Gray Wolves Delisted

[*zap*]

Trump, .

 

[KHNC]

Not sure yet how I feel about this... but cue the massive infighting in the hunter and outdoors communities. Hopefully the states can be proactive with good plans and not get driven to a reactive approach.

Before joining the fray, remember that eating our own only allows the real threats to become bolder.

This is ridiculous. Any true hunter that has hunted around wolves would know this is a good idea. Seeing their destruction to elk and deer populations should make anyone agree. Unfortunately, wolf lovers like yourself have been the majority of the problem for years.

 

[wind gypsy]

Why can they hunt them in Idaho but not Wisconsin?

Jon tester (MT) and Mike Simpson (ID) put a rider on a budget bill to delist them in MT and ID, WY later followed. Meanwhile the Great Lakes population which is significantly larger than the Rockies population has been hosed in and out of the courts.

 

[wind gypsy]

MN DNR is re writing it’s wolf management plan and say they are accepting public comment until 11/20. I’m trying to figure out the proper way to place said comments and will share here when I know. We need all the help we can get because uniformed urbanites that form most of the states population are very pro more wolves..

 

[sveltri]

Good for some places, bad for Colorado. From a selfish hunter in Colorado I’m ok with this getting tied up so we don’t have to introduce them! Some states are already hunting the hell out of them!

This will have no impact on what's happening in Colorado. If they get voted in we'll likely never be able to manage them with hunting or trapping.

 

[monsterB]

Process was wrong, it will get litigated and kicked back to previous situation.

 

[wind gypsy]

Process was wrong, it will get litigated and kicked back to previous situation.

The process for delisting? How was it wrong?

 

[Ucsdryder]

This will have no impact on what's happening in Colorado. If they get voted in we'll likely never be able to manage them with hunting or trapping.

That’s actually not true. Right now the states can’t manage them because they’re being managed by the federal government. The feds have determined Colorado isn’t a good state for introduction. If they’re delisted then the states can do whatever they want. That’s why they’re hitting the ballot this year to coincide with the delisting.

 

[sveltri]

That’s actually not true. Right now the states can’t manage them because they’re being managed by the federal government. The feds have determined Colorado isn’t a good state for introduction. If they’re delisted then the states can do whatever they want. That’s why they’re hitting the ballot this year to coincide with the delisting.

Can you hunt wolves in Idaho and Wyoming?

 

[unchained]

We need to kill a bunch in WI.

 

[wind gypsy]

As I read more, I don't see how this addresses the concerns that got delisting overturned last time.. I fear it may be nothing more than political pandering without a real conservation win.. Time will tell.

 

[WCB]

As I read more, I don't see how this addresses the concerns that got delisting overturned last time.. I fear it may be nothing more than political pandering without a real conservation win.. Time will tell.

Nothing will address the concerns of liberal activists and judges.

 

[Middleofnowhere]

Wolves need to be managed and I 100% support delisting.

How this helps or hurts individual states, we’ll see...

 

[CorbLand]

Can you hunt wolves in Idaho and Wyoming?

Yes.

 

[sveltri]

CorbLand - That was the point I was trying to make to the other guy. Listed, delisted, mystical; it doesn't matter what they're classified as it had nothing to do with the BS that is getting rammed down our throats here in CO. Unless we have some sort of political revolution in this state we'll never be able to hunt wolves. The opportunity to hunt them will be taken away by a vote of the people (metro areas) just like spring bear hunting was. The feds are not the one's trying to introduce wolves into Colorado.

 

[TomJoad]

The science is really clear on wolves benefiting elk population and health. 25 year studies in Yellowstone show that they significantly help manage the boom and bust cycles of population growth and collapse. This doesn't mean it's either hunting as management or wolves as management, there is a place for both. This is not some anti-hunt liberal propaganda, it's not anecdotal opinion, it's fact based research:

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...es-reintroduction-helped-stabilize-ecosystem/

Additionally these studies have shown wolf introduction to be an important way for ungulate populations to survive during increasingly volatile climate swings we are experiencing as a result of climate change (yes climate change, another very real, well studied, science based reality with total global acceptance outside the USA).

Here is the detailed study on wolves in Yellowstone. Interesting read even if a bit dry:

https://besjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/1365-2656.13200

 

[MattB]

The science is really clear on wolves benefiting elk population and health. 25 year studies in Yellowstone show that they significantly help manage the boom and bust cycles of population growth and collapse. This doesn't mean it's either hunting as management or wolves as management, there is a place for both. This is not some anti-hunt liberal propaganda, it's not anecdotal opinion, it's fact based research:

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...es-reintroduction-helped-stabilize-ecosystem/

Additionally these studies have shown wolf introduction to be an important way for ungulate populations to survive during increasingly volatile climate swings we are experiencing as a result of climate change (yes climate change, another very real, well studied, science based reality with total global acceptance outside the USA).

Here is the detailed study on wolves in Yellowstone. Interesting read even if a bit dry:

https://besjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/1365-2656.13200

You do realize that Yellowstone is a national park where no hunting is allowed so that is a poor analogue for arguing the benefits of introducing wolves to places the same fact pattern does not exist?

 

[TomJoad]

You do realize that Yellowstone is a national park where no hunting is allowed so that is a poor analogue for arguing the benefits of introducing wolves to places the same fact pattern does not exist?

Yes sir. If you read the article and or studies you will understand why the study is still relevant. Hunters and wolves don't target Elk in the same ways, hunters are either filling the freezer or looking for a trophy bull based on rack size. Wolves do an exceptionally good job culling the weak which does a great job of creating a stronger herd. There is a place for both but wolves do things that hunters do not which benefit the total population health.

 

[bsnedeker]

Yes sir. If you read the article and or studies you will understand why the study is still relevant. Hunters and wolves don't target Elk in the same ways, hunters are either filling the freezer or looking for a trophy bull based on rack size. Wolves do an exceptionally good job culling the sick and the weak which does a great job of creating a stronger herd. There is a place for both but wolves do things that hunters do not which benefit the total population health.

That study has been discredited multiple times. It ignored HUGE factors that were happening in that ecosystem at the same time as the wolves were reintroduced. Elk numbers were already going down before wolves were introduced and would have continued to do so regardless.

 

[TomJoad]

That study has been discredited multiple times. It ignored HUGE factors that were happening in that ecosystem at the same time as the wolves were reintroduced. Elk numbers were already going down before wolves were introduced and would have continued to do so regardless.

Science please?
Can you please link research based articles discrediting this study? ALL CAPS doesn't make anything more real without data.