Glock 20 modifications for backcountry carry

[Rob5589]

I run Underwood Extreme Penetrators.

Nice, how was the accuracy and function? Did you do any penetration testing? Those are a consideration, barely, mainly due to price.

 

[207-12A]

Nice, how was the accuracy and function? Did you do any penetration testing? Those are a consideration, barely, mainly due to price.

Accuracy, like most pistols over $200, is better than any non-professional shooter will notice. You’re rarely going to find a pistol less accurate than you are when under legitimate pressure. Get a shot timer and do burpees at the range to simulate stress as best you can, race a buddy on a parallel course of fire for even more realistic training. I don’t do penetration tests, but my boss killed a charging grizzly last year with 2 shots out of his 20. (I live in Alaska)

 

[207-12A]

Also, zero malfunctions in around 200 rounds of extreme penetrators. Underwood’s solid cast stuff didn’t agree with my 20 for some reason, FWIW. Part of the reason I made the switch. I also run a Kenai gunfighter chest rig when fishing or a G Code RTI drop rig when backpack hunting. Happy with both. Add a light to your rig, thank me later when packing out critters in the dark. Good luck.

 

[mcseal2]

Got my Gen 4 G20 picked up and shot for the first time tonight. I bought 200 rounds of Fiocchi 180gr JHP ammo rated at 1250fps, and the only 20rd box I found of Underwood 200gr 200gr Hi-Tek coated hard cast FN rated at 1250fps.

I still prefer the trigger pull of a cocked revolver or hammer fired pistol to the striker fired trigger pull, but it doesn't seem to be hurting my accuracy at the ranges I'd likely use the pistol. It's easier for me to get first round hits with the Glock than with a revolver double action (even one with the trigger stoned), or with one of my Ruger P series or Sig 226 handguns fired double action on the first shot. The Gen 4 with no backstrap fits my hand ok. It is about as large as I'd want it, but I feel like I get a good grip with it. Quickly drawing and lining up on targets with the gun empty (and therefore really light) I noticed I tend to naturally point it just a shade high. It's not very bad and probably something that will improve with practice. I had no malfunctions of any kind with the few shots I got fired.

I shot the Fiocchi ammo first after disassembling the gun and cleaning the barrel like the book said. I put an old beer from last summer I found under the seat of the catfishing boat out at 20 yards and the first shot I blew up the can. Good start! I then got a polymer rolling ball target out and started shooting at 15 yards, rolled it out to 35 without letting it stop much. I did notice at longer ranges I had to hold a bit low. It was worse when shooting fast and may have been me getting used to the trigger as much as anything. Shooting slower I did not have much problem. The recoil was noticeable, but not bad to me. I'd say it's comparable to my Ruger P97 45 shooting the 230gr +P Hornady ammo it likes. I shot 30 of those Fiocchi loads at the target and hit very well inside 35 yards. Past that I was getting misses more often it seemed like. The target got stuck a little too and wasn't rolling, so some of the misses might have been hits. When I missed I seemed to be going right over the target. I got 30 shot before stopping to get the gates while Dad move the tractor and field cultivator through a group of heifers.

Before quitting I also shot a couple of the Underwood loads to see if the recoil was worse. It was not a lot different. Both were hits at 15 and 19 yards (after the ball rolled). The cases looked fine, but it's a tiny sample size.

I looked through the owners manual and unless I missed it there is nothing about lead bullets in there. It is mentioned on Glock's website under the FAQ section as follows:

Can I use lead bullets?

No, we recommend the use of jacketed ammunition only.


Also When looking for Glock 20 Gen 4 reviews I saw this one from American Rifleman that has the following paragraph in it:

An Official Journal Of The NRA | Glock Gen4 G20 10 mm Pistol

The Gen4 G20 provides the stopping power of a Magnum revolver in a high-capacity semi-auto.

www.americanrifleman.org

"Accuracy testing was conducted from a bench rest using five, five-shot groups fired into targets set at 25 yards. Some readers will be quick to notice one of the rounds used for formal accuracy testing was loaded with hard-cast, gas-checked lead bullets. Glock warns against the use of soft-lead bullets in its factory barrels. This is because soft-lead bullets have been known to foul the rifling, which could in turn increase the pressures inside the barrel to an unsafe level. However, true hard-cast bullets, when properly lubricated, will not cause the problems of soft-lead bullets. That's why ammunition companies like Buffalo Bore, DoubleTap and Underwood Ammo provide hard-cast hunting rounds for use in polygonal rifling pistols like the Glock."

No idea where they got their information or if it's accurate. I'm just sharing what I found. This is my first Glock and I've only owned it for a few hours and shot 32 rounds through it. I am absolutely not a Glock expert.

Anyway, I'm not looking to stir any controversy or anything. I just wanted to share what I found when trying to do my homework and my initial impression of the G20. I like it!

Last in my little initial review the G20 with 15 rounds of the 180gr JHP ammo weighs 40.4oz according to my postage scale. The loaded magazine was 12.2oz of that.

Anyway, that's what I learned in my first night with the Glock, and while waiting for it to arrive.

 

[mcseal2]

I did some experimenting with my G20 tonight after I got in the house. I found that adding my Streamlight TLR-1 adds only 4.1oz. It fits the rail great and the controls are very easy to reach. I was thinking I'd only attach the light at night in the tent, but now think it might get to stay there a lot more often. If it's ever needed after the dark the light would be a welcome addition, plus unlike night sights I already own it and it goes on instantly. I ordered a pair of Razco holsters designed to work with the light. One plain chest rig, and one that attaches to my FHF bino harness. I figure one will get used on fishing trips and the other when I'm hunting. I'll see how they work when they arrive and hope I like them. There isn't anywhere around here to try chest rigs so finding my system will be trial and error online.

Once it all gets put together it will be time for lots of practice. I will practice my drawing motion and light controls with an empty chamber each time I get out to shoot it, plus practice shooting it. As I get more comfortable I'll start slowly working up from there. I won't be in big bear country until 2020 but I will enjoy all the practice time and shooting between now and then. It will be a big change for me going from a revolver in a hip holster so I'll need to spend time building new muscle memory.

 

[Rob5589]

I am going with the universal Razco when wearing my bino harness. Still looking for something else when not wearing it.

 

[AKDoc]

Lots of good information in this thread...thanks everyone and thanks to mcseal2 for originating it.

I switched to a Gen4 Glock 20 last year. My adult son has been trying to convince me to switch from my RSRH 454 Casull to a 10mm Glock for at least a decade. He and I have had many fun discussions and debates about the Glock 20 over the years. I've just not been a Glock guy. That said, I bought one last year, and I'm glad that I did. It is sooooo much more comfortable to carry all day in a shoulder holster when pack-rafting up here in chest waders and fall hunting...and I have 16 shots!

I'm shooting 180grn handloads for practice at the range, but in the field I'm shooting 220grn HC's from Buffalo Bore.

I've done some aftermarket additions, e.g., barrel, night sights, etc.

Last fall, I used it to fire a round in the ground in front of a bluff-charging grizzly...at 8 yards!

 

[mcseal2]

I have decided to order a KKM barrel for mine. I have a hard time changing anything, the darn thing is shooting so good with the 180gr loads I'm practicing with. I haven't put it on paper yet but my polymer targets and Gatorade bottles are sure getting nailed inside 35 yards. Past that I'm better with my revolver or 1911. The triggers and my familiarity with them have more to do with that than intrinsic accuracy of each I'm sure. I didn't buy the Glock for use outside 35 yards though, I am fine with what it's doing accuracy wise.

Read some more on the Glock/lead controversy. Here is a link to a thread I started on another forum that makes as much sense to me as anything I've read so far.

Factory 10mm Ammo pull-downs – 10mm Firearms

10mm-firearms.com

Anyway I'm keeping the factory barrel. The way it shoots the 180gr HP ammo it is plenty for carrying around home if I choose to use it. I'm going to get a 6" KKM barrel since I now plan to have the light on the Glock a lot. The light sticks out past the factory barrel about 1.5" so this will put the barrel and light at a similar length. I emailed Razco and they are changing my order for me to fit this change.

I'm going to end up with quite a bit more than initially planned invested in my Glock. It's still cheaper than or equal to some of the 1911's or the 44 I was looking at. It's still lighter than any of the other options I was considering and the recoil is not bad at all to me. I enjoy shooting it more than the 44's I've shot in the past that weighted much more. I am happy with my choice and look forward to trying some different loads in the new barrel when it arrives. Until then I'm going to keep shooting the 180's from the factory barrel and getting more familiar with my new Glock. I need to order some more, at this rate the 200 I bought won't last long.

Thanks to everyone who has replied.

 

[Rob5589]

@mcseal2, spend a bunch of time dry firing. I found it helped after I purchased my G23.

 

[mcseal2]

I received my KKM 6" barrel today and got it installed. I hope to get some shooting done with it tomorrow with the 200gr Underwood hardcast FN ammo I also picked up. I will update after I get some time in with it. I'm running the factory recoil spring and rod for now and will see if I need to consider a heavier spring. If it is reliable I will likely leave it alone.

I keep liking the 10mm more the more I shoot it. It has the power of my 357's I love with more capacity and quicker recovery from recoil.

Only thing I have so far to add is that the KKM 6" barrel weighed 5.8oz on my postage scale. The factory Glock 4.6" barrel is 4.8oz. Not a huge difference. for anyone considering an aftermarket barrel. It puts the barrel about a thumbnail past the end of the light on my Glock. The weight with the TLR-1 light and KKM barrel of my Glock with 15 rounds loaded is 45oz. Not a feather by any means, but still less than the empty weight of the 1911 I really liked.

 

[2Stamp]

I received my KKM 6" barrel today and got it installed. I hope to get some shooting done with it tomorrow with the 200gr Underwood hardcast FN ammo I also picked up. I will update after I get some time in with it. I'm running the factory recoil spring and rod for now and will see if I need to consider a heavier spring. If it is reliable I will likely leave it alone.

I keep liking the 10mm more the more I shoot it. It has the power of my 357's I love with more capacity and quicker recovery from recoil.

Only thing I have so far to add is that the KKM 6" barrel weighed 5.8oz on my postage scale. The factory Glock 4.6" barrel is 4.8oz. Not a huge difference. for anyone considering an aftermarket barrel. It puts the barrel about a thumbnail past the end of the light on my Glock. The weight with the TLR-1 light and KKM barrel of my Glock with 15 rounds loaded is 45oz. Not a feather by any means, but still less than the empty weight of the 1911 I really liked.

Very nice. If I end up getting a G20 this summer I'll be putting the KKM with thier comp on it. Ends up being same length as G40 (6").

 

[Rob5589]

Right on. Mine finally came in but have to wait 10 days (Commiefornia) to pick up. I plan on keeping it stock, except sights, and running some of UW controlled expansion ammo. No big bears where we hunt, just the usual stuff so no real need for hc.

 

[mcseal2]

I shot mine with the new KKM barrel and the Underwood 200gr HC today. I had no issues the first 3 shots with feeding and then had jams on the next 5. The slide wasn't catching the round as it came forward, it ended up halfway up the case with the case pushed down. I quit at that point for the time being. I shot a full mag of the Fiocchi 180gr ammo through the new barrel right after and it worked fine.

I'm guessing this means I need the heavier recoil spring for the hot loads? Should I replace the guide rod too? What are brands/weights that work well?

Accuracy was ok, not as good as I'd hoped. I put the 8 shots in 5" at 30 yards shooting 2 handed offhand. I do better with the Fiocchi 180gr ammo through the factory barrel. It was a very small sample size too, I'll shoot more and keep track of how they do. Also the sights are about perfect left and right with the factory barrel and the 180's. With the new barrel my group was centered about 3" right at 30 yards and 4" high.

I plan to change the sights anyway so I can do some adjusting there later. I might try some of the HC 220gr ammo and see if they also hit high.

Didn't get much shooting done today, just a little between rain showers. Very wet day.

 

[mcseal2]

Right on. Mine finally came in but have to wait 10 days (Commiefornia) to pick up. I plan on keeping it stock, except sights, and running some of UW controlled expansion ammo. No big bears where we hunt, just the usual stuff so no real need for hc.

I'd have done the same except for wanting to take this gun to Alaska for several hunts. I actually probably would have just stuck with my 357 except for that, but I'm glad I got the new Glock. If AK was a one time deal I'd have probably tried some Underwood Extreme Penetrator ammo and just went that route. I may hunt some more bear areas out west too in the future where I'll like the 10mm with the stout stuff.

 

[Wrench]

You have to really be concious to not limp wrist a hot glock. The stock spring got parked on mine and I settled on a 22#.

 

[myalias789]

Stick the factory barrel back in and try some more of that underwood first before doing anything.

Betcha it’ll feed just fine.

 

[mcseal2]

I got the new barrel for the HC stuff, I'd like to make it work. I will give the heavier spring a shot and see what happens.

I'll try checking my form first. I thought of that and felt like I really locked down the last few shots. I shot the 15 Fiocchi loads after without an issue but they aren't as hot.

 

[gdog]

I've got the KKM barrel and 22lb spring in my G20. No jams, shoots great with the Underwood HC 220gr.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

I got the new barrel for the HC stuff, I'd like to make it work. I will give the heavier spring a shot and see what happens.

I'll try checking my form first. I thought of that and felt like I really locked down the last few shots. I shot the 15 Fiocchi loads after without an issue but they aren't as hot.

Sorry to hear the barrel isn’t working, I put a standard length KKM into both my gen4 g20s and changed the sights, nothing else, no recoil springs, nothing except night sights. I put around 1k blazer aluminum 200g Ammo through them before messing around with any hard cast, not sure if that makes a different but I’ve run roughly 5 boxes (100) rounds of Underwood 220g hardcast out of them to test the function etc and didn’t have a single hiccup with either one.

I did have a problem with a lone wolf barrel, rounds were just nose diving into the feed ramp, you could see right where they were hitting. Not a single issue with the KKM though.

 

[mcseal2]

My Glock is still under 100 rounds I think total. I have a heavier spring coming I think that is the problem. Teamkabob is going to mail me one from a place near him.