Is it all Leopolds

[Yukon Cornelius]

bmart and jake...i did not say in any way there was a Form cult, only responding to Yukon's post referencing such cult...."that now he did it, he will upset said cult. I fully understand what Form is presenting to the RS crowd..it's just info that any one of us can utilize in whatever manner they choose. I've chosen to use it to try NF scopes out and see what is what. I wouldn't have done that if I thought he was full of crap or biased in any way and the data wasn't factual. I like to try things for myself before im in the "hell yeah" camp.

And I’ve bought 2 NF and a trijicon scope after discovering the drop test stuff.

Kept one NF but not the other and just got rid of the trijicon to fund rhe nx8.

I’m giving that ten mile and credo a shot currently. Once I can find one I can afford.

Swfa will never come to me again unless I can view it first. I like viewing my target and that murky ass glass was terrible on the last two attempts.

 

[jimh406]

The LOGIC is pretty darn simple.

Not really. There are lots of variables.

Fwiw, use what you are comfortable with or can't break.

 

[Yukon Cornelius]

You mention not trashing members yet you just referenced the Form cult!!

How is that trashing them? If they are a cult they are a cult. That doesn’t have to be a bad thing.

They ain’t drinking kool-aid to off each other.

They are like vegans and crossfitters.

 

[jimh406]

Anyone else see the recent Backfire video about a miss at a buck this year?

I didn't see the followup though.

Did you see the thread a few weeks ago on here? There were lots of people that immediately blamed the scope, but it was the bedding.

 

[Jake Larsen]

bmart and jake...i did not say in any way there was a Form cult, only responding to Yukon's post referencing such cult...."that now he did it, he will upset said cult. I fully understand what Form is presenting to the RS crowd..it's just info that any one of us can utilize in whatever manner they choose. I've chosen to use it to try NF scopes out and see what is what. I wouldn't have done that if I thought he was full of crap or biased in any way and the data wasn't factual. I like to try things for myself before im in the "hell yeah" camp.

Appreciate the clarification. Im the same way with testing gear. In this case specifically, I’ve experienced the exact failures Form has recreated with testing, and had great luck using scopes the “drop tests” recommend.

I don’t agree with him about everything, that’s for sure. He and I have had our fair share of back and forth on this forum, especially when it comes to caliber and bullet selection. I just appreciate that from what I’ve seen, he’s quite rigorous with his testing, and clearly tries to appeal to empirical evidence when discussing these topics. Some things are subjective, such as what type of wound cavity you’d like to see on your game animals. Some things aren’t subjective; I just about guarantee that if any of these guys arguing for Leupold had my old scope on their rifle, they’d be singing a different song.


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[Yukon Cornelius]

I have a low use Leupold if anyone is interested in it.

Pulled it off a gun a dozen years ago. Glass looks perfect, can't exactly remember why I took it off now, guess my memory is just fading. Been sitting on a shelf.

View attachment 796064


First treefiddy gets it.

Yesterday I would have bought this. Today I can’t. It may fail me.


J/k

I just bought a scope last week so I have no money currently.

 

[Jake Larsen]

Not really. There are lots of variables.

Fwiw, use what you are comfortable with or can't break.

Variables like what?


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[wind gypsy]

I’m not hurt at all. You seem hurt that most people trust the choices of pro shooters and elite military units more than they trust the word of a couple random internet guys. The “tests” here are information, but the veracity of that info is unknown. I don’t doubt some have failed. But how would we know if some of them had loose scope rings, inconsistencies in their reloads, can’t call wind from one day to the next etc…?

I trusted the words of elite military snipers when they tell me their issued leupolds failed a bunch and that I should buy something different for my hunting rifle.

I still bought one of the new mk4 HDs and might buy another for a nrl rifle. I don’t think they are awful scopes but they HAVE put a less than reliable scopes on issued weapons.

 

[jimh406]

Just to clarify. He does not beat on his gear. He takes pretty good care of it. We are both too poor to buy stuff and not take good care of it. He does not even know rokslide exists and knows nothing of drop tests.

I didn't say he beat on his gear, but that doesn't mean everything is setup correctly, he has good quality rings and mounts correctly setup, etc.

I'll say it again. Buy what works for you, but that doesn't mean that the gear is a problem. Maybe it is.

 

[jimh406]

Variables like what?

Read enough threads or watch enough YouTube. I'm not here to convince you what to do.

 

[wind gypsy]

In fairness PRS embraces the fact that it's just an expensive game. The one to do away with the zero range would probably be better suited to NRL Hunter.

That’s how it is at the one day NRL hunter matches i shot last year. There was no zero range.

 

[Billy Goat]

Yesterday I would have bought this. Today I can’t. It may fail me.


J/k

I just bought a scope last week so I have no money currently.

I'll take trades

 

[Yukon Cornelius]

Appreciate the clarification. Im the same way with testing gear. In this case specifically, I’ve experienced the exact failures Form has recreated with testing, and had great luck using scopes the “drop tests” recommend.

I don’t agree with him about everything, that’s for sure. He and I have had our fair share of back and forth on this forum, especially when it comes to caliber and bullet selection. I just appreciate that from what I’ve seen, he’s quite rigorous with his testing, and clearly tries to appeal to empirical evidence when discussing these topics. Some things are subjective, such as what type of wound cavity you’d like to see on your game animals. Some things aren’t subjective; I just about guarantee that if any of these guys arguing for Leupold had my old scope on their rifle, they’d be singing a different song.


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I think I’ll be where you are eventually.

He does try to test things the same. He does provide information.

And I’ll still call the leupold haters. The tikka lovers. And the 30 cal or larger only guys all part of a cult.

What I enjoy about these threads is more information to process. I think some of the naysayers over exaggerate their experience.

I think about that guy that shared the photos the other week of the elf-x bullet that didn’t penetrate or something. And he was crusified for now showing more pictures.

I like showing proof of any claim I make if I’m going to be serious but I don’t always get a chance to take pics.

The wound channel my daughter’s eld-x did to our moose was freaking eye opening. But I know of 4 guys that swear the bullet sucks and doesn’t perform. They have personal bal experience with it failing.

 

[Jake Larsen]

Read enough threads or watch enough YouTube. I'm not here to convince you what to do.

Dude you might want to take your own advice there. I’ve been commenting on this thread from the very beginning, and made it very clear that those variables need to be accounted for, but I’ll repeat myself:

Step 1: Make sure your gun is set up properly. All sorts of videos on how to make sure your rings/bases aren’t the problem
Step 2: run a tall target test at 100 yards. You’ll find out immediately if your scope doesn’t track or return to zero
Step 3: shoot a zero conformation shot every time you take your rifle to the range. If you shoot even once a month, you’ll find out if your zero is migrating pretty quickly.
Step 4: get a different scope; and run the same tests. If the problem disappears, IT WAS THE SCOPE.

A whole bunch of us have had this experience with Leupolds. If you haven’t, count your blessings. I wish Id had a different experience. Mine cost me a 190+ mule deer that I’d hunted for 14 days.

Also, rather than reading threads and watching YouTube to inform what I do, I test my gear

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[Jake Larsen]

I think I’ll be where you are eventually.

And I’ll still call the leupold haters. The tikka lovers. And the 30 cal or larger only guys all part of a cult.

.

What can we do to pressure you into joining the cult?


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[bmart2622]

How is that trashing them? If they are a cult they are a cult. That doesn’t have to be a bad thing.

They ain’t drinking kool-aid to off each other.

They are like vegans and crossfitters.
[/QUOTE]
Ohh, so its a term of endearment?!?!

 

[jimh406]

Also, rather than reading threads and watching YouTube to inform what I do, I test my gear

So why ask what the variables are?

 

[Jake Larsen]

So why ask what the variables are?

I was assuming you had read the thread up to this point. Those variables have been discussed ad nauseam. With that context, you seemed to be implying that there was some other explanation for the poi shift.


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[Marbles]

I was assuming you had read the thread up to this point. Those variables have been discussed ad nauseam. With that context, you seemed to be implying that there was some other explanation for the poi shift.


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I regret reading the thread up to this point, but I'm sitting in the airport and trying not to so anything of value. So this train wreck is an ok distraction.

 

[fwafwow]

I regret reading the thread up to this point, but I'm sitting in the airport and trying not to so anything of value. So this train wreck is an ok distraction.

Hater