Form struck someone’s nerve

[Dixie]

Fudd following this thread… or possibly after binge listening 1- 2 of the JVB or maybe the last Shoot 2 Hunt podcast

 

[Hoopleheader]

This is stupid. The debate is tired and annoying. The loud ones on both sides come off as giant, arrogant douches.

100%

Now where is your photographic evidence?

 

[Hnthrdr]

Reminds me, where was JVB on the Prop 127?


He make any comments on it or sit that one out?

Don’t really know who he is, but heck where were most of the big players?! Howl, CFRWM, and mostly just average joe hunters res and non res fought that one off, at least ole Steven was vocal about it. I know some of the big name orgs game big checks but my local archery range spent 50k… I honestly expected more out of a lot of the big players

 

[KHntr]

I hunt region 7 and 3 mostly. I shoot a 6.5 PRC so I don’t shoot a cannon myself. I draw the line at what I am using.

If you hunt 7 and were solo would you honestly choose to pack a .22 arc or a .223 over something a little bigger?

I hunt solo 90%+ of the time. I carried a 22 centerfire 100% of the season this year, starting with spring bears through to backpacking stone sheep trip, then Haida Gwaii, then a bull elk, then a bull moose. Predominantly a 223AI with 88 ELD m. Only variation was going to a 223 with 77TMK on whitetails, just to scratch a specific rifle itch...

Last fall I carried a 223AI, solo, on our 2 day moose season. Same as the year before. Same as this year. Killed a big tripalm/ten point in full on grizz country all on my lonesome, same as most years. 3 bull moose in 3 years, 88 ELD m, on a 2 day, highly restrictive antler tine season. Shots can be quick, at odd angles, at varying distances.
I own at least 5 or 6 (7? 10?) larger caliber rifles in "moose/elk appropriate" cartridges that are accurate, scoped, ready to go, but I'm completely confident in the effectiveness of the bullet I use to put animals on the ground faster with a 22 centerfire.
Of course, I could step up to a similar constructed bullet and run it through a larger chambered rifle, but I typically kill stuff inside 500 yards and I don't see any benefit that would outweigh the amount of meat loss that would occur, unless of course a heavier rifle that is louder, kicks harder, and burns more powder is going to bring me happiness on that particular day.

Every single time I step out the door, even walking in my driveway to get in my truck, I"m in grizzly country. A pair of sub adults licked up all the oats in my tack shed in November. That is all of 200m from my barbeque. My cartridge of choice this year was 223AI with an 88 ELDm, hunting solo. If I were of a need to kill something RFN, that was trying to bite me, based on the wound channels I have seen from 223AI-88ELDm-77TMK/243AI-105 Amax, I would pick a 22 centerfire every single time. Simply because I want the maximum amount of carnage I can inflict, and maybe, just maybe, I might get a chance at getting a second round off because its a lighter, faster rifle to handle with a shorter bolt throw and less recoil.
With a 300 Ultra or 45/70 or 300WM I'm only going to get one chance due to recoil, and I don't load those with anything that even comes close to the damage inflicted by an ELD m or TMK.

Even with a fringe hit on the edges, I have a lot more faith in a match bullet making a big football size hole in stuff and maybe touching something fatal around the edges, instead of poking a small hole in a straight line for feet of penetration, that HAS to punch something important to be effective.

One thing I have seen with my own eyes, after a couple + decades of punching mono's and bonded bullets into animals big and small, is that hard bullets kill stuff slower. Way slower.
Bullets like the Amax and ELD m, and TMK are decisively faster killers. If I'm betting my personal well being, or my kids well being on killing something as fast as possible, I damn sure am going to hedge my bets and go with what I KNOW kills stuff the fastest.
Oddly enough, I know quite a few guys that have been tagged by grizzlies to varying levels of scar tissue, and one thing they all have said, is that time slows waaaaay down when you are getting bit and clawed and slapped across the ground. 20 seconds can seem like a lifetime in that scenario, so I can't even imagine what 90 seconds would feel like when you are waiting for that hard bullet to finish what it started IF you hit organs.... Be the longest 3 minutes of the end of your life, if you just missed lung with a mono and only broke a leg bone while you waited for the bear to decide you aren't a risk anymore......

 

[MT_Wyatt]

Looks like his “part 2” bull got pulled from apple podcasts as well. Who knows why, but I sure do like to see that nonsense get retracted.

 

[The Guide]

Looks like his “part 2” bull got pulled from apple podcasts as well. Who knows why, but I sure do like to see that nonsense get retracted.

He would never do a full retraction. It will just disappear like it never happened and we all just imagined it.

Jay

 

[mitchellmountain]

He would never do a full retraction. It will just disappear like it never happened and we all just imagined it.

Jay

I put a comment on his insta page, It was critical of his rebuttal podcast but constructive not insulting. We had a small exchange and he stated he would in fact produce a retraction if he is proven wrong. I tend to believe he will.

 

[The Guide]

I put a comment on his insta page, It was critical of his rebuttal podcast but constructive not insulting. We had a small exchange and he stated he would in fact produce a retraction if he is proven wrong. I tend to believe he will.

Must have been a private message as I see nothing visible that is public. JVB has deleted episodes before with no response due to controversy. I have little hope for anything this time either.

Jay

 

[Billogna]

Must have been a private message as I see nothing visible that is public. JVB has deleted episodes before with no response due to controversy. I have little hope for anything this time either.

Jay

Some of the things he was saying in that episode were willfully ignorant at best, and borderline slanderous. He was walking a pretty fine line and he knew it, hence all the doubling back on himself and recusing statements like "I wasn't there and this is just one guys opinion... BUT!!" I wouldn't be surprised if the legal team advised he remove it.

 

[robby denning]

There's too many to delete on here, but let's keep the discussion to the facts of the debate, not insults on hat choice and voice inflection.

I mean if the other side started making fun of Ryan's beard, I'd be fired up and releasing the Meme gang on them lol

 

[MountainTracker]

There's too many to delete on here, but let's keep the discussion to the facts of the debate, not insults on hat choice and voice inflection.

I mean if the other side started making fun of Ryan's beard, I'd be fired up and releasing the Meme gang on them lol

Meme gang standing by!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[JohnJohnson]

There's too many to delete on here, but let's keep the discussion to the facts of the debate, not insults on hat choice and voice inflection.

I mean if the other side started making fun of Ryan's beard, I'd be fired up and releasing the Meme gang on them lol

My bad. Though for the most part he seems to just not like the vibes of smaller calibers. Trying to find concrete things he said that can be addressed has been kind of difficult. Glad he took down the second episode and I look forward to him (hopefully) following through and going on the Exo podcast to talk to them.

 

[robby denning]

Meme gang standing by!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I knew you were

 

[Hnthrdr]

 

[Hnthrdr]

This is how I make fun of hats without being too mean… unless your name is Indiana Jones, no fedora will ever look cool (IMO) sorry not sorry

 

[TaperPin]

Fudd following this thread… or possibly after binge listening 1- 2 of the JVB or maybe the last Shoot 2 Hunt podcast
View attachment 807521

This made me almost spit out the morning coffee - I tried to follow the pages of little angry cartridges yelling in chipmunk voices, but my eyes were getting heavy - then this photo made my morning. Lol

 

[Schmo]

JVB said he wasn’t sure how form could’ve taken hundreds of elk. Well, he hunts multiple states, but he also hunts with a lot of people and has been a firsthand witness. JVB said that if Form’s hundreds of elk were from an elk ranch, that it wouldn’t count as to bullet performance. That’s ludicrous. An elk is an elk is an elk, doesn’t matter if it’s running around the Rockies or in a high fence ranch.

 

[Billogna]

I guess our particular cervidae elkus mid-westerni don't count either then.

 

[Hnthrdr]

JVB said he wasn’t sure how form could’ve taken hundreds of elk. Well, he hunts multiple states, but he also hunts with a lot of people and has been a firsthand witness. JVB said that if Form’s hundreds of elk were from an elk ranch, that it wouldn’t count as to bullet performance. That’s ludicrous. An elk is an elk is an elk, doesn’t matter if it’s running around the Rockies or in a high fence ranch.

Your first mistake is underestimating the power of Rut crazed free range bull elk!

 

[robby denning]

This is how I make fun of hats without being too mean… unless your name is Indiana Jones, no fedora will ever look cool (IMO) sorry not sorry

well crap, now you guys finally tell me....