What would you give up to save OTC opportunities?

[Nickofthewoods]

That’s how it is in Wyo when I spring bear hunt.

I have to imagine there's quite a few less hunters up there for spring bear season than the masses that show up for OTC Elk in Colorado every fall.

 

[cnelk]

I have to imagine there's quite a few less hunters up there for spring bear season than the masses that show up for OTC Elk in Colorado every fall.

When the quota is fairly low, still the same as high masses, high quota

 

[Next Ridge]

It would be too much of a shit show with people trying to get cell reception to check the quota status. Also, think if you were a non res and you just drove out and got camp setup and then the unit closes the next day.

I’m not sure shit show is an accurate way to describe getting cell reception these days…yeah yeah, everyone is waaaybback there…there would obviously need to be some sort of grace period, 24-48 hours. Non residents can come out early so quotas aren’t a problem, up to them.

 

[Nickofthewoods]

OTC with caps still makes more sense to me from a management perspective.

 

[CoHiCntry]

After reading some of these ideas, I’m REALLY glad some of you aren’t making the rules!!!

 

[DawnPatrol]

OP: I’d hand in my rifle for a stick bow (or a sharp stick) if that’s what it took to hunt elk regularly. In my state, that seems like a long way off, but my “safety” unit just went from OTC to a (very easy) draw, so who knows.

I like what this tread turned into, too. Even if I don’t agree with all the ideas.

Just a random thought that came through my head while reading this thread. The federal government could close Forrest service roads and I could see that helping the population as access would be significantly restricted. It would reduce the pressure on animals. Not sure how that falls in with the initial question but it would help.

I think Houndsman’s point is not that we should close NF ground to hunting or make it all Wilderness but that reducing motorized access during hunting season will decrease harvest rate (and I’m pretty sure the research bears him out, at least with respect to elk). It’s another viable way (like weapons restrictions) to issue more tags/let more folks hunt without negativity impacting herd size. I personally look for places with a lot of closed roads, but I realize it’s not for everyone.

 

[2ndResponder]

My favorite answer in cases like this is to manage as a patchwork. Nothing is going to make everyone happy. Have some units with trad requirements, some with little motorized access, and whatever else you can think of. It might shut people out of a place they have hunted a long time or they might adapt to a new tactic or new area.

 

[hobbes]

This will be popular.

While I don't mind seeing some of you in Montana, if you cost me hunting time as a resident, I'm good with them cutting your numbers in half. If it comes down to it, I'm completely opposed to giving up opportunity as a resident to make sure that a nonresident gets to hunt.

Of course that's not practical, but I'm not going to volunteer to give up time hunting my home state to make sure that you get to. I felt the same way as a resident in IL when we were flooded with folks from south of us leasing everything they could get their hands on and pouring into it every nook and cranny of public land.

I travel occasionally to hunt and would expect to lose opportunity as a nonresident before any resident does.

I like SDs pheasant rules. As a nonresident, you get 10 days total, either consecutively or split into two 5 day blocks.

 

[Jaker_cc]

I have been pushing primitive weapons as an idea to the g&f guys here. Our deer herd is hurting and they are having the debate of cutting tags vs the revenue loss. Everybody would win if they made it single string bows, side lock muzzleloaders, and open sight rifles while keeping tag numbers the same. The state keeps its revenue, people keep their opportunity, and the deer herd gets to recover.

I doubt you could save OTC but I wish some state would at least give this a try in a couple units.

If New Mexico cared about its deer herd there wouldn’t be 250 youth tags in a migration corridor up north hammering those bucks during thanksgiving. They could help the herd by giving 90% of those kids doe tags. More wardens in those units out by Taos would help a ton as well. Those people ride around 5 deep with weapons pointed everywhere when there are supposedly only 150 tags in some of those units. I saw some dragging elk and pronghorn out when there was only a deer season open. Game and fish said they couldn’t get anyone over there for a couple of days.

 

[Jaker_cc]

Ha ha restricting my rights to hunt on Federal property as a NR? My tax dollars go to funding and supporting the agency that is responsible for maintaining that land, and you think my ability to hunt it should be taken away simply because I don’t live in that state?!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You can camp as much as you want on federal land. Game belongs to the state. The sooner people realize that non resident tags are a privilege and not a right, the better. I’m a non resident as well. I thank game and fish every single time I get a tag anywhere but texas.

 

[trophyhill]

Some of my buddies used to hunt with primitive muzzleloaders and now hunt with modern muzzleloaders. The modern guns have increased their success rates and acually helped increase the herd numbers. No more wounded or lost animals since making the switch. If you want to argue ethics, a modern muzzleloader is much more accurate therefore more proficient at killing resulting in less wounded or lost game......

 

[Maverick1]

 

[TN2shot07]

I wouldn't give up any resident otc tags until there was absolutely no resident tags issued... Any resident of any state should be taken care of first whatever is left nonresidents would have to draw...

I don’t think any residents would disagree with you but the price discrepancy between resident tags vs NR would be hard for most game departments to make up for. Most residents would be happy to never see an out of state tag at a trail head but probably less so when their tag prices go through the roof to keep up funding.

 

[Felix40]

Adding a bunch of doe tags is definitely not the way to help a struggling deer herd. I don’t know what’s going on up north but that would decimate the herd where I live.

I hear you on more game wardens. It’s pretty hard to have coverage with 40% vacancy across the state and when all the guys have to spend all their time turning in Covid tests.

If New Mexico cared about its deer herd there wouldn’t be 250 youth tags in a migration corridor up north hammering those bucks during thanksgiving. They could help the herd by giving 90% of those kids doe tags. More wardens in those units out by Taos would help a ton as well. Those people ride around 5 deep with weapons pointed everywhere when there are supposedly only 150 tags in some of those units. I saw some dragging elk and pronghorn out when there was only a deer season open. Game and fish said they couldn’t get anyone over there for a couple of days.

 

[tdhanses]

If New Mexico cared about its deer herd there wouldn’t be 250 youth tags in a migration corridor up north hammering those bucks during thanksgiving. They could help the herd by giving 90% of those kids doe tags. More wardens in those units out by Taos would help a ton as well. Those people ride around 5 deep with weapons pointed everywhere when there are supposedly only 150 tags in some of those units. I saw some dragging elk and pronghorn out when there was only a deer season open. Game and fish said they couldn’t get anyone over there for a couple of days.

If your trying to build/increase a herd last thing you do is take out the females that produce offspring, males always have to die first.

 

[5MilesBack]

The sooner people realize that non resident tags are a privilege and not a right, the better.

Even resident tags are a privilege and not a right.

 

[Jwknutson17]

Some of my buddies used to hunt with primitive muzzleloaders and now hunt with modern muzzleloaders. The modern guns have increased their success rates and acually helped increase the herd numbers. No more wounded or lost animals since making the switch. If you want to argue ethics, a modern muzzleloader is much more accurate therefore more proficient at killing resulting in less wounded or lost game......

First thing I thought of also. Wounding game. How many guys shooting compound bows can't put an arrow in the wheelhouse. Let alone a bunch of guys totally new to stick bows letting arrows fly at game. Can't recover the animal and off they go to try at another. Same can be said with other weapons. What good would your LR fancy rifle be if you couldn't scope it? 300 and in for experienced guys on open sights?

Someone mentioned a while back about having one bull elk opportunity a year for multiple states. I think that would be pretty interesting. Not sure how that would play out, but all the big time YouTube guys would have a fit!

Burn points to hunt would clear up a lot of issues. Total disaster the first 3-4 years I would bet, but it would settle down. Those 20 point units would go down to 7? And 7-10 point units down to 3. I know I, myself, couldn't not elk hunt for 7 years!

For me and my situation if I plan a mule deer hunt I am most likely not going to draw a elk tag as I put all emphasis on harvesting that animal. Only so much vacation and time to hunt, I would concentrate on that one species. Thats why I keep elk hunting and have 14 co mule deer points and have not deer hunting in 14 years. If I burn the deer points I will most likely sit out other species. Only so much scouting and prep you can do for one species let alone two or three. I take vacation and time away to scout also, so I'm successful. So there really isn't much available time for the "normal" guy to do it right in multiple states and multiple species. Especially if I draw a moose, goat, or sheep tag. Everything else goes on the back burner. My opinion of course.

So many different thoughts and opinions to go around. Not sure what the answer is but change will be coming. It's not going to please everyone but I would guess there is a common middle ground.

 

[Jaker_cc]

If your trying to build/increase a herd last thing you do is take out the females that produce offspring, males always have to die first.

In the units I’m talking about they are migrating deer from Colorado. So it’s like a welfare system for New Mexico. They get to hand out a ton of youth tags for deer that don’t usually live in the state. You can bet your ass that if those were resident deer they wouldn’t be handing out that many tags.

 

[tdhanses]

In the units I’m talking about they are migrating deer from Colorado. So it’s like a welfare system for New Mexico. They get to hand out a ton of youth tags for deer that don’t usually live in the state. You can bet your ass that if those were resident deer they wouldn’t be handing out that many tags.

Haha, CO deer are invading NM

 

[Jaker_cc]

Haha, CO deer are invading NM

Haha winter range. So yeah kinda