.223, 6mm, and 6.5 failures on big game

[deerhunter628]

I'm curious to learn more about this.

What was the shot placement?

Did you fire a follow-up shot? If so, with what effect?

Did you do an autopsy?

Any photos?

Heart shot, no follow up shot. I did not see any reason to take a pic of dead medium size doe

 

[fwafwow]

Would you be able to extend your knowledge to those of us that have learned otherwise?

I too was a “1,500 ft lbs at impact for elk” guy, because that’s what I was taught. As recent as 4 or 5 years ago you would have seen me shooting heavier hitting guns for cow elk depredation hunts (where I’ll be in both Wyoming and Idaho this year shortly). I shoot “long range” on those hunts and wanted to maintain “all the energy” down range, as I was taught. I also used .243 and .264 guns since the late 90s but held those to “closer ranges” and used my .30s and 7mms for the long shots.

Once I started killing using impact velocity as the metric instead of ft lbs, I found that kills came just the same; and allowed me to use my .243 and .260 at much longer ranges.

There’s a lot more to the story as I’ve used “match” and “tipped” style bullets for 10 seasons now, and learned a lot on deer and elk using those. Much to the dismay of several folks I shot and hunted with, but I was still misinformed on “energy” for a long time after.

He just trollin’

 

[Formidilosus]

Yes. I have shot hundreds of deer. All with larger cartridges and they all have left blood trails.

Ok. I’ve shot a bunch of deer with 6.5’s, 7mm, 30cals, and 338’s that left no blood trials.

 

[Formidilosus]

Heart shot, no follow up shot. I did not see any reason to take a pic of dead medium size doe

So you heart shot a deer, which means nothing to pump blood out, and you base that lack of blood trail on why you are one and done with the 223?

 

[deerhunter628]

Ok. I’ve shot a bunch of deer with 6.5’s, 7mm, 30cals, and 338’s that left no blood trials.

Ok. I believe you. You dont need to be offended. I just gave my experience and answered your questions. I have not experienced what you have.

 

[deerhunter628]

So you heart shot a deer, which means nothing to pump blood out, and you base that lack of blood trail on why you are one and done with the 223?

Yes. I guess i dont understand why you are concerned about what cartridge i hunt with. I just gave my experience. Im not concerned with what you hunt with. I said your precious cartridge and bullet worked. I just choose to hunt with something different. I hope you will still be able to sleep tonight.

 

[Pharmseller]

I’ve killed a few deer that left no blood trail. Two come readily to mind.
The first was a smallish Blacktail buck, shot with a 180 grain Core-
Lokt from a short-barreled .30-06. Hit the last rib on the right, angled forward and lodged under the hide in front of the left shoulder. Tall grass, no blood, got lucky finding him as he died right in front of the fence he didn’t have the strength to jump.

The second was a decent 3x3 Mulie shot with a different .30-06, 180 grain Partition. Hit him really low in the chest but he didn’t leak. I followed the route he took after the shot, got lucky that he ran in a straight line.

If we want to talk elk I have a zero blood trail story as well.





P

 

[Ucsdryder]

Part of the issue with failures, whether a 22 cal or 338 cal is that the animal isn’t found. It’s more rare to recover a failure because usually it requires a follow up shot on a running animal that’s trying to get the heck out of town.

Last year I shot a big buck with a 180 eldm. I saw and heard impact and his front leg was hanging. I panicked, missed a couple of fast walking follow up shots and the deer was never seen again. No blood, no deer. It could have been a low shot, hit leg and brisket, or lower, or it could have hit shoulder and failed to penetrate adequately. I’ll never know, but always wonder!

 

[rifletuner]

In 1997, I hunted the very large wild hogs we get up in remote parts of northern Australia. I shot a very large boar on a water hole at approximately 50 meters. I used my 300 Win Mag loaded with the original Barnes X 180gn bullet. At the shot, the boar dropped on the spot. I reloaded and kept the rifle on it for around 30 seconds. But with no further movement from the pig, I then took the rifle off my shoulder and took a step towards the boar. At that moment, the boar stood and launched itself into scrub before I could react and get a follow up shot into it. Despite searching extensively, I was never able to find a blood trail and never located the boar.

From that experience, I concluded that the 300 WM is inadequate for boar, and from then on, only hunted them with a 9.3, 375 or a 458.

Well, not really. Everything I described is as it happened, but I did not conclude the 300 was inadequate. I dont think it was a poor shot from me, but it may have been. And of course I never found it so its all speculation from there.

 

[Formidilosus]

Yes. I guess i dont understand why you are concerned about what cartridge i hunt with. I just gave my experience. Im not concerned with what you hunt with. I said your precious cartridge and bullet worked. I just choose to hunt with something different. I hope you will still be able to sleep tonight.

I am not concerned with what you use, I was trying to understand your thought process. It does not matter to me what you use. However, your response below did show your thought process.

I said your precious cartridge and bullet

 

[wind gypsy]

Yes. I have shot hundreds of deer. All with larger cartridges and they all have left blood trails.

interesting. I shot a whitetail broadside with 300 wsm 200 eldx and it left no blood.

 

[Pharmseller]

Metric system. That was your problem. If you had shot the boar at 54.6807 yards you would have gotten him.




P

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Part of the issue with failures, whether a 22 cal or 338 cal is that the animal isn’t found. It’s more rare to recover a failure because usually it requires a follow up shot on a running animal that’s trying to get the heck out of town.

Last year I shot a big buck with a 180 eldm. I saw and heard impact and his front leg was hanging. I panicked, missed a couple of fast walking follow up shots and the deer was never seen again. No blood, no deer. It could have been a low shot, hit leg and brisket, or lower, or it could have hit shoulder and failed to penetrate adequately. I’ll never know, but always wonder!

Probably a bad hit due to some powder residue in your chamber

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

interesting. I shot a whitetail broadside with 300 wsm 200 eldx and it left no blood.

It’s what’s on the inside that counts, or so they say.

 

[Ucsdryder]

Probably a bad hit due to some powder residue in your chamber

I like it. Obviously was the arrow and not the indian!

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Yes. I have shot hundreds of deer. All with larger cartridges and they all have left blood trails.

Hundreds of deer and every single one has left a blood trail…

This is exactly what I am talking about regarding nonsense on the internet and hearsay.

 

[deerhunter628]

I am not concerned with what you use, I was trying to understand your thought process. It does not matter to me what you use. However, your response below did show your thought process.

Im not sure what you are refering to. Im just saying that you seem to get personally offended when a person is not impressed with the 223. I was very clear that the bullet and cartridge was not a failure just not what i was looking for. Im not sure what “thought process” you were looking for. You seemed condescending and looking for an argument. If i misinterpreted that i apologize.

 

[deerhunter628]

Hundreds of deer and every single one has left a blood trail…

This is exactly what I am talking about regarding nonsense on the internet and hearsay.

Oh because it is not your experience it is nonsense and hearsay. That makes a lot of sense. I would have no reason to lie to you. There is absolutely no benefit in that. People can have different experiences than you.

 

[Formidilosus]

Im not sure what you are refering to. Im just saying that you seem to get personally offended when a person is not impressed with the 223. I was very clear that the bullet and cartridge was not a failure just not what i was looking for. Im not sure what “thought process” you were looking for. You seemed condescending and looking for an argument. If i misinterpreted that i apologize.

You did misinterpret my intent, but it’s the internet and the meaning behind the written word is hard to convey.

I do not get offended about any cartridge or bullet- you could have said the same thing about a 7mm Rem Mag and a Barnes, and my response/question would have been the same. My question was to see if your thought process was an emotional based one or a logical based one- nothing more, and one is certainly entitled to make judgements based on emotion.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Oh because it is not your experience it is nonsense and hearsay. That makes a lot of sense. I would have no reason to lie to you. There is absolutely no benefit in that. People can have different experiences than you.

How many “hundreds” of deer have 100% of the time “left a blood trail”.

I know of 6 other people in my life that have killed multiple hundred deer and elk. If I called each one of them right now on their cell phone and said there is a guy on the Internet claiming 100% blood trail rate on hundreds of confirmed kills they would all laugh out loud.