Tikka LA 300 WSM and 212 LRX

[AkMtnRunner]

I've often considered having a Tikka 300 wsm built around the 212 lrx bullet. Converted to use it's LA overall length, I think it could work well but I've not found any reports of anyone's similar efforts. Barnes lists this bullet with an insane BC at .705 and many hand loads achieving more than 2800 fps. Barnes also says this bullet has minimum expansion velocity of 1600 fps, putting that at around 1200 yards (not that I would ever shoot at an animal nearly that far).

This sounds a bit too good to be true. Am I missing something? In case anyone wants to know, the purpose would be improving margin of error for Alaskan moose at extended range. I've done this with TTSX's from 375's and 338's out to 450 yards and they work well but these are getting a bit close to their minimum velocity at around 500 yards and my hunting terrain sometimes doesn't allow getting close. This setup definitely seems superior than those.

I am led to believe this hasn't been tried and reported on since a 1-8 twist is required and these bullets weren't available for a while. But I am curious if anyone has looked more into it and/or give their educated guesses for it's viability.

 

[AkMtnRunner]

Anyone?

 

[LightFoot]

I think you’re right about the lack of 300 WSM rifles chambered in a long action and with a 1-8 twist.

If you give it a shot, I’d be interested in your experience.


>>>——JAKE——>

 

[ElPollo]

I've often considered having a Tikka 300 wsm built around the 212 lrx bullet. Converted to use it's LA overall length, I think it could work well but I've not found any reports of anyone's similar efforts. Barnes lists this bullet with an insane BC at .705 and many hand loads achieving more than 2800 fps. Barnes also says this bullet has minimum expansion velocity of 1600 fps, putting that at around 1200 yards (not that I would ever shoot at an animal nearly that far).

This sounds a bit too good to be true. Am I missing something? In case anyone wants to know, the purpose would be improving margin of error for Alaskan moose at extended range. I've done this with TTSX's from 375's and 338's out to 450 yards and they work well but these are getting a bit close to their minimum velocity at around 500 yards and my hunting terrain sometimes doesn't allow getting close. This setup definitely seems superior than those.

I am led to believe this hasn't been tried and reported on since a 1-8 twist is required and these bullets weren't available for a while. But I am curious if anyone has looked more into it and/or give their educated guesses for its viability.

It’s Barnes’ minimum velocity statement that is too good to be true. 2200 fps is a much better figure to ensure you get full expansion. That means you are building a gun specifically for a bullet with a 0.7 BC to shoot 500-ish yards and in. You just aren’t getting a huge benefit from the higher BC at that range.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

It’s Barnes’ minimum velocity statement that is too good to be true. 2200 fps is a much better figure to ensure you get full expansion.

Bingo.

Hey OP don't ask barnes the minimum expansion (that means it has barely opened and the petals are still smaller than the diameter of the bullet, do you consider that expansion?). Ask them the minimum velocity to get full expansion down to the root of the hollow point.

Now if you want to shoot a big ol barnes for fun / buck the wind more then have at it, but don't go shooting something down to 1600fps without realizing you might not like what happens terminally.

 

[JDBAK]

I got a long throated Tikka with a McGowan 300WSM 1-10” twist. It shoots 208 ELDM and 212 ELDX just fine.
Is there really anything’s significant to be gained with that Barnes LRX?

 

[ElPollo]

I've often considered having a Tikka 300 wsm built around the 212 lrx bullet. Converted to use it's LA overall length, I think it could work well but I've not found any reports of anyone's similar efforts. Barnes lists this bullet with an insane BC at .705 and many hand loads achieving more than 2800 fps. Barnes also says this bullet has minimum expansion velocity of 1600 fps, putting that at around 1200 yards (not that I would ever shoot at an animal nearly that far).

This sounds a bit too good to be true. Am I missing something? In case anyone wants to know, the purpose would be improving margin of error for Alaskan moose at extended range. I've done this with TTSX's from 375's and 338's out to 450 yards and they work well but these are getting a bit close to their minimum velocity at around 500 yards and my hunting terrain sometimes doesn't allow getting close. This setup definitely seems superior than those.

I am led to believe this hasn't been tried and reported on since a 1-8 twist is required and these bullets weren't available for a while. But I am curious if anyone has looked more into it and/or give their educated guesses for it's viability.

I agree with @JDBAK on the ELDM and ELDX. If you really want a higher BC non-lead bullet, you might check ou the DRTs. They have 220ish and a 250ish grain 30 cal bullets with pretty good BCs. Form say they act like a Berger. I don’t have any direct experience with them. I believe @SouthPaw has used the 6.5s and .224s down to 1800 with good wound channels. I am considering trying the .224s this fall.

 

[AkMtnRunner]

I realize Barnes' minimum expansion isn't ideal expansion. I've considered ~2,100 fps to be a more usable minimum for their TTSX bullets (with 1800 stated minimum), which I can verify as performing well.

Coming from being happy with 338/375 TTSX bullets out to 450 yards, I am wondering if going to this combo is a legitimate route to extend the range potential. Or will there be a problem that I am not seeing? Putting an extremely long bullet into a wsm case loaded to around 3.4" isn't a common thing to do. I have also read this bullet doesn't engage the rifling any farther than a typical saami loaded 300 wsm but I'd like to know if that's true if anyone can verify.

ElPollo, I don't see any heavier DRT bullets than 175 grain on their site. Do you have a link?

 

[z987k]

I agree with @JDBAK on the ELDM and ELDX. If you really want a higher BC non-lead bullet, you might check ou the DRTs. They have 220ish and a 250ish grain 30 cal bullets with pretty good BCs. Form say they act like a Berger. I don’t have any direct experience with them. I believe @SouthPaw has used the 6.5s and .224s down to 1800 with good wound channels. I am considering trying the .224s this fall.

DRT lists quite a few bullets on their list of bullets and BC's but they don't actually have them. The only 30 cal they're currently making is the 175 and 135, which I'm pretty sure are the same exact dimensions, just one is copper and the other tungsten.

ElPollo, I don't see any heavier DRT bullets than 175 grain on their site. Do you have a link?

They don't have them.

 

[z987k]

I've often considered having a Tikka 300 wsm built around the 212 lrx bullet. Converted to use it's LA overall length, I think it could work well but I've not found any reports of anyone's similar efforts. Barnes lists this bullet with an insane BC at .705 and many hand loads achieving more than 2800 fps. Barnes also says this bullet has minimum expansion velocity of 1600 fps, putting that at around 1200 yards (not that I would ever shoot at an animal nearly that far).

This sounds a bit too good to be true. Am I missing something? In case anyone wants to know, the purpose would be improving margin of error for Alaskan moose at extended range. I've done this with TTSX's from 375's and 338's out to 450 yards and they work well but these are getting a bit close to their minimum velocity at around 500 yards and my hunting terrain sometimes doesn't allow getting close. This setup definitely seems superior than those.

I am led to believe this hasn't been tried and reported on since a 1-8 twist is required and these bullets weren't available for a while. But I am curious if anyone has looked more into it and/or give their educated guesses for it's viability.

For an even higher BC, 30 cal that needs a fast twist, but is lighter and will be faster to, check this one out.

Afterburner .308" - 194 gr | APEX OUTDOORS

.308" Caliber, 1:8.6" Min Twist Rate, 194 Grain, Afterburner, 50 Count

www.apex-outdoors.com

These don't expand like a Barnes, they come apart.

 

[ElPollo]

DRT lists quite a few bullets on their list of bullets and BC's but they don't actually have them. The only 30 cal they're currently making is the 175 and 135, which I'm pretty sure are the same exact dimensions, just one is copper and the other tungsten.


They don't have them.

My bad. Their website is a pain to navigate. I just referenced their BC list. Personally, I think the 200 ELDX or 208 gr ELDM are great bullets for the WSM. I had a Tikka rebarreled to the caliber with a 1-9” twist. Sold it because there are no mastodons where I hunt and it was less than fun to shoot in a light weight rifle. The guy who bought it agrees with me.

 

[z987k]

My bad. Their website is a pain to navigate. I just referenced their BC list. Personally, I think the 200 ELDX or 208 gr ELDM are great bullets for the WSM. I had a Tikka rebarreled to the caliber with a 1-9” twist. Sold it because there are no mastodons where I hunt and it was less than fun to shoot in a light weight rifle. The guy who bought it agrees with me.

If you don't mind hunting with lead, I don't know why you'd use the DRT bullets. There's better lead bullets.
I've still yet to kill anything with a DRT, hope to remedy that here real soon, but I think they're going to turn out to be the best terminally performing lead-free.

 

[ElPollo]

If you don't mind hunting with lead, I don't know why you'd use the DRT bullets. There's better lead bullets.
I've still yet to kill anything with a DRT, hope to remedy that here real soon, but I think they're going to turn out to be the best terminally performing lead-free.

For me, it’s about where I am using them. I don’t know of any documentation of lead from meat being a problem for humans or mammalian scavengers or predators, just raptors and corvids. Most areas I hunt don’t have a lot of eagles and I can cover gut piles. Last time I hunted this area the eagles were on my gut piles almost immediately. I also just want to try the DRTs if I can get them to shoot well.

 

[ForestryGypsy]

I realize Barnes' minimum expansion isn't ideal expansion. I've considered ~2,100 fps to be a more usable minimum for their TTSX bullets (with 1800 stated minimum), which I can verify as performing well.

Coming from being happy with 338/375 TTSX bullets out to 450 yards, I am wondering if going to this combo is a legitimate route to extend the range potential. Or will there be a problem that I am not seeing? Putting an extremely long bullet into a wsm case loaded to around 3.4" isn't a common thing to do. I have also read this bullet doesn't engage the rifling any farther than a typical saami loaded 300 wsm but I'd like to know if that's true if anyone can verify.

ElPollo, I don't see any heavier DRT bullets than 175 grain on their site. Do you have a link?

Any updates on this?
I have a tikka in 7RM, looking to switch chamberings to launch a 200+gr mono effective to 500 yards. Barnes has said the minimum is at 1500, but full expansion at 1600. Even if it’s really 1700fps that’s a huge operating window beyond the 450-500 yard range I work within in OR/WA.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

Any updates on this?
I have a tikka in 7RM, looking to switch chamberings to launch a 200+gr mono effective to 500 yards. Barnes has said the minimum is at 1500, but full expansion at 1600. Even if it’s really 1700fps that’s a huge operating window beyond the 450-500 yard range I work within in OR/WA.

Why do you think you need a 200+gr mono to be effective to 500yds?

I have .284 based calibers with less horsepower than a 7RM that launch 130-150gr monos at velocities that maintain 2200+fps out to 500yd. <500yd the BC gains for bucking wind and dialing are likely marginal over lighter and faster mono with a bit lower BC. Slow and heavy isn't the answer for monos imho.

 

[AkMtnRunner]

Any updates on this?
I have a tikka in 7RM, looking to switch chamberings to launch a 200+gr mono effective to 500 yards. Barnes has said the minimum is at 1500, but full expansion at 1600. Even if it’s really 1700fps that’s a huge operating window beyond the 450-500 yard range I work within in OR/WA.

I’ve since moved attention to the 7mm PRC because of the new 160 LRX. I shared a moose hunt with Ben Reynolds with his 6 CM and was shown how unnecessary 200+ gr bullets are. If I didn’t like Barnes bullets so much I might go even smaller with a lead bullet but I think that 160 lrx 7mm bullet will be far more effective than necessary.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

I’ve since moved attention to the 7mm PRC because of the new 160 LRX. I shared a moose hunt with Ben Reynolds and his 6 CM and was shown how unnecessary 200+ gr bullets are. If I didn’t like Barnes bullets so much I might go even smaller with a lead bullet but I think that 160 lrx 7mm bullet will be far more than effective than necessary.

I didn't even notice this bullet has came out. Have you used this 160LRX yet?

 

[ForestryGypsy]

I’ve since moved attention to the 7mm PRC because of the new 160 LRX. I shared a moose hunt with Ben Reynolds and his 6 CM and was shown how unnecessary 200+ gr bullets are. If I didn’t like Barnes bullets so much I might go even smaller with a lead bullet but I think that 160 lrx 7mm bullet will be far more than effective than necessary.

I’ve heard good things about that ammo offering. Looks like you’d be safe to run a short barrel with it to. I’ve been using the 160 TSX out of my 7RM and it’s always let me wishing I had more diameter and speed on elk past 250-300yds. Recovered bullets on elk from 350-450 have had the nose not open beyond caliber. That 160 LRX shouldn’t have that issue though at least.

 

[AkMtnRunner]

I didn't even notice this bullet has came out. Have you used this 160LRX yet?

I have not, only have an Osprey barrel on the way so far.