Colorado Preference Point Focus Group

[NickyD]

Only if one of those 5 guys pick it up do one of those people lose points. The original tag holder loses nothing and the 5 guys who get called next all know where that tag will end up free of having to use points.

The 5 dudes who get called all know they have a chance to hunt the same unit 2 years in a row if they wait and try to pick it up on the leftover list.

I find it hard to believe that most people would go for that method. The odds of you getting a tag like that are relatively low, especially considering the fact that everyone can now see what tags are being reissued a day or two before they are made available.

I’m also against not getting your points refunded after returning a tag. I assume the majority of people returning tags have legitimate reasons, not just because they couldn’t find what they were looking for

 

[MuleyFever]

Leftovers should go to the next person that didnt draw. You opt in to the alternate list and get called if the tag comes open, like in NV. Tags with no people on an alternate list for that tag go to the leftover list.

 

[cnelk]

I find it hard to believe that most people would go for that method. The odds of you getting a tag like that are relatively low, especially considering the fact that everyone can now see what tags are being reissued a day or two before they are made available.

I’m also against not getting your points refunded after returning a tag. I assume the majority of people returning tags have legitimate reasons, not just because they couldn’t find what they were looking for

You wouldnt like Wyoming then. They dont offer anything refunded, tag or PPs, unless youre almost dead.

 

[realunlucky]

I think not earning a point for the current year if you return your tag has decreased some of the foolishness of just turning back a tag for non legitimate reasons.

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[svivian]

That seems highly unlikely with how the leftover works. That would be a huge gamble to let it go to leftover since you are likely not going to get it

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What gamble? if you were called you know you are drawing the tag next year. I would rather have a year to scout then a couple months. Not only that I would like a chance to hunt the same unit two years in a row.

Also You still have to option to turn in tag and get points back if its for a medical emergency. Where do you define a legitimate reason to turn a tag in that doesn't result in lost points?

 

[cnelk]

Leftovers should go to the next person that didnt draw. You opt in to the alternate list and get called if the tag comes open, like in NV. Tags with no people on an alternate list for that tag go to the leftover list.

The only problem with this is there are some hunt codes that have so many allocated tags there are always leftovers.

Having a required minimum 1-2 PP tag would be the way to send it to the next person in line

 

[lak2004]

What gamble? if you were called you know you are drawing the tag next year. I would rather have a year to scout then a couple months. Not only that i would like a chance to hunt the same unit two years in a row.

The gamble is getting it on the leftover list. If it takes more than 5 pts, you use your points if they call you and you accept. Good luck getting it before someone else on the leftover. And you MAY draw next year, it's not usually a guarantee unless you have the most points out of all the 1st choice applicants.

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[svivian]

The gamble is getting it on the leftover list. If it takes more than 5 pts, you use your points if they call you and you accept. Good luck getting it before someone else on the leftover. And you MAY draw next year, it's not usually a guarantee unless you have the most points out of all the 1st choice applicants.

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I'm sorry to tell you that people are in fact doing it. And If I waited 15+ years to draw a tag I'm not going to give up any scouting when I have an almost certain chance of drawing the following year.

 

[dreamingWest]

I think reducing the amount of OTC archery tags a couple of years ago helped a little. I think they could go ahead a take away all OTC units. That way Colorado isn't the ultimate back-up plan.

I also like the idea of needing points for the leftovers. (Subtract the points that were needed to draw the tag).

Last year, I did take advantage of points restoration when turning in a tag. So I would be a hypocrite to say remove this perk. I was very grateful to have this option. With point restoration, I suppose it still lets Colorado be a back-up plan. (Although you don't gain a point and aren't refunded money.) But as long as leftover tags use up points, it shouldn't contribute to the point creep problem.

Regarding going to bonus points or luck of the draw systems. This may be inevitable, but I hope Colorado gives us at least a few years notice to use preference points!

 

[lak2004]

I'm sorry to tell you that people are in fact doing it. And If I waited 15+ years to draw a tag I'm not going to give up any scouting when I have an almost certain chance of drawing.

All I'm saying is that would be tough. They may be doing it and getting lucky or it's not a desirable unit. I keep tabs on the leftover when I dont draw tags and I rarely get anything, especially a sought after tag

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[street]

In general, I like the way the pp system is now as a resident. I think the most tweaking probably should occur only on the NR side.

 

[sndmn11]

In general, I like the way the pp system is now as a resident. I think the most tweaking probably should occur only on the NR side.

AND the leftover/reissue process

 

[street]

AND the leftover/reissue process

I can definitely agree with that.

 

[lak2004]

OTC is not sustainable due to the impacts of all the other recreation in CO. Something has to give before low calf recruitment in elk makes the populations tank. Maybe not completely getting rid of it, but at the very least, Caps or select a unit.

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[cnelk]

^^^^ That’s only true for certain parts of Colorado.

There are other places where the CPW gives away B List cow tags like Halloween candy

 

[lak2004]

^^^^ That’s only true for certain parts of Colorado.

There are other places where the CPW gives away B List cow tags like Halloween candy

True. But easy to set tags for gmu and/or management units. It definitely sounds like most of us agree the current system makes CO the most taken advantage of place to hunt in the west. I know I won't even hunt an OTC rifle tag anymore because I feel like I'll get shot or in a fight with someone who feels they own a spot. It's a bummer and a lot of folks feel the same which is part of the influx of numbers in archery and muzzleloader seasons.

I still say go the NM route to a degree...

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[Ucsdryder]

I've been invited to join a CPW focus group in a few weeks.

"Your focus group will discuss the topic of preference points. The purpose of these focus groups is to hear from resident and nonresident big game hunters about challenges and potential solutions they see with CPW’s license distribution approach and to help inform future big game season structure processes. This is one part of a multi-step process and your feedback is critical to improving the system."

I would prefer to come with solutions instead of just complaints.

In an effort to better represent all hunters (at least all well known Roksliders), I'm looking for any thoughts that I should present outside of my own little bubble. Feel free to drop some ideas here for me to bring up.

I’ll fix all the problems... easy peasy

1. Get rid of preference points. There are too many people in the game at this point. When the points system was implemented it was a different world. All random draw. It’s not fair to a 12 year old kid that he’ll never catch the top 10 units in Colorado because he was born in 2012. Waiting for people in front of you to die so you can hunt is dumb, and we’re a few years away from it. And if you have X dollars in points, too bad. You could have used them at any point. It was your choice to wait decades.


2. If we don’t want to do that, which we should, then If you get an A list tag you lose all points. If you get more than 1 b list tag in 3 years you lose all your points.

3. Oh…and 90/10. Just so I can hear the Texans whine about public lands and how we should sell them all because residents get preferential treatment.


4. Why the hell do residents and nonresidents go through same process for turn back tags. Resident tags open at 9am, non residents at 12pm.

 

[ColoradoV]

I agree that all returned tags should go to resident hunters as well for the first 24 hrs then to public at large after that. Great change!

90-10 or at most 85-15 res/non res split will also help most folks out.

Elimination of the loophole of hunting and building a point is flat out the cornerstone that has allowed extreme elk point creep.

It is interesting that most folks (except the cba) want to see archery go all limited. Going all limited for archery then using all your points on any hunt and we will see point creep vastly reduced. Leave rifle the way it is but buy a license even a leftover type b cow tag burn all your points!!

You can’t go below zero so the opportunity for 0 point holders will amazing or no doubt you can hunt multiple elk every year. Now if 76 is what you want you will not be mucking up a otc unit waiting for your tag. It would basically roll back the overcrowding prevalent in every otc unit in Co or a very good deal!!

Elimination of the landowner and leftover hunt while you keep your points would help but on a scale so low it the numbers show it will not effect point creep - but still a good idea when coupled with burn your points on any hunt for that species. Stand alone it is worthless…

From who I talk with using all your points on any hunt is getting very strong support and will be a welcome change to reduce point creep!

Or the time is coming to pick a otc unit or wait to draw a better unit but not both and that will be the best change Co has made in quite some time.

 

[5MilesBack]

I'm a big fan of the reissue process. It's like Christmas in August now. It at least makes things exciting now that they're putting those tags back out to the public. But I would also be OK with using any and all points for those tags as well.

 

[BassAssassin04]

• Change to a bonus point system or at least some percentage of random draw.
• All choices use points.
• Average points for party applications
• Increase the penalty for returning a tag ($15 is a joke for what it cost to apply everywhere. I applied for a 2nd choice unit to conserve my points and plan on returning it unless any my other options don't pan out. I don't think I should be able to do this, but if I can I will.)
• Cut back on multi unit tags. (unless the units are a migratory route and it makes since to have them combined, but the 10 unit tags just pool the majority or people in one unit)
• Define OTC tags to the same units as draw tags. (I'd assume the state doesn't want to loose the extra revenue generated by every hunter using OTC Colorado as their elk back up)