Why are American branded trucks and most American branded vehicles so unreliable?

[ozyclint]

Because Japanese culture has pride.

 

[Broomd]

Personally I really like the looks of the new Trail Boss Chevy, but I'll never own a domestic truck, period.
In 1992, my (now late) wife and I piled into our newer GMC safari minivan for Christmas visits and I smelled that sickening smell of burnt coolant. Head gasket blew at 48,000 miles. We had two little kids, cancer bills, worst possible scenario with a vehicle. I swore I'd never own another and haven't. Never will.
Nowadays the big three makers are largely woke, spoiled creeps and don't get me started on corrupt unions. Arguably, there are good Americans working making American-made vehicles, but the truth is they are unreliable crap.

 

[displacedtexan]

Japanese truck makers don't produce a 3/4 ton diesel, so I have no experience with them.

But most of the reliability issues I have experienced are connected to my willingness to abuse my stuff.

 

[Jbrow327]

Personally I really like the looks of the new Trail Boss Chevy, but I'll never own a domestic truck, period.
In 1992, my (now late) wife and I piled into our newer GMC safari minivan for Christmas visits and I smelled that sickening smell of burnt coolant. Head gasket blew at 48,000 miles. We had two little kids, cancer bills, worst possible scenario with a vehicle. I swore I'd never own another and haven't. Never will.
Nowadays the big three makers are largely woke, spoiled creeps and don't get me started on corrupt unions. Arguably, there are good Americans working making American-made vehicles, but the truth is they are unreliable crap.

Unions in general are scum and filled with scummy people. The union basically protects them from the real world.

 

[CorbLand]

I think that American brands have really stepped their game up in the last 10-15 years but they were definitely far behind.

 

[Mule3006Elk]

Toyotas trucks are made in the US. Not sure if it’s still true, but they generally have more US made parts than the big 3 who get a lot of their parts from Mexico.

Toyota is also very conservative with bringing new designsto market. They design a motor, transmission, etc, perfect it, then use it for a decade or more. US companies tend to come out with the latest greatest more often.

Interesting point

 

[DuckDogDr]

There's currently multi million dollar law suites against GM for knowingly selling trucks with faulty transmissions and also having no fix for them. Dealers mostly have been instructed to simply frail and fill the transmissions. My stepfather is currently experiencing this exact problem. He will be trading in his Siverado soon.

Have a guy at one of my duck camps. He is a GM dealer and he even said if he didn’t own the business he wouldn’t have one.. he just drives “demo” vehicles until they break and then he’ll swap to another “demo” vehicle off the lot.

He even stated the transmissions and rear ends keep his mechanics running like crazy

 

[Formidilosus]

No idea why that's historically been the case, but the paradigm seems to have shifted some. There's tons of studies and objective reports out there that rank vehicle reliability though, and an interesting trend has emerged in the last 10-ish years or so. Honda no longer has all of their vehicles ranked in the top 3 for reliability. They have a few select vehicles that are (CRV, Civic), but as a whole, Honda reliability in recent years as a company has taken a hit. Toyota is no longer the reliability powerhouse, and most recent "ratings websites" (JD Power type sites) actually rank the Tacoma below the Ford Ranger and Chevy Colorado. Lots of reports of performance issues with recent Tacos and Tundras unfortunately.

In fact, I've been researching the mid-sized pickups as my next daily driver (currently in a half-ton and have no use for the additional capacity, but wish my wheelbase was shorter and my stance was narrower for mountain use), and there's lots of reports from places like Australia that the new standard for the Overland rigs that live in the bush is the Ford Ranger. The Ranger was only discontinued in the US Market for that 10 year span, and continued everywhere else, and there's lots of reports that it out does the new Tacomas in that environment. Just one example, but the more I research, the more I fall out of love with Toyota.

First Gen Tacos are a different conversation, but anything newer than the late 2000's and it seems that lots of the Japanese brands have fallen off the proverbial Totem Pole they were on top of for so long.

I hear this- “dodge/ford/Chevy” has gotten so much better and Toyota has gotten worse, however I have been, and am around fleet vehicles that are primarily used on road with heavy miles, with about 20-30% off-road on trails. Not rock crawling, just the typical use off of paved/maintained roads with ruts, and mud, etc. These vehicles are replaced every 2-3 years and each one will have around 150,000 miles. No matter how many times it’s tried the Dodge rams, Ford F150’s, and Chevy 1500’s all show way more mechanical problems than the Tundras. The last batch of just over 20 dodges before they hit 100k miles we had multiple motors replaced, multiple transmissions, and multiple electrical issues that caused the trucks and people to be stranded. The Chevy’s and Ford’s are similar.

In two batches of Tundras, zero motors or transmissions replaced, 1 electrical issue that I remember that caused a taillight to go out prematurely and weird battery corrosion that didn’t cause a functional issue, just odd. No Tundra have broke down, no people have been stranded.



Now people have different ideas of “quality”. Mine is pretty simple- I don’t give two flips about fluff. I don’t want to screw with vehicles. I hate constant consistent maintenance- I want to put the key in, turn it and the vehicle start every time. I don’t care if one truck “has more power”, or “rides smoother”, or is “nicer”- it’s just a truck. I want the thing to work. @PNWGATOR sees my vehicles. I do not baby them. I might go 40,000 miles between an oil change (though I’m being better). I have a Tacoma that went 198,000 miles having the oil changed 4 times. It has 348k on it now and does get the oil changed at about 10k. The Tundra I’m driving is at 180k. It has a nagging tire pressure sensor issue, but that’s it.


All vehicles makes/models can and will have problems. I have no love for any vehicle brand. But what I see with 20+ trucks at a time used exactly the same way, is that if 20 trucks are needed, they get 20 Tundra’s. If 20 trucks are needed and they decide to go with another brand, they get 25-28 to cover when trucks are in for maintenance.

 

[Thinkingman]

Would you guys say that the number of recalls a manufacturer has is indicative of there reliability?

No.
I argued with Toyota for years over the 'leaf springs' on my 2006 Tacoma and it was years later they issued a TSB, then a recall.
Same for Toyota frame rust.
The vehicle issues existed LONG BEFORE Toyota ever took responsibility.
So no, vehicles can suck without recalls being issued.

Here's some information people seem to forget:

Some head gasket failures can be blamed on a hard-to-seal cylinder head. The 1987-’96 Mitsubishi 3.0L V6, 1988-’95 Toyota 3VZE 3.0L V6 light truck engine, and 1995-’98 Toyota 5VZFE 3.4L V6 in T100s, Tacomas and 4Runners are all examples of engines with hard-to-seal heads and frequent head gasket failures.

In the case of the Mitsubishi 3.0L V6, the armor around the combustion chambers on the OEM gasket has a tendency to crack. The cracking occurs as a result of metal fatigue caused by the head scrubbing back and forth on the block.

 

[Boxerboxer]

Unions in general are scum and filled with scummy people. The union basically protects them from the real world.

That's a pretty shitty generalization. I understand that there can be problems with union politics and bad apples, but I've worked with UAW folks and a few other unions and the vast majority of them were good hardworking people.

 

[fmyth]

Toyotas trucks are made in the US. Not sure if it’s still true, but they generally have more US made parts than the big 3 who get a lot of their parts from Mexico.

Toyota is also very conservative with bringing new designsto market. They design a motor, transmission, etc, perfect it, then use it for a decade or more. US companies tend to come out with the latest greatest more often.

From Google: Toyota now builds the Tacoma at Toyota Motor Manufacturing de Guanajuato in Apaseo el Grande, Mexico. Citing the need to reduce overhead—namely in the form of labor—Toyota shifted production from San Antonio, Texas, to Mexico in 2021.

From Toyotas website: The Tacoma TRD Pro Series is assembled at the Toyota Motor Manufacturing de Baja California plant in Baja, California or Toyota Motor Mexico plant in Guanajuato, Mexico. The Tundra TRD Pro Series is assembled at the Toyota Motor Manufacturing, Texas plant in San Antonio, Texas. The 4Runner TRD Pro Series is assembled at Toyota's Tahara Plant in Tahara, Japan. Tundras and Sequoias are still built in Texas.

 

[Boxerboxer]

Would you guys say that the number of recalls a manufacturer has is indicative of there reliability?

It's not a very good direct measure of reliability. A recall is embarrassing but it's also a conscious decision to take care of customers after you realize there's a problem with their vehicles. So a company with fewer recalls could be that way because they have better designs and more reliable parts, or because they are less likely to spend the money on a recall. Once the recall is completed, if it's done right there is a reliability gain for the products affected. They're also not always a reliability problem but a design flaw. You really have to look at how often failures occur and how much downtime/expense is involved to start to compare reliability effectively.

 

[BRTreedogs]

Unions in general are scum and filled with scummy people. The union basically protects them from the real world.

Someone is a jealous little turd.

 

[Jbrow327]

No.
I argued with Toyota for years over the 'leaf springs' on my 2006 Tacoma and it was years later they issued a TSB, then a recall.
Same for Toyota frame rust.
The vehicle issues existed LONG BEFORE Toyota ever took responsibility.
So no, vehicles can suck without recalls being issued.

Here's some information people seem to forget:

Some head gasket failures can be blamed on a hard-to-seal cylinder head. The 1987-’96 Mitsubishi 3.0L V6, 1988-’95 Toyota 3VZE 3.0L V6 light truck engine, and 1995-’98 Toyota 5VZFE 3.4L V6 in T100s, Tacomas and 4Runners are all examples of engines with hard-to-seal heads and frequent head gasket failures.

In the case of the Mitsubishi 3.0L V6, the armor around the combustion chambers on the OEM gasket has a tendency to crack. The cracking occurs as a result of metal fatigue caused by the head scrubbing back and forth on the block.

So how is that not related to the reliability of a manufacturer? Didn't Ford recently issue like 9 million recalls?

 

[CorbLand]

Unions in general are scum and filled with scummy people. The union basically protects them from the real world.

Unions became a problem when the unions became businesses.

 

[CorbLand]

Would you guys say that the number of recalls a manufacturer has is indicative of there reliability?

Yes and no. If a vehicle has a ton of recalls, I wouldn’t say it’s reliable but I would take a vehicle that has 20 problems that the company fixed versus one with 10 that the company won’t.

 

[Jbrow327]

Yes and no. If a vehicle has a ton of recalls, I wouldn’t say it’s reliable but I would take a vehicle that has 20 problems that the company fixed versus one with 10 that the company won’t.

What about powertrain recalls?

 

[FLATHEAD]

All we own are Toyota, Nissan and Honda.
I agree with the OP.

 

[CorbLand]

What about powertrain recalls?

I was coming back to edit my post to say it would also depend on the part that was recalled. I would still take one that has more problems that the company fixes than one that has less problems and they won’t fix.

 

[Broomd]

Someone is a jealous little turd.

Man, I'm not jealous and I regard unions as creeps overall. Their leadership are politically-motivated scum. Myself, my family, wife, etc, etc, have all been represented to some degree by unions in years' past for no good reason or outcome ever other than to drain our pockets for union-backed politicians = creeps.

There are some great Americans in unions, but overall they are a loathesome and corrupt org.