Custom Carbon Fiber Stock

[Gobber]

Well, this thread has planted some invasive thoughts in the old noodle. Once there, they are like a tune that just sticks in the head, an itch that eventually needs to be scratched.

Many years ago I inherited a .243 FN Herstal with a fantastic one stage trigger. It has a 24" tapered barrel with wooden stock. I'm thinking this could be a good test bed for trying out some ideas for a light weight, custom fitted CF foam core stock. I'll be honest, I have limited experience with centerfire rifle stock geometry but would like to try out some ideas discussed in this thread.

My thought is to go through another evolution of 'rolling your own' stock and see how it goes. To help the process, I would appreciate some strait forward recommendations on how to manage the recoil impulse of this larger caliber. Definitely not looking for any 'in the weeds' arguing over technical minutia, just some strait forward guidelines.

As with previous stock projects, I like to start out with an initial set of requirements/desires of the build:
-Well fitted grip geometry - leaning toward a more vertical grip shape.
-Adjustable comb/cheek rest - got a few ideas on how to imbed threaded insets that won't add too much weight. I like an adjustable comb to allow a cheek weld that immediately puts the eye right on the reticle.
-Decent Recoil Pad with LOP adjustment using inserts.
-Somewhat Light Weight, but not sacrificing structural integrity. That's where the balancing act comes in. On the first iteration, I figure it's better to build strong and lighten up later.
-Attachment Points - QD cups and perhaps an Arca style mount.

Any thoughts or comments will be appriciated.

More to follow...

 

[TaperPin]

Sounds like a fun build! I look forward to seeing it progress.

 

[RepeatPete]

Finally got my barreled action, and the stock fit pretty well. The inletting fit great, as it was cut from the factory stock, but the barrel channel was very large as the stock was originally built for a 7 mag with a much heavier barrel. So I bedded it under the chamber and back to the front action screw to fill the gaps. The front of the forend is still a hotdog in a hallway, but I’m okay with that.
The grips ergos are much better than a standard sporter stock, but not perfect. Or maybe will just take some getting used to.
I put a Timney trigger spring, new Talleys, and a scope I got off the classifieds here. She’s all ready for deer season next week!

I’ll report back on overall stock design once I get some good shooting in.

 

[Decker9]

That’s a wild project! Looks great Pete you did an awesome job!!

 

[RepeatPete]

Wanted to do kind of a project summary and final thoughts.

I really enjoyed this project. It was technically very easy, just took time and thought. I’m already planning my next one.

Pros:
- higher comb is really nice for reducing muzzle flip. It was cool to watch my buck this year as he was hit, and helped a bunch with the tracking.
- The flush mount Arca plate is awesome - I can barely feel it when carrying, but only because the edge is square. It’s exactly as wide as the stock so it’s very unobtrusive. I didn’t have a tripod at the time I carved the foam mold so I could make the relief cuts (rounding) for the tripod dovetail above the Arca plate much smaller, which would help with aesthetics. Even with a cheesy tripod this combo is so stable, it feels like cheating for whitetails inside of 300yds.
- The flat toe is really nice for a rear bag. I’m still very new to longer range shooting and I’m sure my form could use a lot of work, but I can spot shots easily and made hits at 400, 500, and 600 yds very quickly having never shot more than 150yds before.
- Although grip ergos could be a bit better, I really like the shorter trigger reach and the little “channel” I made for my thumb right up to the safety in-line with the tang.
- Cutting the inletting section out of the factory plastic stock worked really well. The CF cross pins hold it very tight, and it made the tang, floor plate, bolt handle and bolt release all line up perfectly.

Things I would do differently next time:

- I will definitely have the barreled action on hand the whole time. This created a ton of fitting problems. The barreled action was at the family farm so I decided to wing it and hope it fit, but that’s definitely not the best idea. This would also fix my “hotdog in a hallway” of a barrel channel.
- I will spend more time on grip ergonomics. I really like the vertical grip as I shaped it, but it could be fit even better to my hand. I think I’ll use the epoxy putty linked earlier in this thread next time and spend more time getting it exactly right.
- My biggest complaint is with the negative sloping comb. The idea makes sense to me, but doesn’t seem to work super well. The top of my butt pad is around 1.5” above the bore, which is a ton compared to a factory stock. I shaped the comb on a curve, which looks different, but in the area my cheek sits, does in fact slope down. However, the eye relief at 3x vs 15x for my scope, while only listed at 3.9” vs. 3.5”, makes me need to scoot my head towards the scope when on higher magnification. Therefore, the placement of my eye relative to the scope changes. I’m at 3x a lot in the thick woods and I feel like I’m looking through the very top of the scope, and at 15x it feels like I’m looking through the bottom of the scope and need to use my neck muscles to raise my head up a little. Maybe this is primarily a fault of my scope, I’m not sure as I haven’t used high-end optics and always previously used 2-7 or 3-9 scopes. I can see the use for a negatively sloping comb for a high recoiling magnum, or maybe for a gun that will only see a fixed power scope or scope with a smaller magnification range, but it doesn’t work great for me here. I’m interested to see how this works out with the rokstock, which has a much more sloping comb. @Formidilosus @Ryan Avery @Unknown Munitions No need to clog up the rokstock thread, but real question/concern here: have you guys experienced anything like this with high combs that slope severely?

Too wordy as always, but thanks for following along and for all the helpful advice!

 

[TaperPin]

Wanted to do kind of a project summary and final thoughts.

I really enjoyed this project. It was technically very easy, just took time and thought. I’m already planning my next one.

Pros:
- higher comb is really nice for reducing muzzle flip. It was cool to watch my buck this year as he was hit, and helped a bunch with the tracking.
- The flush mount Arca plate is awesome - I can barely feel it when carrying, but only because the edge is square. It’s exactly as wide as the stock so it’s very unobtrusive. I didn’t have a tripod at the time I carved the foam mold so I could make the relief cuts (rounding) for the tripod dovetail above the Arca plate much smaller, which would help with aesthetics. Even with a cheesy tripod this combo is so stable, it feels like cheating for whitetails inside of 300yds.
- The flat toe is really nice for a rear bag. I’m still very new to longer range shooting and I’m sure my form could use a lot of work, but I can spot shots easily and made hits at 400, 500, and 600 yds very quickly having never shot more than 150yds before.
- Although grip ergos could be a bit better, I really like the shorter trigger reach and the little “channel” I made for my thumb right up to the safety in-line with the tang.
- Cutting the inletting section out of the factory plastic stock worked really well. The CF cross pins hold it very tight, and it made the tang, floor plate, bolt handle and bolt release all line up perfectly.

Things I would do differently next time:

- I will definitely have the barreled action on hand the whole time. This created a ton of fitting problems. The barreled action was at the family farm so I decided to wing it and hope it fit, but that’s definitely not the best idea. This would also fix my “hotdog in a hallway” of a barrel channel.
- I will spend more time on grip ergonomics. I really like the vertical grip as I shaped it, but it could be fit even better to my hand. I think I’ll use the epoxy putty linked earlier in this thread next time and spend more time getting it exactly right.
- My biggest complaint is with the negative sloping comb. The idea makes sense to me, but doesn’t seem to work super well. The top of my butt pad is around 1.5” above the bore, which is a ton compared to a factory stock. I shaped the comb on a curve, which looks different, but in the area my cheek sits, does in fact slope down. However, the eye relief at 3x vs 15x for my scope, while only listed at 3.9” vs. 3.5”, makes me need to scoot my head towards the scope when on higher magnification. Therefore, the placement of my eye relative to the scope changes. I’m at 3x a lot in the thick woods and I feel like I’m looking through the very top of the scope, and at 15x it feels like I’m looking through the bottom of the scope and need to use my neck muscles to raise my head up a little. Maybe this is primarily a fault of my scope, I’m not sure as I haven’t used high-end optics and always previously used 2-7 or 3-9 scopes. I can see the use for a negatively sloping comb for a high recoiling magnum, or maybe for a gun that will only see a fixed power scope or scope with a smaller magnification range, but it doesn’t work great for me here. I’m interested to see how this works out with the rokstock, which has a much more sloping comb. @Formidilosus @Ryan Avery @Unknown Munitions No need to clog up the rokstock thread, but real question/concern here: have you guys experienced anything like this with high combs that slope severely?

Too wordy as always, but thanks for following along and for all the helpful advice!
View attachment 637175
View attachment 637177
View attachment 637178
View attachment 637176

This has been a super cool build - even though it’s not the style of the stock I’m planning, I learned a lot from your project and am revamping my design.

Traditionally (I realize not much is traditional anymore, and that’s not all bad), scopes were mounted with the shooter in their natural shooting position - we’d often tell the person to close their eyes, get the rifle up like you would shoot it, then open their eyes. On the highest power the scope would be brought back to just get a full field of view. I don’t know if that would help, but to this day I’ve found it useful to check eye relief from different positions by closing an eye. Some positions just don’t allow a normal eye relief.

I‘ve talked with some Weatherby Mark V owners about the negative angle on the cheek piece of the wood stocks. A few said it might help with recoil, they just can’t say, and a few said it made no difference as long as your cheek is tight to the stock. It makes sense with the extra high scopes we’re using that cheek weld is important, but harder to get.

There are so many cool stocks out now - yesterday I went to Scheels just to feel different stocks, and the different grip angles and thicknesses were really surprising.

Looking forward to the next build!!

 

[Ryan Avery]

Photos can be deceiving but that stock looks no where near 1.5 above bore line. There also looks like there is a bow in your negative comb?

Don’t take this as me nitpicking. It’s awesome you made your own stock!

 

[Formidilosus]

Wanted to do kind of a project summary and final thoughts.

I really enjoyed this project. It was technically very easy, just took time and thought. I’m already planning my next one.

Pros:
- higher comb is really nice for reducing muzzle flip. It was cool to watch my buck this year as he was hit, and helped a bunch with the tracking.
- The flush mount Arca plate is awesome - I can barely feel it when carrying, but only because the edge is square. It’s exactly as wide as the stock so it’s very unobtrusive. I didn’t have a tripod at the time I carved the foam mold so I could make the relief cuts (rounding) for the tripod dovetail above the Arca plate much smaller, which would help with aesthetics. Even with a cheesy tripod this combo is so stable, it feels like cheating for whitetails inside of 300yds.
- The flat toe is really nice for a rear bag. I’m still very new to longer range shooting and I’m sure my form could use a lot of work, but I can spot shots easily and made hits at 400, 500, and 600 yds very quickly having never shot more than 150yds before.
- Although grip ergos could be a bit better, I really like the shorter trigger reach and the little “channel” I made for my thumb right up to the safety in-line with the tang.
- Cutting the inletting section out of the factory plastic stock worked really well. The CF cross pins hold it very tight, and it made the tang, floor plate, bolt handle and bolt release all line up perfectly.

Things I would do differently next time:

- I will definitely have the barreled action on hand the whole time. This created a ton of fitting problems. The barreled action was at the family farm so I decided to wing it and hope it fit, but that’s definitely not the best idea. This would also fix my “hotdog in a hallway” of a barrel channel.
- I will spend more time on grip ergonomics. I really like the vertical grip as I shaped it, but it could be fit even better to my hand. I think I’ll use the epoxy putty linked earlier in this thread next time and spend more time getting it exactly right.
- My biggest complaint is with the negative sloping comb. The idea makes sense to me, but doesn’t seem to work super well. The top of my butt pad is around 1.5” above the bore, which is a ton compared to a factory stock. I shaped the comb on a curve, which looks different, but in the area my cheek sits, does in fact slope down. However, the eye relief at 3x vs 15x for my scope, while only listed at 3.9” vs. 3.5”, makes me need to scoot my head towards the scope when on higher magnification. Therefore, the placement of my eye relative to the scope changes. I’m at 3x a lot in the thick woods and I feel like I’m looking through the very top of the scope, and at 15x it feels like I’m looking through the bottom of the scope and need to use my neck muscles to raise my head up a little. Maybe this is primarily a fault of my scope, I’m not sure as I haven’t used high-end optics and always previously used 2-7 or 3-9 scopes. I can see the use for a negatively sloping comb for a high recoiling magnum, or maybe for a gun that will only see a fixed power scope or scope with a smaller magnification range, but it doesn’t work great for me here. I’m interested to see how this works out with the rokstock, which has a much more sloping comb. @Formidilosus @Ryan Avery @Unknown Munitions No need to clog up the rokstock thread, but real question/concern here: have you guys experienced anything like this with high combs that slope severely?

Your issue is almost certainly the curve or bow in your cheek piece-





If it were like this, you more than likely wouldn’t have problems-




Also, a hard cheekweld isn’t the best either.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

Just wandered into this thread for the first time. Have you experimented with the bond of your foam core to your laminations in the sun? Only reason I ask is in another portion of my life I spent ridiculous amounts of hours and quite a bit of money working on a composite camper project only to have to scrap the whole thing because in the hot sun the laminations would bubble off the core. Dunno if it was expanding trapped blowing gasses or what. I was using foamular 600 board. Hopefully its a non-issue with your material choice and you many not even notice with the small size and geometry involved either way.

 

[RepeatPete]

Photos can be deceiving but that stock looks no where near 1.5 above bore line. There also looks like there is a bow in your negative comb?

Don’t take this as me nitpicking. It’s awesome you made your own stock!

Good catch, I got my measurements messed up - I’m 1.5” above the original comb, which is 0.5” above the bore line. Definitely not super high, as I’m still using low rings to get the scope where I want, but high relative to factory.

Your issue is almost certainly the curve or bow in your cheek piece-

View attachment 637230



If it were like this, you more than likely wouldn’t have problems-

View attachment 637231


Also, a hard cheekweld isn’t the best either.

I guess that makes sense, my cheek is right at the area where I’m falling off the curve, so the difference in comb height for a small amount of eye relief is exaggerated, compared to just a straight taper. I didn’t fully think that through

 

[RepeatPete]

This has been a super cool build - even though it’s not the style of the stock I’m planning, I learned a lot from your project and am revamping my design.

Traditionally (I realize not much is traditional anymore, and that’s not all bad), scopes were mounted with the shooter in their natural shooting position - we’d often tell the person to close their eyes, get the rifle up like you would shoot it, then open their eyes. On the highest power the scope would be brought back to just get a full field of view. I don’t know if that would help, but to this day I’ve found it useful to check eye relief from different positions by closing an eye. Some positions just don’t allow a normal eye relief.

I‘ve talked with some Weatherby Mark V owners about the negative angle on the cheek piece of the wood stocks. A few said it might help with recoil, they just can’t say, and a few said it made no difference as long as your cheek is tight to the stock. It makes sense with the extra high scopes we’re using that cheek weld is important, but harder to get.

There are so many cool stocks out now - yesterday I went to Scheels just to feel different stocks, and the different grip angles and thicknesses were really surprising.

Looking forward to the next build!!

I have heard the same method of closing your eye to make sure the scope is in the right place, I just didn’t think to use it at both low and high power. I agree, this one just makes me want to try more stocks, it’s crazy how different they can feel with small tweaks.

Just wandered into this thread for the first time. Have you experimented with the bond of your foam core to your laminations in the sun? Only reason I ask is in another portion of my life I spent ridiculous amounts of hours and quite a bit of money working on a composite camper project only to have to scrap the whole thing because in the hot sun the laminations would bubble off the core. Dunno if it was expanding trapped blowing gasses or what. I was using foamular 600 board. Hopefully its a non-issue with your material choice and you many not even notice with the small size and geometry involved either way.

I have not done that at all. I did a bit of research as I knew some resin would eat some types of foam, but that’s as far as I got. Was it epoxy resin? If I’m brave maybe I’ll leave it out in the sun this summer and see what happens.

@Formidilosus Is there any benefit to a negatively sloping comb besides the perception of recoil reduction due to the comb surface falling away from your face?

 

[SloppyJ]

I'm going to show my wife this thread and tell her I could have been doing cool shit like this if we didn't have two kids! Just kidding, I love those little shits but this is super cool man.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

I have not done that at all. I did a bit of research as I knew some resin would eat some types of foam, but that’s as far as I got. Was it epoxy resin? If I’m brave maybe I’ll leave it out in the sun this summer and see what happens.

Yes epoxy.

 

[TaperPin]

Yes epoxy.

That’s a huge bummer to put that much work in and have it delaminate.

 

[RepeatPete]

I'm going to show my wife this thread and tell her I could have been doing cool shit like this if we didn't have two kids! Just kidding, I love those little shits but this is super cool man.

Haha, do you think it would have taken me over 4 months if it was just me? Proud member of the two distractions club

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

That’s a huge bummer to put that much work in and have it delaminate.

That’s an understatement.

 

[Formidilosus]

@Formidilosus Is there any benefit to a negatively sloping comb besides the perception of recoil reduction due to the comb surface falling away from your face?

Yes. Reduced facial pressure as the rifle recoils, which lessons the down and right push that a right handed shooter induces on the comb.

 

[Steamer]

Pretty killer stock you’re building here. Would you want to consider an adjustable comb instead of the Monte Carlo style ? I have installed the same salmon river arca rail on a few stocks and been very happy with mine. Nice work!

 

[Divide93]

Really cool thread! I was self taught in composites for one year , recently, on canoes. Wet layup, vacuum bagging, repairs, glass , carbon , innegra, poly's, basalts, aramids, etc. Really cool stuff and the bagging can be done with quite an array of material without spending a lot!

 

[RepeatPete]

Pretty killer stock you’re building here. Would you want to consider an adjustable comb instead of the Monte Carlo style ? I have installed the same salmon river arca rail on a few stocks and been very happy with mine. Nice work!

Thanks! I would definitely consider an adjustable comb for a different stock build. For this one I was trying to keep it simple to learn, and every adjustable comb system I could think of was heavy and/or expensive.

Really cool thread! I was self taught in composites for one year , recently, on canoes. Wet layup, vacuum bagging, repairs, glass , carbon , innegra, poly's, basalts, aramids, etc. Really cool stuff and the bagging can be done with quite an array of material without spending a lot!

Thanks you! It really is - I’m in the planning phase for a second stock build and starting to look into bagging more seriously.