.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[Thegman]

I would not classify 5.56 as an “all around” big game cartridge as indicated by the thread title since there are so many other great options.

You may not have meant to say it this way, but this makes no sense; it's is a non-sequitur.

What does the fact that there are other great all-around options have to do with the 223 not being able to be one as well?

 

[WNYRP]

FNG made it through 398 pages. My mind is numb and blown at the same time...

 

[SBR Sarge]

FNG made it through 398 pages. My mind is numb and blown at the same time...

Good on ya for investing the time!

It does paint a compelling picture of the potential for the 223 caliber.

While I don’t foresee me doing any big game hunting with the 223, it is certainly working well for many and has lots going for it; light recoil, inexpensive practice ammo, good availability…

 

[Shraggs]

I think those of us who use and have killed with a 223/77 tmk or similar should type that ie 223/75 or 73 or 62 etc. Leaving it just to a 223 discussion I think continues to make this a head stamp discussion to those like mark c. Stuck on hunting myths and equating killing with caliber. Small calibers with higher fragmenting heavy for caliber bullets is the key - bullets matter more than head stamp.

Mark c, have you personally whiteness, ie used or been with anyone who’s killed an animal with a 223/77 tmks? Does following the thread mean you read every page?

 

[mtnwrunner]

FNG made it through 398 pages. My mind is numb and blown at the same time...

Get out the gold card.......

Randy

 

[Rolltide]

LOL...it would be hard to have made it this far and not already broken out the gold card!

 

[sierracharlie338]

LOL...it would be hard to have made it this far and not already broken out the gold card!

When I read through this thread the second time my account took a serious hit. Now my kid has her own RSS lol

 

[Pharmseller]

Some dude on 24hrcampfire has a stainless Tikka Varmint 1-8” in .223 Rem for sale.

No dog in the fight.

 

[Mark.c]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”. I certainly don’t require to anyone to agree with me.

From the Sierra website:
The 77 grain Tipped MatchKing (TMK) allows seating to an OAL that permits cartridges to be loaded into M16/AR15 magazines.

While they are recognized around the world for record-setting accuracy, MatchKing® and Tipped MatchKing® bullets are not recommended for most hunting applications.

This has been a great discussion and that is specifically what hunting forums are for. This thread title should be renamed however, if other points of view are not wanted.

 

[Bugger]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”. I certainly don’t require to anyone to agree with me.

From the Sierra website:
The 77 grain Tipped MatchKing (TMK) allows seating to an OAL that permits cartridges to be loaded into M16/AR15 magazines.

While they are recognized around the world for record-setting accuracy, MatchKing® and Tipped MatchKing® bullets are not recommended for most hunting applications.

This has been a great discussion and that is specifically what hunting forums are for. This thread title should be renamed however, if other points of view are not wanted.

Other points of view are welcome to be tested. This one has failed many times. Good luck tho.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”. I certainly don’t require to anyone to agree with me.

From the Sierra website:
The 77 grain Tipped MatchKing (TMK) allows seating to an OAL that permits cartridges to be loaded into M16/AR15 magazines.

While they are recognized around the world for record-setting accuracy, MatchKing® and Tipped MatchKing® bullets are not recommended for most hunting applications.

This has been a great discussion and that is specifically what hunting forums are for. This thread title should be renamed however, if other points of view are not wanted.

What filter did you use to only see dead deer in this thread?

 

[SteveAndTheCrigBoys]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”. I certainly don’t require to anyone to agree with me.

From the Sierra website:
The 77 grain Tipped MatchKing (TMK) allows seating to an OAL that permits cartridges to be loaded into M16/AR15 magazines.

While they are recognized around the world for record-setting accuracy, MatchKing® and Tipped MatchKing® bullets are not recommended for most hunting applications.

This has been a great discussion and that is specifically what hunting forums are for. This thread title should be renamed however, if other points of view are not wanted.

If you're a better listener than you are a reader, here you go. The "manufacturer doesn't recommend it" point is covered pretty thoroughly.

Hunt Backcountry Podcast 469 | Why Smaller Calibers May Be Better For Big Game Hunting — The Experience Project

This podcast will challenge decades of

exomtngear.com

Hunt Backcountry Podcast 470 | Why Smaller Calibers May Be Better For Big Game Hunting (Part 2) — The Experience Project

This is the second half of a conversation that explores why smaller rifle calibers may be better for big game hunting. This Hunt Backcountry Podcast episode explores how different types of bullets create different wound channels, the relationship between impact velocity and bullet...

exomtngear.com

Hunt Backcountry Podcast 479 | Smaller Caliber Listener Q&A with Form — The Experience Project

Form returns to the Hunt Backcountry Podcast to answer your questions that were submitted after our two-part podcast series on

exomtngear.com

 

[Pharmseller]

Don’t hammer him overmuch, he’s polite.




P

 

[mt terry d]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”.

I think the whole point of the thread, and the evidence backs it up, is that not only can this combo kill with good shots but that most hunters probably should use the 223/77 TMK over other/larger calibers for North American big game animals. Ive about 60 years hunting experience and shooting this combo for only a short time has proven more lethal and ethical for me than using larger calibers.

Evidence to the contrary is more than welcome but yet to be provided.

 

[Leinad]

I have a couple smiths that don’t care because they understand how/what will stop the suppressor moving. But, as you said most won’t. And on a 223, I would absolutely do a 1/2-28 to 5/8-24 adapter. It’s simple and easy.

While I’m not saying that someone should, or should not do it- you in fact can get 5/8-24 on a T3 lite barrel-

6.5cm cut to 20”, and threaded 5/8-24-
View attachment 734560

View attachment 734561


View attachment 734562


That rifle has somewhere above 4,500 rounds on that barrel in that configuration. I have had others threaded 5/8-24, and have shot a lot of them like that. These days I mostly have them threaded 9/16-24 with an adapter.

What is your preferred method for keeping your suppressors from moving/loosening? I run direct thread and am reflexively checking for tightness after having my can loosen up a few times. I see something on the threads there.....something that will withstand the heat? Thanks!

 

[Formidilosus]

What is your preferred method for keeping your suppressors from moving/loosening? I run direct thread and am reflexively checking for tightness after having my can loosen up a few times. I see something on the threads there.....something that will withstand the heat? Thanks!

Screw them on tight, and shoot a lot. Carbon is a great thread-lock.

 

[Fartrell Cluggins]

Actually I did follow the thread. I am surprised as to some of the oddly defensive reactions from the 77grain 5.56 crowd when offered other points of view. I have seen lighter caliber shots big game animals go poorly resulting in loss or a drawn out track. Certainly use the legal caliber of your choice. It’s your hunt not mine.

While we are sharing anecdotes, I'll add this. I have been involved in far more protracted searches because of poorly placed shots than ineffective tissue damage from a smaller bore rifle. In all cases the poorly placed shots came from heavier recoiling rounds.

The cool thing about this thread is that it takes readers past the anecdotal.

 

[DJL2]

My opinion may be conventional but it is based on 30+ years of hunting experience. The dead deer “evidence” photos are certainly interesting. Any bullet can kill with a good shot but IMO using a small caliber un-bonded cup core target bullet for hunting big game is not ideal. Sierra recommends against it. My point is not “can” you use it but “should”. I certainly don’t require to anyone to agree with me.

The "...but Sierra says..." thing has been beat to death. I'm not a .223 hunter, but you can bet that if an "un-bonded cup and core target bullet" is an option, it's what I'm using. I'd add "tipped" to that list - goes a long way towards alleviating the issue with a small cavity/meplat and a jacket potentially drawn thicker at the tip/nose. A fully or partially frangible "match" bullet is what I want. They simply cannot be beat for emphatic terminal performance across a broad range of impact velocities AND contribute to actually making the shot in the first place (less wind drift).

 

[dombo3]

My first post here. Apologies if misplaced ...
Read some of the many pages on this thread and listened to the experience project podcasts with @Formidilosus.

...had been going down the bigger is better path.

I'm now looking to embark on a project to acquire a 5-600yard, low recoil, lightweight deer hunting rifle. Had the .223 in my sights until the 22 creedmoor reared its head with the 88 eldm.

Pros/cons?

Currently shooting Tikka's - 6.5x55 and 6.5 PRC.

 

[atmat]

My first post here. Apologies if misplaced ...
Read some of the many pages on this thread and listened to the experience project podcasts with @Formidilosus.

...had been going down the bigger is better path.

I'm now looking to embark on a project to acquire a 5-600yard, low recoil, lightweight deer hunting rifle. Had the .223 in my sights until the 22 creedmoor reared its head with the 88 eldm.

Pros/cons?

Currently shooting Tikka's - 6.5x55 and 6.5 PRC.

Either of your current rifles are fine.

But you don’t even need a 22cm, the 223 is plenty and super cheap component wise.