Colorado Wolf Shot and Killed… in Wyoming

[elkhunter505]

Will of the people? It was razor thin majority 50.9/48.1 or something like that… also how would you feel if your neighbor who has no lawn or garden decided that you need to have rabbits in garden, oh by the way you make your living by selling those vegetables…. But yeah just deal with it.

I’m not saying I agree with how the wolves got there. I vehemently opposed it but couldn’t vote because I was not a resident. It was a colossal waste of taxpayer dollars when wolves were already in CO and the wolves that were showing up were the ones that had learned to avoid cattle and people. I’m just saying the reality of the situation is they are there now and people need to learn to live with them because the general public is not going to stand for them being killed or removed whether hunters/ranchers want that or not. I’m not saying to not haze or kill a wolf that is eating cattle, I’m just saying there’s no need to celebrate it when it happens and if they’re not bothering ranchers then I don’t see a reason to go out and kill them.

 

[Wapiti66]

Well the will of the people brought them back. Do I agree with the way it was done, absolutely not, but do I think ranchers/hunters should just get a free for all and send them back into extirpation, absolutely not. If a rabbit was in my garden, I would try and relocate it first but if killing it was necessary I would. That doesn’t mean that I should go kill every rabbit on the landscape because that one rabbit ate my garden. They deserve a place on the landscape too. Does that mean drop them in CO in the middle of ranchers, no, but if they find their way there and are not causing damage, I don’t see why we need to go out of our way to persecute them.

People aren’t killing every wolf on the landscape, otherwise they’d be extinct. This wolf didn’t choose to wander into CO, it was trapped in another country and brought there…according to its movements it really didn’t prefer CO, otherwise it would have stayed. I’ve not heard of ranchers running down every wolf they can find and killing it, but when they are out ranching and come across dead livestock due to wolves then many choose or prefer to take action that protects their livelihood. How do you define not cause any damage? Are there vegetarian wolves that choose not to do wolf things, like kill and eat livestock?

 

[5MilesBack]

I don’t see why we need to go out of our way to persecute them.

"Persecute" them. Holy cow.....oh my goodness. Say no more........really, please say no more.

 

[Mtnmilsurp]

Well the will of the people brought them back. Do I agree with the way it was done, absolutely not, but do I think ranchers/hunters should just get a free for all and send them back into extirpation, absolutely not. If a rabbit was in my garden, I would try and relocate it first but if killing it was necessary I would. That doesn’t mean that I should go kill every rabbit on the landscape because that one rabbit ate my garden. They deserve a place on the landscape too. Does that mean drop them in CO in the middle of ranchers, no, but if they find their way there and are not causing damage, I don’t see why we need to go out of our way to persecute them.

The will of what people? Not those affected by the decision. Denver/Boulder/Ft Collins people deciding what's going to happen to people they have no meaningful association with.

 

[elkhunter505]

People aren’t killing every wolf on the landscape, otherwise they’d be extinct. This wolf didn’t choose to wander into CO, it was trapped in another country and brought there…according to its movements it really didn’t prefer CO, otherwise it would have stayed. I’ve not heard of ranchers running down every wolf they can find and killing it, but when they are out ranching and come across dead livestock due to wolves then many choose or prefer to take action that protects their livelihood. How do you define not cause any damage? Are there vegetarian wolves that choose not to do wolf things, like kill and eat livestock?

No I’m definitely not saying that. If they’re doing damage to cattle then they should be managed. It just seems like that a lot of hunters are celebrating whenever any wolf gets killed which I just don’t jive with. They’re an animal on the landscape the same as us and other animals but we choose to persecute them because other humans are using them as a tool to get rid of hunting. Rather, we should use our base to improve the public opinion of hunters to the general public. Celebrating wolves being killed is in my opinion actively degrading our credibility with the general public.

 

[elkhunter505]

The will of what people? Not those affected by the decision. Denver/Boulder/Ft Collins people deciding what's going to happen to people they have no meaningful association with.

I have already said I disagreed with the way it was done. I’m just trying to add a different opinion into the mix to give others something to think about. It sounds as though that opinion is not wanted here, so I will recuse myself from this discussion.

 

[Gila]

We had the same problem with the Lobos a few years ago. They were being shot and more than one too. Some were trapped and moved to a more remote area in SW New Mexico. But some were not trapped and are starting to move North toward Colorado. The primary release point was in the best part of the Gila for Elk hunting. Large cattle ranches nearby.

It was a disaster waiting to happen. Eventually their numbers became a problem. Science dictates that they should have been released more SW to avoid fragmented habitat (cattle ranches). I think we have the responsibility to keep them from the brink of extinction but people need to go about it in a smart way. I have not seen any data or heard anything lately but I don’t think the Lobo is up for de-listing.

 

[elkhunter505]

We had the same problem with the Lobos a few years ago. They were being shot and more than one too. Some were trapped and moved to a more remote area in SW New Mexico. But some were not trapped and are starting to move North toward Colorado. The primary release point was in the best part of the Gila for Elk hunting. Large cattle ranches nearby.

It was a disaster waiting to happen. Eventually their numbers became a problem. Science dictates that they should have been released more SW to avoid fragmented habitat (cattle ranches). I think we have the responsibility to keep them from the brink of extinction but people need to go about it in a smart way. I have not seen any data or heard anything lately but I don’t think the Lobo is up for de-listing.

They’re not up for delisting as far as I know. Results from the elk study should be out soon which could shed some light on the impacts of Mexican Grays on elk demographics in the Gila. We’ll see what they come up with as far as wolf-specific mortality rates. I think they’re comparing heavy wolf areas to light wolf areas but I am not sure. I know 4 of the 5 students have defended their theses and are working on publishing their work. The doctoral student is still working on the population model. I think there may be annual reports that are available to the public as well but I haven’t went and looked for them.

 

[elkhunter505]

I have not seen any data or heard anything lately but I don’t think the Lobo is up for de-listing.

Here is a link to the website with the publications and theses. https://www1.usgs.gov/coopunits/project/173352151040/jwcain

The population modeling hopefully will be done soon, but the 4 theses that are published publicly can give some insight on gray wolf and cougar diets and elk behavior and resource selection in comparison to wolves.

 

[Wapiti66]

No I’m definitely not saying that. If they’re doing damage to cattle then they should be managed. It just seems like that a lot of hunters are celebrating whenever any wolf gets killed which I just don’t jive with. They’re an animal on the landscape the same as us and other animals but we choose to persecute them because other humans are using them as a tool to get rid of hunting. Rather, we should use our base to improve the public opinion of hunters to the general public. Celebrating wolves being killed is in my opinion actively degrading our credibility with the general public.

That’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it. My opinion is if you give an inch they’ll take a mile. Next we will hear stuff like “even most hunters agree wolves are necessary and belong in x”. And then there is no opposition to reintroduction, and as you’ve said it’s not about the wolf, it’s about controlling and eliminating hunting. If hunters and ranchers don’t stand their ground and oppose the environmental wackos then who will? My answer, nobody.

Another problem is these aren’t an animal on the landscape until we trap them and put them there.

 

[elkhunter505]

That’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it. My opinion is if you give an inch they’ll take a mile. Next we will hear stuff like “even most hunters agree wolves are necessary and belong in x”. And then there is no opposition to reintroduction, and as you’ve said it’s not about the wolf, it’s about controlling and eliminating hunting. If hunters and ranchers don’t stand their ground and oppose the environmental wackos then who will? My answer, nobody.

Another problem is these aren’t an animal on the landscape until we trap them and put them there.

I agree with not placing them there in the first place. Reintroducing predators is particularly controversial in comparison to ungulates because predators do kill. It’s much easier to watch grass get eaten than cows get eaten. Predators have shown an unbelievable amount of adaptability when it comes to recolonization. The advocates for reintroduction are fools if they think dropping them somewhere is going to be better for them than just letting them figure it out themselves. These people calling for reintroduction do not care about the welfare of the animal, they care about their own ability to see or know the animal is there.

 

[PredatoronthePrairie]

Thought u recused yourself.

 

[manitou1]

The Rocky Mountain Wolf Project is absolutely insane with their sense of entitlement. Telling neighboring states how they have to manage their wildlife and livestock is rather rich of them. The only way to fix a wolf that predates on livestock is through lethal means. Does anyone know if the wolves from BC were causing problems in BC before they were transplanted in Colorado?


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They insist Wy use "other means".
Why? In Wyoming we are allowed to kill wolves, so why in the world would we NOT kill them when they are killing Rancher's livelihood.
They need to go buy themselves a cute cuddly toy wolf to sleep with and leave the game management to sane adults.

 

[bayoublaster7527]

Because they despise rural people, in Colorado or Wyoming. They want to exert complete urban control over the backwards, ignorant people living in the hinterland. It infuriates them that Wyoming residents are able to enjoy freedom without urban, progressive oversight. If you want a glimpse into what wolf advocates think of ranchers, farmers, and sportsmen, just tune into a CPW Commission meeting. It has been particularly vile as of late, since the Prop 127 folks reorganized and ramped up attendance.

 

[parshal]

...a ballot proposition to usurp the CPW commission in order to eliminate hunting and agriculture. ...

Wildlife and Ecosystem Conservation Commission | Colorado General Assembly

leg.colorado.gov

OMG !!!

 

[chanson_roland]

Was it driving a Subaru?

 

[bayoublaster7527]

OMG !!!

Yep. Donate early and often to Coloradans for Responsible Wildlife Management.

Coloradans for Responsible Wildlife Management

We focus on the public’s interests for maintaining a century-old track record of our natural resources, including wildlife, habitat, and farms and ranches.

savethehuntcolorado.com

They will be fighting this in the Secretary of State Title Board and Colorado Supreme Court first. And good lawyers aren’t cheap….

 

[3325]

“This senseless killing was avoidable,” said Rob Edward, President of the Rocky Mountain Wolf Project. “Wyoming ranchers and federal agencies have the tools and knowledge to prevent livestock losses without resorting to lethal measures in most cases. Their refusal to implement these practices is reckless and undermines the hard-fought efforts to restore wolves in Colorado.”

The wolf wasn’t in Colorado, scooter. How does killing a dispersal wolf in Wyoming, even one that started in Colorado, undermine anything going on in Colorado? It doesn’t.

“The organization also said that surrounding states should treat Colorado’s voter-mandated restoration with respect and manage the wolves responsibly.”

Wrong. Colorado voters should respect Wyoming’s wolf policy for wolves in Wyoming.

“We cannot allow the progress made in Colorado to be undone by Wyoming’s failure to act responsibly,” Edward said. “We demand accountability from USDA Wildlife Services and Wyoming ranchers. They must immediately adopt non-lethal coexistence practices if they hope to prevent further unnecessary losses.”

You can’t allow? You ain’t got any choice, scooter. You’re in no position to allow or disallow Wyoming to do anything.

You demand? You self-righteous brat. See comments about allowing above.

Wyoming must? The only “must” happening here is you must be delusional if it makes sense in your world for Wyomingites to be responsive the desires of Colorado voters.

 

[omicron1792]

Newest proposition is 500k fine and 10 years in jail for killing a wolf. Thats more than most get for killing a human.

Colorado is gone.

 

[ScreamingPotato]

“This senseless killing was avoidable,” said Rob Edward, President of the Rocky Mountain Wolf Project. “Wyoming ranchers and federal agencies have the tools and knowledge to prevent livestock losses without resorting to lethal measures in most cases. Their refusal to implement these practices is reckless and undermines the hard-fought efforts to restore wolves in Colorado.”

The wolf wasn’t in Colorado, scooter. How does killing a dispersal wolf in Wyoming, even one that started in Colorado, undermine anything going on in Colorado? It doesn’t.

“The organization also said that surrounding states should treat Colorado’s voter-mandated restoration with respect and manage the wolves responsibly.”

Wrong. Colorado voters should respect Wyoming’s wolf policy for wolves in Wyoming.

“We cannot allow the progress made in Colorado to be undone by Wyoming’s failure to act responsibly,” Edward said. “We demand accountability from USDA Wildlife Services and Wyoming ranchers. They must immediately adopt non-lethal coexistence practices if they hope to prevent further unnecessary losses.”

You can’t allow? You ain’t got any choice, scooter. You’re in no position to allow or disallow Wyoming to do anything.

You demand? You self righteous brat. See comments about allowing above.

Wyoming must? The only “must” happening here is you must be delusional if it makes sense in your world for Wyomingites to be responsive the desires of Colorado voters.

Hopefully Wyoming sent them the bill for the livestock depredation.