Largest Private Western Land Owners Controlling Huge Amounts Of Public Land

[MtnW]

Not a single one of the landowners land locked anything. Our idiotic Federal Gvmt did. Not their problem. They aren't going to go build a road through their private land so you have access.

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Pretty simple minded response there Jemez.
What most of us are talking about, is a certain amount of the bull elk harvests on these ranches that have 10-50% of their land holdings in our public lands need to allow the public bull elk tags to hunt these properties and allowed 10-50% of their land holdings tags. This may mean the property owners need to provide access to, guides or whatever it takes to allow the public to hunt these properties lands they own. It’s B.S. that these super rich land barons can control and monetize the public’s wildlife.

 

[HunterGatherer]

Not a single one of the landowners land locked anything. Our idiotic Federal Gvmt did. Not their problem. They aren't going to go build a road through their private land so you have access.

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If you think large private landowners don’t intentionally landlock public land for their own use by strategically purchasing parcels that allow them to do so you just aren’t aware of the reality.

You are correct that it’s partially the Federal and state governments fault for allowing these sales to happen. It should have been made a law, long ago, that no government sale should result in landlocking public land without providing an easement.

 

[MtnW]

This is also fair… guess that’s where land swaps can be useful but they need to be fair

Stan Kroeneke who has over 100,000 of public land land locked on his WY Q Creek ranch tried to pull it over on the people of Wyoming. He proposed a land swap. But instead of being fair and honorable (again this guy has 12-20 billion) his proposal was to swap his least desirable arid sagebrush scrub land for prime irrigated/ water rights property. You can’t trust these greedy billionaires.

 

[Jethro]

If i come to own a ranch and it has landlocked inside it, some of you will be invited, but most aren’t getting in. Sorry.

 

[MontyMontana]

Coming from the ranching side, we have about 6 sections (6 square miles) landlocked, not all one chunk. A very popular river runs along some of our place. In the 90's there was a good bit of float traffic on the river totally legal. Some would pull to shore eat a lunch and hang out before floating down. Not an issue, in fact my dad built a little "park" for them to do so complete with trash barrels. Also, guys would ask if they could come hay or brand in exchange for some huntin.. All was good then when dad gave an inch people took a mile. Lunch at the park turned into a free-for-all camping all over the pasture, leaving trash and firepits everywhere. Hunting turned into inviting half their state up to a point that one guy shot a horse near the barn thinking it was an elk... I know not everyone is like that cuz I'm not. But it will be a cold day in hell before I make it a free for all to cross this ranch to access public lands. I would absolutely do some land swappin but I'm not buying shit unless it's at the same price they gave my mom's side of the family for White Sands....

And to top it all off, land locked public is what you get when you let the government have a hand in ANYTHING!!

 

[RockAndSage]

I've hunted mule deer on Sierra Pacific Industries timberlands in Northern California - they're definitely one of the largest landowners in the West, esp in NorCal, and it's not just one large swath of land. An immense number of relatively small acre holdings as well. The only time I'm aware of them closing their lands to public hunting/access is during extreme fire danger. But they seem to have a pretty good record of treating their private property as a public hunting resource, which is smart, IMO.

 

[cnelk]

Silver Spur Ranches are a large landowner in the US

 

[Billy Goat]

Pretty simple minded response there Jemez.
What most of us are talking about, is a certain amount of the bull elk harvests on these ranches that have 10-50% of their land holdings in our public lands need to allow the public bull elk tags to hunt these properties and allowed 10-50% of their land holdings tags. This may mean the property owners need to provide access to, guides or whatever it takes to allow the public to hunt these properties lands they own. It’s B.S. that these super rich land barons can control and monetize the public’s wildlife.

In all honesty, if you look back to the 1960's, what part of that inholding was actually "public"

I guess specifically for hunting access, since that's the jist of the post.

 

[5MilesBack]

It’s B.S. that these super rich land barons can control and monetize the public’s wildlife.

If you're that worked up about it, then petition the state to do something about it.....sheesh. I have no problem with landowners that have public land landlocked within their private property boundaries. If I had the money or the land to have that, I'd take full advantage of that too. I'm not going to complain about it. I have millions of other public acres to hunt than to get worked up over what someone else is doing.

You've obviously got a problem with people that have done well financially for themselves, and strategically acquired land in the right places. I've never understood that marxist mentality.

 

[RockAndSage]

Coming from the ranching side, we have about 6 sections (6 square miles) landlocked, not all one chunk. A very popular river runs along some of our place. In the 90's there was a good bit of float traffic on the river totally legal. Some would pull to shore eat a lunch and hang out before floating down. Not an issue, in fact my dad built a little "park" for them to do so complete with trash barrels. Also, guys would ask if they could come hay or brand in exchange for some huntin.. All was good then when dad gave an inch people took a mile. Lunch at the park turned into a free-for-all camping all over the pasture, leaving trash and firepits everywhere. Hunting turned into inviting half their state up to a point that one guy shot a horse near the barn thinking it was an elk... I know not everyone is like that cuz I'm not. But it will be a cold day in hell before I make it a free for all to cross this ranch to access public lands. I would absolutely do some land swappin but I'm not buying shit unless it's at the same price they gave my mom's side of the family for White Sands....

And to top it all off, land locked public is what you get when you let the government have a hand in ANYTHING!!

Your point here is something lost, I think, on a lot of people who don't own much or any property at all. It's a truth that, for most people, they act like renters, not owners - and have zero mentality towards the maintenance of property. Let alone not leaving trash. Even fewer give of themselves to make it better than they found it.

And this is entirely separate, 100%, from the very real and massive risks and liabilities that are piled on you when allowing anyone on your property, at all. About half of any group of hunters is all Andy Griffith and Mayberry, until they see dollar signs in you. The problem is, you don't know which half - and they don't either.

 

[KurtR]

If im in that position no way im letting every tom dick and harry run across my land to get to the public. People in general will tear shit up and cant close gates and act as if they are entitled to it and leave a mess for the land owners. When we had the big winter of 96-97 here lots of acres flooded and turned into lakes used to be water was public but then slob ice fishermen messed that up now you have to get permission to go on water thats over private land.

 

[cnelk]

With everyone being sue happy these days, it’s no wonder landowners don’t give permission. I wouldn’t either

 

[jmez]

Call it simple minded. Class warfare is simple minded.

Again, you are going after the wrong crowd. This is 100% on the Federal Govmnt. I don't care if a guy is worth $12 or $12 billion. He has zero responsibility to open his privately held land to the public. He didn't land lock anything.

The general public will not be "thankful" he opened his land so they can access public ground. They will treat it like they currently treat NF lands. I wear a backpack when I hike the NF ground behind my house. I leave home with it empty. I come home with it full of trash, every time. I spend hours every year moving logs and rocks across new trails that everyone with an ATV or motorcylce thinks they are allowed make anywhere they please. Only to come back in a couple weeks to the new trail they made around the piles.

Maybe you should call Stan and offer to pay for, maintain, and patrol the road through his private property for the good of the public.

 

[Wprinkle]

I don't think this is turning out as the OP had hoped LMAO

 

[wapitibob]

I was in 16 for 4 years straight and drove all over the Q’s smaller parcels, as did everybody else. I never expected access to hunt their private and planned accordingly. I also never expected their ranch hands to ride over and apologize when they thought they had interfered with my hunt but they did. They provide a shitton of access in the Hanna hma, which they don’t have to do. Sadly, the power line ruined that area.

 

[MtnW]

I am all for private land ownership and allowing land owners do as they please with their private land without any government or public interference . I am a capitalist. I have been fortunate in my career where now in my later years most of my hunting is on private land.

I am open to creating a movement to open these large landlocked tracts to hunting . There are many ways this can be done. The ranchers have a free ride with the public owned wildlife. These land barons can put programs together with the state wildlife agencies to have prime time controlled big game hunts. It’s already being done to a degree in UT and CO. Too many ranchers feel entitled and think this land locked public land is now their own private hunting estates. Many of us have issues with the private control of these game rich large land locked public parcels where the controlling owners monetize the wildlife , much like in Europe. Those that say these owners have worked so hard to obtain these lands. Again a lot of that is B.S. too! Many of these land barons are 2nd and 3rd generation trust babies who have inherited all of their wealth either from marriage, or bydaddy or grandpa and have never really contributed to society

On the other spectrum there are a bunch of ranchers just raping our public lands by overgrazing. How many of you have experienced a mountain full of sheep , just like a mile long long swarm of maggots eating everything in sight like a swarm of locusts everywhere on the mountain during one of your elk, mule deer or sheep hunts ? Or hundreds of cattle where there should only be twenty?
All of these land barons are not the best stewards of our public lands.

Many of our countries finest game rich hunting lands are also public lands, but are located within the confines of these land barons . It’s not about unlimited access , or building roads into our landlocked public lands but an equitable amount percentage wise to publicly hunt our own land through programs through state game agencies. It’s currently being done on a smaller scale now.

 

[Steve300xcw]

On the other spectrum there are a bunch of ranchers just raping our public lands by overgrazing. How many of you have experienced a mountain full of sheep , just like a mile long long swarm of maggots eating everything in sight like a swarm of locusts everywhere on the mountain during one of your elk, mule deer or sheep hunts ? Or hundreds of cattle where there should only be twenty?
All of these land barons are not the best stewards of our public lands.

Many of our countries finest game rich hunting lands are also public lands, but are located within the confines of these land barons . It’s not about unlimited access , or building roads into our landlocked public lands but an equitable amount percentage wise to publicly hunt our own land through programs through state game agencies. It’s currently being done on a smaller scale now.

So you didnt get the e-hugs you were looking for, so onto the next subject to cry about?

This thread really feels like you glassed up a bull on private and got told no

 

[Slickhill]

Who defines “land Baron”, does a Baron have 100acres, 1000, 10000?

What difference does it make how this “Baron” procured his land? My family owns a ranch, if I inherit it am I automatically a scumbag if I don’t let people cross it or otherwise use it for free? If not me will my son be if he inherits?

So the answer is to force the .gov to pass a law or otherwise force the landowner in question to allow access. Because the government already does. such a bang up job at everything else surely this time they’ll get it right…

These grapes sound like they’re incredibly sour.

 

[MontyMontana]

I am all for private land ownership and allowing land owners do as they please with their private land without any government or public interference . I am a capitalist. I have been fortunate in my career where now in my later years most of my hunting is on private land.

I am open to creating a movement to open these large landlocked tracts to hunting . There are many ways this can be done. The ranchers have a free ride with the public owned wildlife. These land barons can put programs together with the state wildlife agencies to have prime time controlled big game hunts. It’s already being done to a degree in UT and CO. Too many ranchers feel entitled and think this land locked public land is now their own private hunting estates. Many of us have issues with the private control of these game rich large land locked public parcels where the controlling owners monetize the wildlife , much like in Europe. Those that say these owners have worked so hard to obtain these lands. Again a lot of that is B.S. too! Many of these land barons are 2nd and 3rd generation trust babies who have inherited all of their wealth either from marriage, or bydaddy or grandpa and have never really contributed to society

On the other spectrum there are a bunch of ranchers just raping our public lands by overgrazing. How many of you have experienced a mountain full of sheep , just like a mile long long swarm of maggots eating everything in sight like a swarm of locusts everywhere on the mountain during one of your elk, mule deer or sheep hunts ? Or hundreds of cattle where there should only be twenty?
All of these land barons are not the best stewards of our public lands.

Many of our countries finest game rich hunting lands are also public lands, but are located within the confines of these land barons . It’s not about unlimited access , or building roads into our landlocked public lands but an equitable amount percentage wise to publicly hunt our own land through programs through state game agencies. It’s currently being done on a smaller scale now.

That's a big fat NO from me. And I assume you are unaware of this s it is hard to see from an apartment in town on the East coast but.. Grazing permits come with rules, fines and regulations. As far as overgrazing obviously you have never made a living from ranching or farming. Hint: if you overgraze something that means less to graze later and that means less animal units (you can good animal units) next time. That means less money in an industry that already is not profitable. You keep saying "our lands" well that does not just pertain to you as a hunter/ hiker or whatever. The ranchers pay the EXACT amount in taxes to "own" public land as you do and the little ol lady in New York that will never set foot on NFS/BLM... So, if you don't like grazing leases going to ranchers you have the freedom to purchase grazing leases and NOT put stock on them.

You seem more upset that "rich land barons" are rich and have land than you are anything. If you don't like people buying land to shore up their borders, then buy it first. No one is stopping you from spending your money to make a difference. But instead, you want to come on here (again) and whine and "start a movement." (which is failing, again). Go buy some grazing permits or land that locks up public and open it up to everyone.

 

[Choupique]

don't blame them. Being honest I would do the same.

Yea, id have all of Yellowstone to myself if it were an option.