an anti-aging, preventative point of view. Going on 5 years now, I feel at least as good as when I started. The problem with looking at it this way, is that people start thinking about fairness and cheating and it becomes a moral discussion. As for the guys suggesting to eat right and exercise. Why does it have to be either or? Why not in addition to?




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[Mossy]

Tested the other day with a level of 414. Doctor won’t do anything about it even with all the symptoms.

Very interesting thread; lots of great info

 

[*zap*]

Does not have to be either/or. Do a year of correct nutrition, all natural foods and even omega 3 to omega 6 intake. Get your probiotic levels right. Eat a serving of broccoli before sleep every day. In that year get on a good strength training program that includes posterior chain lifts done with proper form. Increase the weight you are using gradually while doing the exercise properly. Get adequate rest during that year and cut down on emotional stress. See where you are at after a year of that and your body fat% is in the low teens.
If your not doing that type strength training program and your body fat% is high and you start t supps your looking for an e-z way, of course there may be some exceptions to that.

 

[Trr15]

Does not have to be either/or. Do a year of correct nutrition, all natural foods and even omega 3 to omega 6 intake. Get your probiotic levels right. Eat a serving of broccoli before sleep every day. In that year get on a good strength training program that includes posterior chain lifts done with proper form. Increase the weight you are using gradually while doing the exercise properly. Get adequate rest during that year and cut down on emotional stress. See where you are at after a year of that and your body fat% is in the low teens.
If your not doing that type strength training program and your body fat% is high and you start t supps your looking for an e-z way, of course there may be some exceptions to that.

If only real life was as easy as it is on the internet. All of our problems would be solved as simply as you laid out your solution to Low-T.

 

[*zap*]

Real life is as e-z as you make it by planning and using patience and hard work. I did not post a solution to low T. I posted a way a person might get their T level up without taking pharmaceuticals which imo is what someone should try first.
63 years old, take no T supps and never have, the staff at my gym all think I am on T supps. Maybe what I proposed works?

 

[jorgensen.travis]

We’ll see who’s on the “Fat Guy Weekly Weigh In” thread next year. It wasn’t me this year, and it won’t be me next year.


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[Formidilosus]

You do realize that "Dr" Witte isn't really a physician. He has some scam degree as an "ND" not an "MD". You might not realize it, but there is a huge distinction, primarily in training, oversight, licensing, and prescribing ability. I can usually pick up on these types pretty quickly as they constantly refer to themselves as "Dr". Many of the things you point out above are incorrect, but I don't have the time to address them now. All I say is "caveat emptor".

I’m well aware of who and what he is.

 

[Cockeye]

Tested the other day with a level of 414. Doctor won’t do anything about it even with all the symptoms.

Very interesting thread; lots of great info

What was your free T and your shbg numbers

 

[Cockeye]

Shit, id love 525.. 113 at age 30 sucked

A1C: 8.1
Testosterone: 542
PSA: 0.8
Estradiol: 38.6
Hemoglobin: 15.6
SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin) 85/6
Free testosterone: 5.74
I’ve been on TrT for 7 weeks now after my first blood work of 4 weeks

A1C: 7.2
Testosterone: 1236
Estradiol: 16.8
Hemoglobin: 16.2
I was taking 150 weekly they have taken it back to 130 weekly shots.
As type 1 diabetic A1C is huge in my life. Next week is blood work should be around between 1000

 

[Cockeye]

Can’t say I feel 20 but I feel like a young 49 again. And I’ve been working out 4 days a week for 90 minutes aday and leaving to go home to Montana in nine days for 16 days of elk bear muley hunting in little belts.

 

[Cockeye]

Does not have to be either/or. Do a year of correct nutrition, all natural foods and even omega 3 to omega 6 intake. Get your probiotic levels right. Eat a serving of broccoli before sleep every day. In that year get on a good strength training program that includes posterior chain lifts done with proper form. Increase the weight you are using gradually while doing the exercise properly. Get adequate rest during that year and cut down on emotional stress. See where you are at after a year of that and your body fat% is in the low teens.
If your not doing that type strength training program and your body fat% is high and you start t supps your looking for an e-z way, of course there may be some exceptions to that.

That’s all you have to do. No problem

 

[jorgensen.travis]

I get a treatment called Biote. It’s a “bioidentical” implant that last 6 months. It’s part of a preventative medicine program that includes regular blood panels. They look at your blood and suggest taking supplements or medications to get everything where they want it. Not just hormones.


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