College Help

[LoggerDan]

Four years in the Service isn’t a bad idea….
I love love AK, let me tell you. But, it can be a terrible place to be with no family and coping with winter. Alaska is Alcoholic as it gets. The winter is terribly hard to deal with, especially your first couple of years. This leads to heavy drinking. A young man with no life experience, far from home and his people, in a setting where partying is the norm, can soon lead to some hard times. The educated and the unschooled, the old and the young, the poor, middle and affluent, all can easily find themselves drinking more than they probably should. I started fishing out of Dutch at 19. I’ve logged up here a long time. In 20 years,things don’t change; so many people come up here thinking that Alaska fill fix something or fill a void or they think it’s The Place to straighten up…. I’m not saying that this is going to happen to your son. But it could.

Also, unless he is from up here, very few teenagers have the outdoor experience to solo hunt AK. It’s an easy place to make a mistake, at worst, and an easy place to spend money and be discouraged by lack of local knowledge.

 

[BadEarth]

I got my degree in mechanical engineering from South Dakota state, and so did one of my roommates. He’s currently a biomedical engineer for Mayo and I got a great job in Montana right out of school. We hunted our tail off all through school. You’ve just got to prioritize. If he loves to hunt and is dedicated to getting the degree he wants, then he will make both work. We made plenty of time to do what we love and also worked our tail off studying and got good grades.

 

[handwerk]

Both my sons took a year off to work and became residents in MT and then went to school paying a lot less for tuition. That year off gave them time to save money, figure out their major and have a lot of fun in the backcountry.

 

[Mt Al]

Another comment, similar to others:

Whatever he wants to do, he can find a good college and degree in any of the states listed, get a great education and have a blast doing what he loves. I have and had many friends leave Montana, get a degree/job/location-because-of-the-job and most are fine, but all really miss the West and feel cheated out on a hugely important part of their early lives.

If you have the cash, fly him to Fairbanks/Anchorage right now so he'll see what school will be like when he's in session. Have him take a serious look at the difference between popping out the door to fish, shoot gophers, hunt coyotes/birds/deer/etc. in the lower 48 all through the school year vs. what's available on the weekends in AK. Might be better, I have no idea.

I'm an MSU person, love it and loved it, but was a resident when I graduated and MSU was my only real choice to get an engineering degree. Hunted and fished like crazy all through college and did OK, thank God A students work for C students. This was back before Montana was cool and MSU was Moo-U and known as a hick town. Hard to imagine it would become what it is now.

Have family near Moscow, ID and that is a killer place for the outdoors, very tough to beat and WSU is right there as another option. IMHO, this would be the top of the list in the lower 48 for hunting/fishing/being outside when going through college.

I'd add South Dakota School of Mines to the list. Western SD is an awesome place.

U oF M, Missoula is great for business, law, forestry, pharmacy, any pre-med/pre-vet and liberal arts. Also great outdoor opportunities, but loads of people nearby like Bozeman. Drive a few hours and you're free and feel like you went back in time.

Alaska? I worked in AK for a summer and consulted here and there, zero long term experience, but after being there I have more respect for the residents toughness and have no desire to move there. Hats off to all you AK long termers!

Good on your son for wanting to chase his passions while in school. It kept me sane and have so many memories and don't regret one single marginal grade in a class because I didn't study as much as I could have.

 

[WV Mountaineer]

As someone who graduated from a college in the states you're mentioning.... if he gets a degree that pays well instead of wasting time and racking up debt he will have to apply himself. In doing so, he will have little to no time to hunt. Nearly half of my class loved hunting and we have big game hunting within 30 minutes of campus. In fact, deer would walk around on campus sometimes and I actually went to calculus class holding my waiders and fly gear because I walked to the river and fished afterwards. All that being said, only 1 of the 50+ kids who said they like hunting actually had the time to go. As cool as it is, he likely won't have time

My

As someone who graduated from a college in the states you're mentioning.... if he gets a degree that pays well instead of wasting time and racking up debt he will have to apply himself. In doing so, he will have little to no time to hunt. Nearly half of my class loved hunting and we have big game hunting within 30 minutes of campus. In fact, deer would walk around on campus sometimes and I actually went to calculus class holding my waiders and fly gear because I walked to the river and fished afterwards. All that being said, only 1 of the 50+ kids who said they like hunting actually had the time to go. As cool as it is, he likely won't have time

My last forestry job paid well into 6 figures. I graduated with a 2.5 gpa

My point is some fields use academics as hiring criteria. Others fields don’t put as much stock and are more interested in what you get accomplished in the real world work environment.

I asked my buddy in law school if he was worried about his 2.2 gpa. His reply was it doesn’t matter whether he’s top of the class or the last in class. He still graduates as a lawyer. 25 years later, he’s a very successful one too.

For each it’s different. College was very easy for me. I often missed days in a row to hunt or fish. My GPA could easily have been in the mid 3’s. But, I chose to enjoy things equally.

I paid for it. The choice was mine and one I don’t regret at all. So, the choice was easy for me. I was still a forester and not once, government jobs aside, did I discuss my gpa during the hiring process of every forestry job I ever had. And, I never interviewed for a forestry position I didn’t get either.

 

[Tod osier]

My

My last forestry job paid well into 6 figures. I graduated with a 2.5 gpa

My point is some fields use academics as hiring criteria. Others fields don’t put as much stock and are more interested in what you get accomplished in the real world work environment.

I asked my buddy in law school if he was worried about his 2.2 gpa. His reply was it doesn’t matter whether he’s top of the class or the last in class. He still graduates as a lawyer. 25 years later, he’s a very successful one too.

For each it’s different. College was very easy for me. I often missed days in a row to hunt or fish. My GPA could easily have been in the mid 3’s. But, I chose to enjoy things equally.

I paid for it. The choice was mine and one I don’t regret at all. So, the choice was easy for me. I was still a forester and not once, government jobs aside, did I discuss my gpa during the hiring process of every forestry job I ever had. And, I never interviewed for a forestry position I didn’t get either.

This is exactly why so many asked what the kid is interested in.

 

[CodeMonkey]

This is exactly why so many asked what the kid is interested in.

100% agree. Some of the advice here is absolute poison for someone in my field and would lead to no serious jobs offers out of school and limiting overall career trajectory. I mean I guess you can become that guy at Boeing who oversees offshore "engineers" and is supposed to QA their code only to miss things that get people killed when a bunch of 737 Max aircraft crash.

My personal advice would be to focus your 20s on career growth and wealth. Investing early on for retirement is a huge advantage over trying to "catch up" later. I probably overdid it, but there's currently a chance I'll be retired before I'm 40 and never have to miss a kid's sports game or holiday due to work.

 

[texastea23]

My son is starting to look at colleges that he wants to attend. He is a pretty smart kid but his decision will be based heavily on hunting opportunities. His mainly looking at colleges in Alaska, Wyoming, Montana and Idaho. He would prefer to go to Alaska but I am not sure being that far from home and in that type of weather will work but he says that's where he wants to go. Anyone who has gone to school in Alaska which university would you suggest. Also do they have any student discounts as far as resident hunting licenses for non residents. I would prefer one of the other three states but his thinking is he might as well do Alaska when he is young and chase his hunting goals that he would probably not ever be able to afford as a non resident.

Any other colleges offer non residents in state hunting opportunities when you are a student.

Thanks

I mean not exactly western hunting but hocking college in SE ohio is the outdoorsman’s dream of a college. Nestled in the national forest and several state forests so it’s free land to hunt and you can do a 2+2 in natural resource programs with either Ohio State or WVU. Ohio has to be one of the cheaper non res licenses for almost everything too.

Another option is pursuing a bachelors degree in forestry, surveying, or some other Nat res degree where he wants to work/live permanently and he can scout while working those summer internships

 

[FatCampzWife]

I’d look at South Dakota State as well. I’m biased since it’s my alma mater, but it’s a great school with a ton of outdoor opportunities. You have a great flyaway for waterfowl, lots of deer opportunities, antelope, coyotes, great fishing, and lots of public ground. We never had trouble finding something to chase….after our school work was done (usually)

It's a "great" school for certain degrees, not all.

Worked/taught there 30 years, in addition to getting 3 degrees there.

SoDak does have some hunting opportunities, but it's VERY easy to get in with kids at SDSU who are just (barely) going to school to avoid getting an adult job.

There are also some very dedicated, wonderful students attending.

If he really wants to spend time hunting, & an education is secondary, he should seriously consider a 2 year (or less) program at a trade school (plenty located in the areas he likes). Less time in school, less money spent (could potentially get it paid for), & a good job at the end. The self employed folks I know work hard & play harder, and set their own hours after "paying their dues", so to speak.

 

[Marbles]

Tell him to take a year or two off and work for a guide in Alaska. Then hammer through college.

 

[KurtR]

It's a "great" school for certain degrees, not all.

Worked/taught there 30 years, in addition to getting 3 degrees there.

SoDak does have some hunting opportunities, but it's VERY easy to get in with kids at SDSU who are just (barely) going to school to avoid getting an adult job.

There are also some very dedicated, wonderful students attending.

If he really wants to spend time hunting, & an education is secondary, he should seriously consider a 2 year (or less) program at a trade school (plenty located in the areas he likes). Less time in school, less money spent (could potentially get it paid for), & a good job at the end. The self employed folks I know work hard & play harder, and set their own hours after "paying their dues", so to speak.

The thing with the tech schools i went to both sdsu and lake area is they have an attendance if you miss 7 days and they dont care why you are kicked out. I spent more time in class there in my 2 years than i did my 2 at sdsu but it was 100 percent in the subject so that made it easier. I got done with 2 years and with my half tuition through guards i had 8 grand in loans to pay back had that much stacked up in one semester at state. Plenty of hunting and fishing in both places but i grew up in watertown so I didnt have to find places. Bash in the grass and hobo days are still memories or what we remember we still talk about.

 

[stank.243]

It's a "great" school for certain degrees, not all.

Worked/taught there 30 years, in addition to getting 3 degrees there.

SoDak does have some hunting opportunities, but it's VERY easy to get in with kids at SDSU who are just (barely) going to school to avoid getting an adult job.

There are also some very dedicated, wonderful students attending.

If he really wants to spend time hunting, & an education is secondary, he should seriously consider a 2 year (or less) program at a trade school (plenty located in the areas he likes). Less time in school, less money spent (could potentially get it paid for), & a good job at the end. The self employed folks I know work hard & play harder, and set their own hours after "paying their dues", so to speak.

Not to turn this thread into "Is SDSU a good school", but I am curious which degrees you think they lack in. I know a pretty diverse group, as it pertains to degrees, and all have been extremely successful in their careers. And yes that's with hunting and fishing all school year long.
And to say he could fall in with a bad crowd at SDSU specifically...well that's just ignorant. That can happen at any University, Trade School or no school at all. If he can't find good friends then it's his own fault.

SDSU rant over.

I'll add my .02 again as it pertains to the thread. You can go to a 4 year school AND hunt/fish/enjoy the outdoors. I know many successful people who have done that, myself included. It doesn't sound like he wants to go to an MIT or Harvard to be a big time engineer/programmer/lawyer/etc.. If we knew what types of programs he wanted to pursue this might be a simpler discussion.
Have him go somewhere he wants to be and is going to enjoy. Whether it's a 4 year, 2 year, or trade school. He won't be sitting in his dorm 24/7 studying. He could be hunting and fishing or...he could be downing a fifth of fireball, shotgunning some beers and raising hell with nothing else to do.

 

[mooretitan]

We will need to figure out exactly what areas he is interested. One thing for sure it will have to pay well and provide lots of time off for hunting. Something I am sure all of us want I went to a Big 10 school and would have had more than enough time to bird hunt and fish. I still managed to graduate with a 3.5 with all the wasted time chasing girls and sports and partying. Wish I could go back but oh well. Glad he is thinking about things I did not take the time to think about.

He is a pretty smart kid, straight a student, pre engineering classes in high school, probably do some programing next year and take some JC classes while in high school. Has always tested very high on any state test so I am sure he is intelligent enough to do most things. He is also a pretty hard working but likes to be around like minded people, loves joking around.

He loves to debate, loves sports stats, creates list after list of players, animals. He has talked about engineering, possibly law. He was talking this weekend about maybe the air force and becoming a pilot. He loves the outdoors and I could see him in some type of that field but he worries it will cut into hunting season and not make enough money to hunt everything he wants.

He kept showing me the weather report in Alaska this weekend and kept saying its not that could. I told him sure but could he get a morning hunt in and be back for the NFL play offs that he likes to watch. We were able to get quick successful hunt in and back before the games started. I really think he would enjoy a lower 48 college with the opportunity to always be doing something. I might be wrong but from everything I have heard, Alaska is not just a quick evening/morning hunt or weekend type state. The hunting might be great but he will need the time and money, access to really enough Alaska.

He still has time to work it all out which is good, plus he is thinking big picture, lifestyle that he wants to live

Thanks

 

[MallardSX2]

He should go to a school in the state so he doesn’t pay out the nose in tuition.

That opinion comes from a guy who went to school In state and I was still $100,000 in debt when he got out …..it would have been over double that if I had went to school out of state…

Going to school out of state is a bad decision.

 

[BadEarth]

My

My last forestry job paid well into 6 figures. I graduated with a 2.5 gpa

My point is some fields use academics as hiring criteria. Others fields don’t put as much stock and are more interested in what you get accomplished in the real world work environment.

I asked my buddy in law school if he was worried about his 2.2 gpa. His reply was it doesn’t matter whether he’s top of the class or the last in class. He still graduates as a lawyer. 25 years later, he’s a very successful one too.

For each it’s different. College was very easy for me. I often missed days in a row to hunt or fish. My GPA could easily have been in the mid 3’s. But, I chose to enjoy things equally.

I paid for it. The choice was mine and one I don’t regret at all. So, the choice was easy for me. I was still a forester and not once, government jobs aside, did I discuss my gpa during the hiring process of every forestry job I ever had. And, I never interviewed for a forestry position I didn’t get either.

This is spot on. My worst week I skipped 15 out of 16 classes to hunt I’ll always remember the hunts, the early mornings with buddies, rushing to class in waders and face paint. But I’ll never remember the classes I could have done better in. I had a 2.9 and got a job just like all the 4.0s.

When I graduated and started interviewing they asked 2 main questions. Do you have a degree, and what’s your experience. I’ve never been asked about GPA or anything with college. Employers know 90% of what you’ll do is learned on the job, and are way more concerned with if you’re willing to learn and have good people skills.

 

[Cheechako]

I am currently a grad student at UAF and did my undergrad in Montana. UAF was also my top choice for my undergrad and I am so glad I chose Montana knowing what I do now.
I had quicker and more affordable access to good hunting and fishing year round in Missoula, it was better for my social life, and more affordable as an in-state student with a scholarship and cost of living.
I have lived in Anchorage (UAA) and now in Fairbanks and housing off campus is expensive and competitive even for marginal apartments and dry cabins (fairbanks). From what I’ve seen neither university really has a student life I’d interested in for undergrad.
The majority of hunting opportunity is packed into May and June and August/ September. That can be hard with classes (especially starting out) and makes it easy to get behind in the fall and check out early in the spring.

 

[woods89]

If I could do it again tomorrow, I would've been on a plane the day after HS graduation to work for an outfitter or at a lodge in Alaska. Then come October I would've found another job and started piling up money while gaining life experience. Repeat for a couple of years and hunt and fish as much as possible in between. Jobs like those are great for the outdoor types, and you're meeting new clients every day (mostly very successful in their career) that will open your mind to a potential future career you've likely never even heard of. Find a job like this: https://www.pbadventures.com/employment (that one is probably already taken)

There's a whole other thread (Texas Gun Laws) talking about what is an adult. We're asking kids with zero life experience outside of their parent's house to make a $60,000 commitment to what they want to do for the rest of their life. Most college kids can't even decide on their favorite beer. This is why we're seeing shortages in the workforce. The younger generations are quitting and changing jobs because they're not happy with the career they thought they wanted when they were 18 and not willing to tie themselves to that unhappiness for 40 years like generations before. It's also a huge factor in this student loan mess we have with kids going to school for 7 years and changing majors 4 times.

If I had an eighteen year old, I would recommend to them to gain some life experience and then decide on a career and school. I would have a conversation about the money you've saved for them and set a very strict work and life standard and timeline for them to receive it in the future to keep them motivated and on task/schedule. (I apologize for the unsolicited advice. But it checks his box on gaining adventure and experience while young without throwing your money away on a school that's not the right fit)

Great post. I've watched a few people go through college in their late 20s/early 30s, and it worked very well for them. They knew what they wanted, had a level of perserverance that you don't have in your late teens, and thrived.

 

[woods89]

Personally, I feel like the trades are better than college, but it doesn't sound like that's what he wants to do.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

Interesting you say that. If a young guy hires on out of high school with an outfit doing HVAC, electrical, plumbing, even general construction type work, or quite a few other fields, and buckles down and learns it very well, he can be starting his own business in his late 20s or so. Most people have no clue how much they may be paying, say, a service plumber in the next 5-10 years.

It's not for everyone, but there is a massive disconnect in the advice a lot of young people are getting as to where some of the opportunities are in the coming future.

 

[Blowdowner]

My son is starting to look at colleges that he wants to attend. He is a pretty smart kid but his decision will be based heavily on hunting opportunities. His mainly looking at colleges in Alaska, Wyoming, Montana and Idaho. He would prefer to go to Alaska but I am not sure being that far from home and in that type of weather will work but he says that's where he wants to go. Anyone who has gone to school in Alaska which university would you suggest. Also do they have any student discounts as far as resident hunting licenses for non residents. I would prefer one of the other three states but his thinking is he might as well do Alaska when he is young and chase his hunting goals that he would probably not ever be able to afford as a non resident.

Any other colleges offer non residents in state hunting opportunities when you are a student.

Thanks

Important he gets a job that gives him the time to hunt a lot afterwards. I will tell him to put it on the back burner for four years

 

[tstith]

Just my $.02 here, Wyoming has 7ish colleges but only one four year university- University of Wyoming. I went to a junior college in Wyoming and it was dirt cheap compared to where I finished my bachelors. The quality of education was good, especially for the cost. I think the Western Undergraduate Exchange (WUE) program still exists and keeps college as affordable as college can be nowadays. I would encourage him to take into account the quality of education in a particular college program and the cost of that college. Its also worth mentioning the cost of living is still relatively low in Wyoming if he ended up living off campus.

My brother went to Black Hills State in Spearfish SD and had a positive experience as well. My older sister went to the University of Wyoming and bleeds brown and gold. I know a ton of people who went to several colleges around the area. If he is considering Wyoming or Western South Dakota, I can talk to him about the areas and whatnot.

After 10 years out of college, what I will say is don't overpay for a degree.