.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[sturner88]

It’s on the shoot2hunt podcast Form Friday - FF.EP.18 “meat loss with match bullets?”

He talks about a few topics but in there he mentions suitable ammo for 223 practice and mentions AAC in their various offerings. While not a “go buy this ammo” it’s an off the shelf TMK offering that is half the cost of black hills. Will I still use BH as my primary - yes. But I’ll shoot just about anything 69 grain and up for practice. And if I really had to - I would practice with 55 grain.

As someone with a few cases of this ammo, I really wish 1-2 rounds per 20 round box wouldn’t fail to feed from my tikka 223. High SD, poor FTF, but groups well when it does feed.

 

[Big_wals]

Two more medium sized boars with the AAC 75 sabres tonight. Around 60 yards, no exit on the bigger pig, good sized exit hole on the slightly smaller one.

 

[mt100gr.]

If you guys want some good ol fudd lore and entertainment from some uneducated folks then you'll enjoy this video.

Watched this last night and my wife said the one guy is too squishy to take seriously.

I don't think they read the entire thread. SMH. What a couple of dorks!!

 

[Big_wals]

I don't think they read the entire thread. SMH. What a couple of dorks!!

I don’t know which one of the guys on this thread posted this comment, but it sums them up perfectly.

 

[KHntr]

Another data point for the 88 ELD m ala Kimber Montana 223AI this morning. Had a bull elk charge in from a kilometer out to a few cow calls, he’d run as hard as he could go for 200 m, stop and bugle, and charge again. Once he hit about 300 yards out he stopped bugling, or stopping. He was just running to the last spot he heard a cow call.
I was set up over my crossed hiking poles and hit a cow chirp on the diaphragm to stop him and he turned mostly quartered in to me and looking hard at 109 yards. Impact velocity would have been right at 2400fps.
Stuck an 88 ELD m into the leading edge of his onside shoulder and flicked in another round as he took three hops away from me. As he turned so he was quartering away I could see blood blowing out his mouth, and then he started to take a couple sideways steps and I laced him again (only because I find the shooting to be the fun part) and he flopped and died.
First shot to on the ground I estimate between 6 and 10 seconds.

First one exited at the last rib. Second one smashed 2 ribs going in and 1 on the offside at the back of the shoulder meat. I think that one exited, but it might be hung up in there.

A pair of 1.5” holes bored through everything. Lungs were littered with bone shard fragments around the wound cavity.

Follow up to the original autopsy after butchering last week.
First shot entered just inside the point of the onside shoulder (as per the field pic) and exited at the last rib.
Second shot entered a couple of inches back from the trailing edge of the onside shoulder and exited through the offside shoulder, just catching the edge of the scapula. Wound channels after a 10 day hang in the cooler were 2.5”+ in the muscle tissue. Wounds in rib cage with supporting bone structure were 1.5”.

 

[sierracharlie338]

Had to turn this crap off. Couldn’t make it to five minutes of their convo. If it’s not for you cool, why make a video about something you clearly know nothing about.

If you guys want some good ol fudd lore and entertainment from some uneducated folks then you'll enjoy this video.

Watched this last night and my wife said the one guy is too squishy to take seriously.

 

[Castle Rock]

They look and sound like real outdoorsmen

If you guys want some good ol fudd lore and entertainment from some uneducated folks then you'll enjoy this video.

Watched this last night and my wife said the one guy is too squishy to take seriously.

 

[Thegman]

Follow up to the original autopsy after butchering last week.
First shot entered just inside the point of the onside shoulder (as per the field pic) and exited at the last rib.
Second shot entered a couple of inches back from the trailing edge of the onside shoulder and exited through the offside shoulder, just catching the edge of the scapula. Wound channels after a 10 day hang in the cooler were 2.5”+ in the muscle tissue. Wounds in rib cage with supporting bone structure were 1.5”.

This combo has to vie for the Most Efficient Killer prize. What was the approximate penetration of the 88s?

 

[Thegman]

If you guys want some good ol fudd lore and entertainment from some uneducated folks then you'll enjoy this video.

Watched this last night and my wife said the one guy is too squishy to take seriously.

I really have to admit, this is probably his best video ever. I was literally laughing out loud while watching it.

It was as funny as an episode of The Office with Dwight and Michael being interviewed about hunting with a 223.

 

[Blurred]

Well mainly due to ease of placement.


However, when you get to heavy for caliber bullets that fragment, there’s simply more bullet to fragment. A 77gr bullet in 30cal of like construction will penetrate about 6-8 inches at same velocity. A 77gr .224 bullet like the TMK penetrates 16-20 inches. People go the wrong way with “marginal” rounds- they think because it’s small that they need a super tough, deep penetrating bullet. All that does is create narrow wounds that take more time for the animal to succumb. A heavy, rapidly fragmenting bullet creates a much wider wound, while still having enough bullet to penetrate.

Hello Form. I've listened to your pod with the Exo guys for literally 10x. You confirm what I've always considered logical for so many years as a bowhunter. I live in Gunnison, Colorado...so legally I can't use less than 243 so I'm going to build a 6 creed. Anyway, for now, I've taken my Sig Cross 308 from heavy for caliber (178 eld-x) to a 125g tmk.....recoil feels about half and It's shooting sub moa @200 yards. I'll definitely use this setup on my mule deer tag...but have also considered it on my elk tag. The only inconsistency from what you suggest is that I'm not using a "heavy for caliber" round. I load the 125g tmk (and sometimes 125g sst) with 47.0 grains of IMR 4895 which gets me around 2900 FPS. I will not hunt with it beyond 500 yards. My question is, have you ever experimented with a similar setup? Do you think penetration is sufficient for such a "light for caliber" projectile when it comes to Elk? Thanks for everything you've done in this industry.

 

[B_Reynolds_AK]

“Trying to hunt at them”

That video is gold.

“The percentages” , yet literally talking out their backsides and using no data.

“77 TMK, I feel if your going to do this, it’s probably one of the worst match bullets”

 

[pbroski]

Those guys are armchair experts. Probably never been in the backcountry.

 

[BigNate]

Bummer that the video is getting so much traffic it'll probably help them.

I'm sure they mean well. But Hopefull Ballistics doesn't understand ballistics at all, and neither does the host.

 

[Poe]

I know it’s not large game but I got a chance to finally try out the new to me tikka and the 73gr eldm. Shot was around 100 yards and actually pushed part of the lungs out the exit hole. Hoping to try this out on white tails this season aswell as a bunch more coyotes. I will be splitting my coyote calling up between the tikka with the 73’s and my semi auto .223 shooting Speer 52gr HP’s and 60gr vmax

 

[Gettincloser]

I know it’s not large game but I got a chance to finally try out the new to me tikka and the 73gr eldm. Shot was around 100 yards and actually pushed part of the lungs out the exit hole. Hoping to try this out on white tails this season aswell as a bunch more coyotes. I will be splitting my coyote calling up between the tikka with the 73’s and my semi auto .223 shooting Speer 52gr HP’s and 60gr vmax

Every hunt is a coyote hunt if one shows up!

I have been waiting on a big buck to come and and seen a coyote... I instantly stop deer hunting and start coyote hunting! Every time!

 

[IDHoundsman]

I know it’s not large game but I got a chance to finally try out the new to me tikka and the 73gr eldm. Shot was around 100 yards and actually pushed part of the lungs out the exit hole. Hoping to try this out on white tails this season aswell as a bunch more coyotes. I will be splitting my coyote calling up between the tikka with the 73’s and my semi auto .223 shooting Speer 52gr HP’s and 60gr vmax

Hell yeah! Looks like the coyotes I’ve whacked with the 73 ELDM out to 493 yards.

 

[BLJ]

Every hunt is a coyote hunt if one shows up!

I have been waiting on a big buck to come and and seen a coyote... I instantly stop deer hunting and start coyote hunting! Every time!

Fact.

 

[ChrisAU]

22CM 291 yards, had just stood up out of his bed or was about to lay down. One poorly placed 75 gr ELDM broke his front left humerus clean in two just below the joint with the scapula and entered low in his chest. No damage to heart but lower right lung was shredded. No exits. This shot knocked him down into his bed where he laid for a few seconds and appeared very dead. However, he did stagger back to his feet and took a couple steps in the sage brush immediately surrounding him. 2nd shot tore through his neck and blew a baseball size wound out the back. That was lights out of course. Died about 10 feet from his bed.

 

[KHntr]

This combo has to vie for the Most Efficient Killer prize. What was the approximate penetration of the 88s?

On last years moose (170 yards), a mule deer (400 yards), this years elk (109 yards), I’m seeing about 3 feet + of penetration.
To be fair, exits are small, and would appear to be just a piece of the core. On the other hand, the ones we’ve caught have been jacket and core together, but separated.

 

[Thegman]

On last years moose (170 yards), a mule deer (400 yards), this years elk (109 yards), I’m seeing about 3 feet + of penetration.
To be fair, exits are small, and would appear to be just a piece of the core. On the other hand, the ones we’ve caught have been jacket and core together, but separated.

I usually shoot through ribs, lungs/heart, but on this last, sample of one, bear, hitting a bunch of bone, it seemed like there might have been more penetration(???). Have you seen anything like that?