Why pay for a "custom" action?

[Justin Crossley]

Like the title says, why would/did you go with a custom action over say a Tikka for example? Custom actions aren't actually custom since you're getting the exact same Remington clone everyone else ordered. They cost more than an entire Tikka. You have to add the cost of a trigger, bottom metal, and a magazine.

I understand if the caliber doesn't fit due to the length but I'm curious about the "standard" and short action builds.

So, why pay the extra money?

 

[Gargoyle]

Because some people have more money than sense
For benchrest or F-Class comp the tolerances be tight, bolt lift smooth as not to break position. Hunt rig? Meh.
Personally, I would buy an entire Tikka rifle at the prices of the high end actions and build off it.

 

[ljalberta]

Very interested to see the responses. I’ve been looking to build a new 7mm hunting rifle to place in a HNT26 stock. I currently have convinced myself to try a custom at least once, but I have 3 Tikkas, and I’ve never had an issue with any.

 

[BRTreedogs]

I just like to feel fancy mostly.
I wanted all the upgrades just done, bolt handle, bolt stop etc, I like more trigger options, weight
I like bdl, well actually adl the most.
I didn't want to have to take a tikka apart.

Ohh I hate Tikka there just the damn Yugo of rifles.
I almost talked myself into the RS special but when I handled a 223 Tikka and noticed the long bolt and that the action wasn't actually sized down.
I almost puked, couldn't set it down fast enough.

 

[N2TRKYS]

I prefer my original M700 and Model Seven rifles. . No custom actions for me.

 

[darrenk75b]

Stock options. They are limited on tikkas compared to rem- based rifles

 

[dieselchessy]

I’ve owned Tikka and Sako. I can remember when a Sako was a preferred rifle. But I’ve never considered building off one. Honestly, I don’t understand the fascination. They are great if looking for a stainless factory lefty though.

I also tend not to go custom. If I did it would be for weight, like an AnTi, a better extractor, better bolt timing and primary extraction, more solid or integral scope rail, larger recoil lug. Things like that would be my reasons for a high end action.

I think my next might be a Springfield 2020 or one of the Seekins rifles. For -$2k you get the entire setup, assembled on a high end action.

 

[z987k]

I just like to feel fancy mostly.
I wanted all the upgrades just done, bolt handle, bolt stop etc, I like more trigger options, id say weight but Tikka probably has it beat.
I like bdl, well actually adl the most.
I didn't want to have to take a tikka apart.

Ohh I hate Tikka there just the damn Yugo of rifles.
I almost talked myself into the RS special but when I handled a 223 Tikka and noticed the long bolt and that the action wasn't actually sized down.
I almost puked, couldn't set it down fast enough.

The tikka action is pretty heavy. Something like 32oz if I remember right. So if weight is a real concern you almost have to go custom.

 

[Mojave]

It is really relative.

I currently own 3 Blaser r8 rifles. 2 of them are fully custom with custom stocks. Financially they cost more than a custom built off of a 700 clone, proof barrel and a fiberglass stock.

I have owned in the past 4 years 2 Bighorn TL3s, and 7 or 8 American Rifle Company Nucleus actions.

Previous low-high end guns factory owned; Sako, Tikka, Weatherby Mark V, Howa, Remington, Winchester, Savage, Sauer 90, Blaser r93, and a mountain of other Blaser R8s and K95s.

1. It won't make you a better hunter.

2. It may make you a better shooter as the firearms can be customized to fit your physical dimensions and shooting style.

3. I have seen 80s and 90's era custom rifles by people like Rigby, Holland and Holland and other big name gun companies built on Sakos and M70 Winchesters. So it is the old standard to use a factory rifle and modify it. But in the 80's and 90's there was not a source for custom M98 new production mauser actions.

4. Any custom or customized or factory rifle can be fraught with problems. Any rifle can, doing so may lessen the possibility, but it doesn't lock it to zero.

5. You can easily come to resent a poorly thought out and executed custom rifle. You can spend $1000-2000 on an action $1000 on a barrel, 400-800 on barrel work, $250-300 on a brake, 100-500 on a trigger, $300-1500 on a stock or chassis and still not like what you built. Your selection or the selection by your gunsmith or friends must be heavily researched and well though out. You need to spend time on the phone and on the company pages building your rifle virtually by adding the weights.

6. It is very important to try as many custom stocks and chassis as possible, so as not to end up with something you don't like because you don't actually like the way it looks or feels. Or you like both, but you don't like the recoil impulse.

7. Companies like Gunwerks and others who are selling you a turn-key package might be cheaper in the long run, after you have spent your time and money chasing rainbows in a custom system that doesn't do what you want it to do.

8. Yes I have done all these things and hunted with 13 pound rifles numerous times because I am an idiot and I didn't research all the things I should have in a build.

 

[Lawnboi]

The only reason I’m considering custom over another tikka for whenever I build another gun is prefit ability.

There are some companies making prefits for tikkas, but say for an impact I can have about anyone make me one.

I do have one custom. And for a rifle I plan to not shoot as much or don’t care about the smithing time id probably just go with another tikka.

 

[davsco]

The tikka action is pretty heavy. Something like 32oz if I remember right. So if weight is a real concern you almost have to go custom.

from my scale and what is spec'd online (excl bottom metal if needed; tikka does include bottom 'metal'):

Actions	#	OZ	Lbs
Tikka	2​	2​	2.13
TL3		33​	2.06
Ti3		23​	1.44
Anti X		22​	1.38

 

[WeiserBucks]

Custom actions aren't actually custom since you're getting the exact same Remington clone everyone else ordered.

Not everything out there is a Remington clone.

 

[Mojave]

Not everything out there is a Remington clone.

Every action has to be made by someone and have some design elements that are the same. So they are 2 lug 700 clones, 3 lug or 4 lug actions, Mauser 98 clones, Swiss k-31 clones (like the Lynx), that have existed in some fashion built by hundreds of American and European firearms companies. I have yet to see an original design on any modern custom action.

By your definition the only truly custom action would be one that did not match some kind of predetermined or prexisting manufactured model. Even the new Gunwerks action (non-700 clone) has design elements that follow things like a Roessler Titan 3/6 and a Sauer 202/404.

Custom doesn't actually mean that the action is custom at all. In modern gun lexicon it just means that it wasn't churned out by a major firearms manufacturer.

Stewart Satterlee of Surgis makes a "custom" Mauser 98 out of titanium. He makes about 8 or 9 a year. If anyone is making an actual custom action it is him.

 

[davsco]

Now, if Tikka offered action only sales, that might be a different story.

JAoutdoors sells the Tikka actions. $100 or so less than buying the whole rifle and you don't have to bang off the barrel.

Tikka is a pretty compelling option for any sort of build. They have tight enough specs to use shouldered prefit barrels. A number of companies make drop-in stocks with no special/separate bottom metal needed. Pretty nice triggers esp with the $8 spring replacement. Of course they're pretty good box-stock also, like glocks, work great just not sexy.

 

[Justin Crossley]

from my scale and what is spec'd online (excl bottom metal if needed; tikka does include bottom 'metal'):

Actions	#	OZ	Lbs
Tikka	2​	2​	2.13
TL3		33​	2.06
Ti3		23​	1.44
Anti X		22​	1.38

The Ti3 and Anit X are light!

The Tikka actions I've seen weighed have been 28 oz without the bottom metal and trigger.

Are the other actions listed including those as well, or are the weights just the actions?

 

[ID_Matt]

Something about an integral rail and recoil lug make me feel secure. With my LP fuzion, i haven't went the pre fit route yet, but will definitely in the future. I know they make pre fits for a tikka, but I'm more confident the tolerances on the custom will be better. I have no problems going with a tikka, but if i have to pick one, it's a custom. Maybe i just like feeling fancy??

 

[LRI_Chad]

Predicate all of what I'm about to say with the fact that "shiny sells," and there's a bit of raccoon in most people. BUT, if problem-solving is the goal, then there are receiver companies that make a valid effort to offer a solution. American Rifle Company is an excellent example.

The Mausingfield was born from the notion that if you take a couple of the most battlefield-proven components in the history of modern warfare and combine them, then it should be better. The Mauser and Springfield actions are the core DNA of the Mausingfield action. I've had the luxury of owning/running just about any receiver I want, and the ARC stuff does things others just won't tolerate.

In January 2015, a group of us began to prepare for the PRS season, and we had a mess of brass to fire form. I made a water-cooled barrel and set it up in the bullet trap so that we could rapid fire the job. When Ted from ARC gave me that action, the handshake agreement was to abuse it thoroughly and put it through the paces. So, before fireforming the brass, I attempted to make good on that promise. I tore the action down to its base components and washed every piece in methanol to remove all traces of lubrication.

We ran an approximate 12 rounds per minute cadence until we'd burned through something approaching 2,000+ rounds of ammo. The action never quit, and none of the bearing surfaces had any trace of galling. The layer of smokeless powder smog settled about a foot off the floor in my shop. It reminded me of dropping into Los Angeles on the drive from Vegas as you come down from San Bernadino. It was gross, lol.

That spring at the SHC in Colorado, I dropped a loaded magazine in the mud as the stage kicked off. I made the decision to "shoot it like I stole it." I got the first round down the pipe, and the bolt was not happy about it. I had to kick the handle open like I was trying to start a dirt bike. Many people witnessed this and eagerly anticipated either the handle breaking off or the extractor claw flying out of the action.

It worked flawlessly, and I was able to complete the stage successfully. It sent a message that ARC stuff is made at a high level.

Tikka makes some pretty decent stuff too, but it has its share of issues. If you stick a case, it is very possible to literally break the back portion of the bolt where the handle attaches in the dovetail. The corners in the dovetail are shear points, and they will fail without a whole lot of effort. If you look closely at the replacement bolts I make, you'll see that a fillet has been added to mitigate this. We killed some OEM stuff and our own when we went down the rabbit hole of developing this.


Hope this helps.

C.

 

[davsco]

The Ti3 and Anit X are light!

The Tikka actions I've seen weighed have been 28 oz without the bottom metal and trigger.

Are the other actions listed including those as well, or are the weights just the actions?

the tikka i weighed, and incl trigger, bottom metal etc.
the others are from the mfgr's sites and presumably include the action only - no trigger, bottom metal etc.

 

[XLR]

1 prefits, 2 smoothness, 3 appearance, 4 Longevity
1. Having the ability to run prefits is pretty cool. Is it 100% necessary though, well that's for you to decide. Its a reassurance to know that if a barrel starts shooting weird you can simply call up a smith, proof, or a dealer and have a barrel within a week. Tikka has hit this on the head so you are good to go there!

2. Smoothness. Even if you feel like it doesn't matter, in the heat of the moment the last thing you want to do is run a clunky bolt and your sight picture leaves the animal or at a minimum you are no longer level. Same think here, Tikka has hit this on the head since they are far smoother than a lot of the other custom actions.

3. Appearance. Animals don't care and neither do most of us but a rifle that catches your eye always gives me a warm fuzzy feeling inside. Does this really matter, no but I think a lot of guys go to the custom actions because of the appeal they bring.

4. Longevity. A tikka or Remington action is not made to be ran hard for years like a custom action. After the second barrel you could start to see galling in the lugs. So if you shoot a lot you could end up needing another action.

For me its just one more thing I do not have to worry about. This is from someone who shot a blueprinted 700 for 2 years in the PRS. At the end of my second barrel it was sloppy as could be and the lugs started galling pretty bad. Did the rifle shoot great? yes! Would it have been just fine for a hunting rifle? yes!

So for me the longevity and smoothness is the biggest reason to go with a custom over the Remington's or Tikkas. They are both a great bang for the buck though and if you are not shooting a lot then it might not be worth the additional cost. Tikkas are better than 700s out of the box but if you think that you might move to a custom action in the future then the 700 footprint is hard to stray away from.

Before it gets asked I do have a buddy right now who is 1.5 barrels in on a tikka and he is having galling issues. Very small sample size but with the smaller diameter action and smaller lugs it makes sense that there would be a little more pressure on the lugs. I still think they are the best factory action on the market at this time and they are just not designed for years of use and abuse. Not really a ding on the action just something to be aware of.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Biggest advantage you're getting to a custom action is machining tolerances. Tight tolerances = accuracy. Those tight tolerances also allow prefits to headspace well. Among the different actions on the market you can also pick and choose between features which vary some between actions.

If you think a Tikka action is even remotely comperable to a custom you're dead wrong. Tikka is a great factory action but your stuck with their triggers or the few aftermarkets (none of which I think are excellent) and Tikkas do have issues with the bolt stops. The rail also doesn't hold a candle to a machined in pic rail on a custom action nevermind the tolerances. I know that won't sit well to many here that believe Tikkas are the end all be all bolt action rifles, but it's the truth. They are very good factory rifles that are perfectly fine for the majority of users and that's where it ends.

With that said, most people can't shoot well enough to notice a difference between an accurate factory rifle like a TIkka and a custom action with a prefit for gunsmith chambered barrel.