Why is the .270 dying?

[Lou270]

The folks who participate in these forums are the rifle aficianados. I know a lot of hunters and besides me only one buddy occassionally posts on forums. We are the profit margin for the gun and ammo makers. I am sure some ammo/reloading executive or 2 somewhere put in a new swimming pool because of me. I am not knocking the new innovations at all and embrace them, but have participated in the fun of several of these trends now so that is where coming from. This one may be different but I already sense the tides of change coming with legislators talking about special open sight or low power scope seasons, etc…

Lou

 

[Dan Carey]

"This one may be different but I already sense the tides of change coming with legislators talking about special open sight or low power scope seasons, etc…"

A while back New Mexico limited the Muzzle loader rifle to iron sights only. That really limited the hunters to guys with great eyes. Guys that have poor eye sight and wear glasses are at a disadvantage. But then, thats what you get in NM

 

[Lou270]

"This one may be different but I already sense the tides of change coming with legislators talking about special open sight or low power scope seasons, etc…"

A while back New Mexico limited the Muzzle loader rifle to iron sights only. That really limited the hunters to guys with great eyes. Guys that have poor eye sight and wear glasses are at a disadvantage. But then, thats what you get in NM

Agree. I don’t like it, but it is out there. I bought a 30-30 to add some fun to pig hunting last year and found out my middle aged eyes don’t do so well with open sights anymore

Lou

 

[Macintosh]

If the tides of change cause rifle hunting to become open-sights only, just for example, or banned laser rangefinders…well, a flat shooting cartridge like the 270 might become MORE relevant. However, that will not change the fact that one of the newer cartridges such as a 6cm or 6.5prc is similar in trajectory, but also offers something to the guy shooting steel or f class. I agree with the premise given perhaps “long range hunting” might have less of an aspirational element to it if widespread restrictions were in place, but dont think it really changes the equation today with regard to why folks might think a classic caliber is fading vs the reality.

 

[Lou270]

Here is food for thought:

$25/box
270 Win American Whitetail 130 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2107 fps/1281 fp/-37in

$44/box
6.5 CM Precision Hunter 143 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2025 fps/1302 fp/-44.5in

So, the most basic Hornady 270 hunting ammo vs the most advanced 6.5 cm hunting ammo. Almost half the price for the 270 ammo but of course the 6.5 cm will recoil less. Not arguing the 6.5 cm adds some benefit for volume shooters but Joe hunter will get more bang for buck with hunting ammo with 270. That gets lost in BC hype to a lot of folks. 270 just does not need anything fancy for hunting. Of course you can buy eldx in 270 as well

.270 Precision Hunter 145 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2157 fps/1497 fp/-37.6


Lou

 

[Diamondback]

If Industry just increased the 270 Win barrel twist rate to 8 and did a 270 AI with higher BC 160gr - 170gr bullets, it would be fine for next 100 years.

The 270 Win I shoot 150's at 2850fps will kill everything I want to just fine.
As long as I own the brass, bullets, it isn't fading away in my lifetime.

 

[UnckleBob]

YouTube guy did a poll about people's favorite hunting cartridges. Guess which cartridge finished first.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Here is food for thought:

$25/box
270 Win American Whitetail 130 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2107 fps/1281 fp/-37in

$44/box
6.5 CM Precision Hunter 143 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2025 fps/1302 fp/-44.5in

So, the most basic Hornady 270 hunting ammo vs the most advanced 6.5 cm hunting ammo. Almost half the price for the 270 ammo but of course the 6.5 cm will recoil less. Not arguing the 6.5 cm adds some benefit for volume shooters but Joe hunter will get more bang for buck with hunting ammo with 270. That gets lost in BC hype to a lot of folks. 270 just does not need anything fancy for hunting. Of course you can buy eldx in 270 as well

.270 Precision Hunter 145 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2157 fps/1497 fp/-37.6


Lou

Why not compare American Whitetail costs for each cartridge? They cost the same amount from Graf & Sons. And both are good to 500 yards.

6.5 CM -

.270 -

 

[wind gypsy]

The 170gr .277 Berger has been out for 10+ years. It's not new and wasn't made for the Extreme Outer Limits group. That bullet was made prior to Bob Beck having any influence on Berger making heavy for caliber bullets. Bob did have influence on the manufactur of the 156 6.5mm, the 195 7mm, and the 245 .308 bullets being built. The only new bullets in .277 came with the introduction of the 6.8 Western and those are far too long to be used in the 270 Winchester with the SAAMI approved 1/10" twist.

Jay

The 170 was an EOL bullet.

 

[Dan Carey]

24 inch test barrel? Gen Z don't like 24 inch barrels. So, their muzzle velocity starts at the 200 yard mark on the chart. Hard to get those velocities with a 16 inch barrel.

 

[S-3 ranch]

Here is food for thought:

$25/box
270 Win American Whitetail 130 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2107 fps/1281 fp/-37in

$44/box
6.5 CM Precision Hunter 143 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2025 fps/1302 fp/-44.5in

So, the most basic Hornady 270 hunting ammo vs the most advanced 6.5 cm hunting ammo. Almost half the price for the 270 ammo but of course the 6.5 cm will recoil less. Not arguing the 6.5 cm adds some benefit for volume shooters but Joe hunter will get more bang for buck with hunting ammo with 270. That gets lost in BC hype to a lot of folks. 270 just does not need anything fancy for hunting. Of course you can buy eldx in 270 as well

.270 Precision Hunter 145 gr
@500 yards Vel/Energy/Traj
2157 fps/1497 fp/-37.6


Lou

I shoot A 140gr Sierra game changer TGK and they chronograph @ 2970 in my rifle
Just bought a 10 box case @ $14.00 per box with free shipping
I can’t touch a eldx for that , ( besides that I just don’t like them because core separation even in a 6.5cm )
The 6.5cm I need to wring out some fps so I will feed it the expensive stuff Barnes 127 LDX +/- $35.00 per box

 

[UnckleBob]

Why not compare American Whitetail costs for each cartridge? They cost the same amount from Graf & Sons. And both are good to 500 yards.

6.5 CM -
View attachment 922865
.270 -
View attachment 922863

So the 270 has a larger frontal area + is flatter shooting up to 500 yards + hits with more energy at up to 500 yards.

 

[eoperator]

So the 270 has a larger frontal area + is flatter shooting up to 500 yards + hits with more energy at up to 500 yards.

Burning ~16 extra grains of powder and increasing recoil from ~14 to ~20ft lbs should net some performance gain.

 

[Bluefish]

Burning ~16 extra grains of powder and increasing recoil from ~14 to ~20ft lbs should net some performance gain.

With a more optimized 130g bullet, the 25 cm almost matches the 270 trajectory (2” lower at 500 yards) with 2/3rd the recoil. Put that 128 in a 25 prc and you get better specs for the same recoil as the 270.

 

[eoperator]

With a more optimized 130g bullet, the 25 cm almost matches the 270 trajectory (2” lower at 500 yards) with 2/3rd the recoil. Put that 128 in a 25 prc and you get better specs for the same recoil as the 270.

I have 2 25prc's waiting to try that 128

 

[Q_Sertorius]

24 inch test barrel? Gen Z don't like 24 inch barrels. So, their muzzle velocity starts at the 200 yard mark on the chart. Hard to get those velocities with a 16 inch barrel.

Makes me wonder if the smaller powder charge in the 6.5 CM burns more efficiently in the shorter barrels?


____________________
“Keep on keepin’ on…”

 

[Macintosh]

Apart from making the wrong comparison—if you want to compare to a 270win a 6.5prc, 6cm, etc would be a more appropriate comparison—flatter shooting is more or less irrelevant with a good dialing scope and a laser rangefinder. If you arent on board with dialing a scope then thats on you, not marketing, and there are other “modern” cartridges that would be better choices than a 6.5cm. Truly guys, the people buying 6.5cm for the most part do not give a rats behind that it is slower or that it drops 8” more at 500 yards than a 270. It would be more appropriate to compare a 6.5cm to a 308 or 7mm08.
That some folks want a flat-shooting cartridge so they can use a duplex reticle in a point and shoot scope says more about the shooter than it does about the cartridge. Part of the reason why short action cartridges are popular is because people no longer need such a flat-shooting cartridge to shoot out to what most people consider pretty darn long range.

Also, if you want to look at ammo prices you should be looking at the cost of range ammo, not hunting ammo. Dont know about you, but I fire approximately 500 rounds of range ammo for every round of hunting ammo. All you 270 guys shoot 50 or 100 or more rounds every range session, right?
(This 270 guy does not, my shoulder greatly prefers that I shoot my 6.5 in volume)

 

[Lou270]

The vast majority of people who buy 6.5cm or any cm or prc for that matter shoot no more ammo per year than the guys shooting 270 win or 30-30 for that matter. Any case, you can shoot one gun on the range and use a different gun for hunting. People have been doing that for centuries. There is this weird lack of experience with different cartridges and real hunting situations now that people think minutia really matters in the field when it comes to actual hunting. Any case, If you can afford to shoot 500 rounds of ammo every range trip then you can afford more than one rifle

Lou

 

[The Guide]

The 170 was an EOL bullet.

The first box I bought in 2012 did not have the EOL name attached. It was a 170 VLD Hunter. I no longer have the box.

Jay

 

[Macintosh]

…you can shoot one gun on the range and use a different gun for hunting. People have been doing that for centuries…. If you can afford to shoot 500 rounds of ammo every range trip then you can afford more than one rifle

Well, thats exactly the point. I own and use a 270. Im well aware how capable and versatile it is. It is not fading or dying, its tremendously easy to get a wide variety of ammo for it, its very capable, and for the ammo I like to hunt with I believe its one of the better choices available. But I like shooting too, and a 270 is not as good a choice for that imo. Lo and behold I own not one but two 6.5cm’s. Not because I think a 270 isnt a good cartridge, simply because I think a 6.5 is a better fit for the bulk of the shooting I do. Its not a knock on the 270. I can love my 270 for hunting and still think another cartridge suits most of my shooting needs better. So if the people who shoot a few rounds a year shoot the same # of rounds regardless of cartridge….what about the people who DO shoot more? Are they mostly shooting 270’s?