Don't get a 30-06

[oldskool67]

I have to post this at least once a year……back to back World War Champion

 

[rickyw]

Doesn’t kill them any deader…

So why even use a match bullet then? Other bullets kill too.
Larger wounds have the potential to kill faster - this is my hypothesis.
Until somebody lines up 1000 elk, and shoots them with a 223 match bullet, and then does the same with another 1000 elk with the same construction 308 match bullet, same impact velocity, same location (ie behind shoulder) using a blinded observer, who tracks the time it takes for the animal to go down and the distance it travels, then compares the results, it seems premature to state that a 223 match bullet can kill as quickly in every instance as a 308 match bullet. As far as I’m aware, all we have is ballistic gel modeling data and observational data from non blinded observers (including myself).
Then this would ideally be repeated with different impact locations and different impact speeds, keeping everything else the same. Then, repeat with different animals. Of course, it will never happen.

I should say I am not anti small cartridge. My son will probably hunt bears with a 223 this spring. I guess I think sometimes people just state things like they are fact when we really just have a bunch of observational data. It’s not even close to quality blinded research.

Let the tomato throwing begin!

 

[thinhorn_AK]

I have to post this at least once a year……back to back World War Champion

Didn’t do us much good in Vietnam though. In reality, the only reason the 30-06 made it to ww2 is because the government had so much ammo laying around they couldn’t justify making news guns and manufacturing more ammo. There were a lot of anti war, anti military liberals around post ww1.

 

[jmez]

Confirmation bias is real. On both sides.

Sent from my moto g power - 2025 using Tapatalk

 

[hereinaz]

One dude, basically saying the average owner of a 30/06 isn’t proficient is not close to evidence that everyone is saying a thing.

And, one random dude saying mean things about you is also not everyone.

Again, that was a vast misrepresentation of the discussion.

 

[hereinaz]

So why even use a match bullet then? Other bullets kill too.
Larger wounds have the potential to kill faster - this is my hypothesis.
Until somebody lines up 1000 elk, and shoots them with a 223 match bullet, and then does the same with another 1000 elk with the same construction 308 match bullet, same impact velocity, same location (ie behind shoulder) using a blinded observer, who tracks the time it takes for the animal to go down and the distance it travels, then compares the results, it seems premature to state that a 223 match bullet can kill as quickly in every instance as a 308 match bullet. As far as I’m aware, all we have is ballistic gel modeling data and observational data from non blinded observers (including myself).
Then this would ideally be repeated with different impact locations and different impact speeds, keeping everything else the same. Then, repeat with different animals. Of course, it will never happen.

I should say I am not anti small cartridge. My son will probably hunt bears with a 223 this spring. I guess I think sometimes people

Have you read the .223 thread?

 

[rickyw]

Have you read the .223 thread?

of course. And the thread has been a success because it was observed from non blinded observers that wounds from a 223 tmk kill more effectively than other 223 bullets, and more or as effectively as stout/bonded bullets from other larger cartridges.

In a sense it strengthens my hypothesis, that larger wound channels can kill more quickly.

So, for example, if I want to decrease the distance my bear may travel into the alders, I’d prefer a 30-06 with tmks over a 223, as long as I can shoot it well.

I want to say my intention is not to be argumentative in any way. Just an interesting discussion.

 

[FlyD10]

I think you ought to add the .270 for a complete line up haha taken all my deer, elk, and antelope with the old girl!

Haha I just might... Was trying to talk myself into a 6.5prc and a 270 is pretty much the same thing inside of 500 yards. Saw a nice used one a few days ago with 22" barrel and threaded muzzle.

 

[FlyD10]

Not everything. Bigger match bullets can make bigger wound channels. See forms 30 cal wound channel pictures, they’re on here somewhere. Heck, the 165 grain sst superperformance load out of a 30-06 makes a massive wound channel. Whether that is needed is up for debate.

You're right about that. I stopped shooting those in my '06 because a few deer that I had to track had very little blood trail (bullet practically exploded in their chest cavity). None of them went very far though and the recoil seemed pretty mild. They grouped great out of my gun too.

 

[FlyD10]

Read it again— he is talking about the general lack of skill. And, he is right about a huge proportion of the shooters at the range I see are any like the rest of the country.

He said:

section of hunters with 30-06 (or really any Cartridge)

Don't know if you knew this, but when you shoot at something with a 30-06 it's not the bullet that kills 'em.

It's the patriotic spirit of two world war victories that does the deed.

With an aught six, just hearing the crack of the rifle is enough to drop most medium sized game in their tracks. 6.5 enjoyers just won't ever understand.

 

[Macintosh]

Yawn.

Yes, a 3006 does just about any big game hunting task well. As do dozens of other cartridges bigger and smaller. Assuming you can can shoot it as-well and have proven that to yourself via legit comparison, any distinction beyond that is either preference, or minutia that in reality matters to maybe a infinitesimally small fraction of hunters. And yes, there’s a difference between recommending a gun for a first rifle that will be the only gun for all things from practice thru hunting for the foreseeable future, vs a gun to augment an already-broad assortment.

At this point its just entertainment.

 

[betelgeuse]

As far as recoil for young hunters, never underestimate determined and excited boys. They will take the recoil, I know I did.

 

[AZ_Hunter]

I have developed a nice load using 138gr hammer HHT at 3100fps out of a 20”ish barrel. Suppressed with a Bastion stock, total weight of 9.5lbs, it’s very mild from a recoil standpoint. Rifle still moves of course, but not even close to factory stock, unsuppressed with 180’s…

 

[Jon C]

Shot game with about twenty different calibers. I can say the same thing with all of them. But 35 rem,348 win,45/70 and 44 mag limited range a bit.

 

[hereinaz]

As far as recoil for young hunters, never underestimate determined and excited boys. They will take the recoil, I know I did.

Don’t overestimate the timid boys who never want to shoot another rifle and get a flinch.

 

[hereinaz]

Don't know if you knew this, but when you shoot at something with a 30-06 it's not the bullet that kills 'em.

It's the patriotic spirit of two world war victories that does the deed.

With an aught six, just hearing the crack of the rifle is enough to drop most medium sized game in their tracks. 6.5 enjoyers just won't ever understand.

I thoroughly enjoyed shooting my granddads sporterized bolt action Eddyfield 1918 (?) with telescoping rear peep, even though it kicked like a mule.

 

[oldskool67]

Didn’t do us much good in Vietnam though. In reality, the only reason the 30-06 made it to ww2 is because the government had so much ammo laying around they couldn’t justify making news guns and manufacturing more ammo. There were a lot of anti war, anti military liberals around post

Didn’t do us much good in Vietnam though. In reality, the only reason the 30-06 made it to ww2 is because the government had so much ammo laying around they couldn’t justify making news guns and manufacturing more ammo. There were a lot of anti war, anti military liberals around post ww1.

You’re right, but the 30-06 was used in the last two wars we definitively won. Coincidence? I think not.

 

[bradmacmt]

I've always said -

If Montana had a standing army it would be armed with the 270 Win and Federal Blue Box 130's.

On the same theme -

If Alaska had a standing army it would be armed with the 30-06 Sprg and Remington 180 Core-Lokt's.

I've always been a 30-06 fan, and took a lot of game with one. The 30-06 and 180 is the Everyman's Elk Rifle.

Having said that, I prefer the 308. Does the same, kicks less, uses less powder, etc., etc., - it's my favorite cartridge. If I'm going long action I prefer the 270. Does basically the same, kicks less.

 

[Kauaihunter]

Too many variables. Comparing kill probability and recoil between calibers is pretty meaningless unless you have a truly scientific comparison.

My .270 kicks more than my .30-06, both being factory rifles. I recognize that the .270 weighs less and the stocks are a different shape. That being 130’s in the .270 and 150’s in the ‘06.

The only thing that really matters is, does what you shoot work for you and has it been effective for the way you hunt?

 

[Waterfowler75]

I own bolt guns in 30-06, 243, 300wm, and 223. They all shoot great.

It's a major #firstworldproblems issue. Every time I think about buying a new rifle / caliber I talk myself out of it because from a practical standpoint pretty much all of my big game rifle hunting needs are more than adequately met by that lineup.

In fact, i could probably get rid of everything but the '06 and still be in the same boat. Not to mention 80% of the time I'm bow hunting anyway.

Owning a 30-06 is super boring - it's a total joy thief. It already does exactly what you're hoping that shiny new rifle will do from a hunting standpoint. And just like that, you can't logically justify that new rifle purchase.

I'm only 40 years old. Am I already turning into a fudd? Please help!

I’m in the same boat, boring gun that I compare everything to. Mine is suppressed now and easy to shoot. I’m recoil sensitive but that and a mercury weight in the stock lets me shoot it all day long on the bench.