.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[waterengineer]

Long time lurker...time to add a data point.

First off I have followed the thread since the fist few posts and have read it in entirety a couple times over the last couple years. I update the thread daily during hunting season also.

I typically hunt ridge areas and fields in NWGA. Shots range from 10-400yds. I prefer to carry my 10.5" 300 Blackout suppressed SBR, 1-4 scope, with Barnes Tac-Tx as it is easy to carry, does not require ear pro and has never let me down. It has also has yet to require a tracking job more than 30yds. I am comfortable with a 250yd shot with this setup.

I am a AR15 hobbyist. I like the ergos, Im comfortable with one and I shoot them often from 10-300yds in various positions at my local rifle club. For all the reasons pointed out in this thread I gravitate towards 223/556 but I still hunt with my 300BO.

The new area I am hunting this year is so thick plus leaves have been late to fall that my Vortex 1-4 just isnt doing it.....I missed a couple doe opportunities recently. I did not have time to swap optics so I took my 10.5" red dot equipped 556 house gun with 73ELDs out on Christmas eve morning to get those does I missed the previous outing.

Well less than an hour in the 180lb +/- 7point we call Loki that Ive been watching on camera for 6 months comes in to about 40yds stopping in one of the very, very few shooting lanes available in this spot. In the 10sec transaction he took a 73 ELD in center of chest, turned with tail down and slowly trotted off. I felt like it was a good hit and thought I heard him crash down the North (steep) side hill out of sight. I waited an hour to get down.....alone with my thoughts.

Once I got down to find him I found ZERO blood or hair.....nothing. I was sick. Looked for 1.5hrs before calling in the dog and help. Dog found him in 5min, buried in a ravine head down 30yd from where he was hit. We drug him an hour out of the ridges to where a vehicle could access for the remaining haul.

We do gutless processing, were wore out and were in a hurry to say the least so no necropsy pics. Opening him up he was full of blood, I assume the heart was destroyed and pumping it into the chest cavity.

Soooo.....It work and worked well at killing a mature buck. Maybe better than my beloved barnes 110s. It did not leave any blood to track and in this area thats a problem without a good dog. I will try the 77TMK before our season is over

View attachment 651474View attachment 651475View attachment 651476View attachment 651477

JJ3, congratulations on the nice buck!

Here are some more details on my family’s experience this year to add to the data. The lack of blood trail with the 77 TMK is the reason my dad switched to the 62 gr Fusion. Both deer shot with the TMK made it to the woods before dying. They both died within 40 yards of where they were shot. For him, I think it was an issue of shot placement (too far back). He hit the doe with 62 gr Fusion a little further forward and the deer died in the field.

I also killed two with the 77 TMK this year with a 16” AR-15. The first was around 200 yards. I hit low and just behind the shoulder. There was a huge blood trail and the deer was less than 20 yards from where I shot.

After seeing the lack of blood trail on my dad’s two deer, I came back to this thread and saw recommendations for a high shoulder shot. The second deer I shot was around 100 yards and I went with the high shoulder shot. It was nice seeing the deer drop immediately.


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[Tobe_B]

Not sure this entirely counts as a data point. I finally got the chance to utilize some TMKs in my 5.56 rifle. Got a chance to go chase pigs and aoudad on my family’s place in Texas. I committed and only brought one rifle with me, with the sole purpose of shooting a ram with it. Unfortunately, I didn’t get any chances at a ram, but I took two pigs that presented opportunities. Both dropped in their tracks. I shot one of them twice even though he didn’t need it, and only because my daughter was standing behind me and concerned he was going to try to get up.

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[Tobe_B]

Second pig was a bloody mess. Both shots were about 65 yards. Drives me crazy that I can’t legally use this combination in Colorado. But I’ll never bother carrying more in states that allow it.


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[Xlr8n]

Bump

 

[Darryle]

I tried to search and yielded nothing. And since this thread has the most comprehensive collection of 223 data/experiences, has any on tried the Nosler 224 64gr Protected Point Bonded Solid Base?

 

[Mike D Texas]

I tried to search and yielded nothing. And since this thread has the most comprehensive collection of 223 data/experiences, has any on tried the Nosler 224 64gr Protected Point Bonded Solid Base?
View attachment 652279

Not yet Darryle but I have some loaded up for my 220 Swift.

I expect massive carnage.


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[xsn10s]

I tried to search and yielded nothing. And since this thread has the most comprehensive collection of 223 data/experiences, has any on tried the Nosler 224 64gr Protected Point Bonded Solid Base?
View attachment 652279

Here's a thread that I found. https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...414866/all/nosler-224-64-gr-solid-base-bonded

 

[ElPollo]

I have two Oryx tags next week. Private land guided so almost guaranteed within 200 yds...

Still nervous to try 223 for some reason. Might just go with the mighty 6.5 creed...

I’m guessing these are the scimitar-horned variety in TX. Just remember that their vitals are further forward than the deer and elk you are used to shooting. Look it up before you hunt. Those critters have a reputation as being tough to kill, but it’s just because a normal shot in the crease ends up around the rear edge of the lungs. Hit ‘em in the pump and they die like everything else.

 

[roosiebull]

Long time lurker...time to add a data point.

First off I have followed the thread since the fist few posts and have read it in entirety a couple times over the last couple years. I update the thread daily during hunting season also.

I typically hunt ridge areas and fields in NWGA. Shots range from 10-400yds. I prefer to carry my 10.5" 300 Blackout suppressed SBR, 1-4 scope, with Barnes Tac-Tx as it is easy to carry, does not require ear pro and has never let me down. It has also has yet to require a tracking job more than 30yds. I am comfortable with a 250yd shot with this setup.

I am a AR15 hobbyist. I like the ergos, Im comfortable with one and I shoot them often from 10-300yds in various positions at my local rifle club. For all the reasons pointed out in this thread I gravitate towards 223/556 but I still hunt with my 300BO.

The new area I am hunting this year is so thick plus leaves have been late to fall that my Vortex 1-4 just isnt doing it.....I missed a couple doe opportunities recently. I did not have time to swap optics so I took my 10.5" red dot equipped 556 house gun with 73ELDs out on Christmas eve morning to get those does I missed the previous outing.

Well less than an hour in the 180lb +/- 7point we call Loki that Ive been watching on camera for 6 months comes in to about 40yds stopping in one of the very, very few shooting lanes available in this spot. In the 10sec transaction he took a 73 ELD in center of chest, turned with tail down and slowly trotted off. I felt like it was a good hit and thought I heard him crash down the North (steep) side hill out of sight. I waited an hour to get down.....alone with my thoughts.

Once I got down to find him I found ZERO blood or hair.....nothing. I was sick. Looked for 1.5hrs before calling in the dog and help. Dog found him in 5min, buried in a ravine head down 30yd from where he was hit. We drug him an hour out of the ridges to where a vehicle could access for the remaining haul.

We do gutless processing, were wore out and were in a hurry to say the least so no necropsy pics. Opening him up he was full of blood, I assume the heart was destroyed and pumping it into the chest cavity.

Soooo.....It work and worked well at killing a mature buck. Maybe better than my beloved barnes 110s. It did not leave any blood to track and in this area thats a problem without a good dog. I will try the 77TMK before our season is over

View attachment 651474View attachment 651475View attachment 651476View attachment 651477

Super cool buck! Well done

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

They are SS

I shoulda pulled the trigger. The BP sale is over.

 

[Grundy53]

On sale 500 CT 77 TMKs

Creedmoor Sports - Precision Reloading and Shooting Gear

Shoot and Reload with the Pros! Creedmoor Sports has served the Precision Shooting Community for over 40 years in Centerfire, Small-bore, Air Rifle and Pistol Disciplines.

www.creedmoorsports.com

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[Ozarkansas]

JJ3, congratulations on the nice buck!

Here are some more details on my family’s experience this year to add to the data. The lack of blood trail with the 77 TMK is the reason my dad switched to the 62 gr Fusion. Both deer shot with the TMK made it to the woods before dying. They both died within 40 yards of where they were shot. For him, I think it was an issue of shot placement (too far back). He hit the doe with 62 gr Fusion a little further forward and the deer died in the field.

I also killed two with the 77 TMK this year with a 16” AR-15. The first was around 200 yards. I hit low and just behind the shoulder. There was a huge blood trail and the deer was less than 20 yards from where I shot.

After seeing the lack of blood trail on my dad’s two deer, I came back to this thread and saw recommendations for a high shoulder shot. The second deer I shot was around 100 yards and I went with the high shoulder shot. It was nice seeing the deer drop immediately.


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How was the wound channel/penetration on the Fusion?

the poor blood trails but quick deaths matches what I’ve seen from .223s and more frangible 6mm bullets. Shooting in the shoulder certainly solves the problem but I can’t stand to waste that much meat if it can be avoided.

 

[JJ3]

Thanks for the compliments on the buck, is getting mounted. It’s been a slow year here with a huge acorn crop. Very little movement of the whitetail population compared to years past. Specifically the does…our group typically harvests 30-40 does per season as suggested by state biologist, this year we are at 13. I have seen a total of 3 with no shot opportunity.

I say that to say I was not expecting this specific buck or the amount of bucks I’ve seen in general. My buck tags are filled for the year and I usually don’t do that. Close to a dozen spikes, 6 and 8pt collectively and have 4 other nice 8, 10 and a 12pt on camera.

How was the wound channel/penetration on the Fusion?

the poor blood trails but quick deaths matches what I’ve seen from .223s and more frangible 6mm bullets. Shooting in the shoulder certainly solves the problem but I can’t stand to waste that much meat if it can be avoided.

I searched the thread last night for “62 fusion” lots of info and input from the community. They work and appear to exit more reliably.

A guy in Kansas harvested a really nice 10pt at around 200yd I believe with several necropsy pics. It also looks really good in gel tests.

I picked up a bunch of 62 fusion pulls a while back and have a great load with A2520 and TAC. Both over 3000fps in 18” barrel and my 10.5 and 12.5 are consistent poa/poi to 200yd with them. May try them out tomorrow from 10.5”

 

[Evasal]

if 223 with 1:8" twist using 77 TMK is good... 22-250 with 1:8" twist using 77 TMK must be great?

(=

 

[waterengineer]

How was the wound channel/penetration on the Fusion?

the poor blood trails but quick deaths matches what I’ve seen from .223s and more frangible 6mm bullets. Shooting in the shoulder certainly solves the problem but I can’t stand to waste that much meat if it can be avoided.

The penetration was good and there was an exit. The exit in the hide wasn’t very large. We were in a hurry and didn’t inspect the wound channel too closely. I wouldn’t hesitate to use the 62 gr Fusion on a NC whitetail.

I also prefer to not waste a lot of meat. Where I shoot in the future will be based on how close the deer are to the thick brush where it is easy to lose a deer without a blood trail.

 

[Nomosendero]

That is what I do!

 

[SBR Sarge]

Black Hill 5.56 77gr TMK in stock at Bone Frog.

Honestly, I should buy some. But I don’t see me hunting with 223/5.56 anytime so you all might as well clean them out of their stock!

5.56 77GR Black Hills Tipped Match King TMK (D556N19)

5.56 77GR Black Hills Tipped Match King TMK (D556N19) Black Hills' focus is on handcrafting ammunition for serious folks who demand it works every time without fail. No magic loads. No gimmickry. They are certainly not well versed in corporate speak either. Instead, they stake our reputation on...

www.bonefroggunclub.com

 

[h2so4]

Black Hill 5.56 77gr TMK in stock at Bone Frog.

Honestly, I should buy some. But I don’t see me hunting with 223/5.56 anytime so you all might as well clean them out of their stock!

5.56 77GR Black Hills Tipped Match King TMK (D556N19)

5.56 77GR Black Hills Tipped Match King TMK (D556N19) Black Hills' focus is on handcrafting ammunition for serious folks who demand it works every time without fail. No magic loads. No gimmickry. They are certainly not well versed in corporate speak either. Instead, they stake our reputation on...

www.bonefroggunclub.com

Anyone on the fence about getting the black hills 77gr tmk should go ahead and get it now while it’s available. It won’t be made for a good while now. What exactly a while is, I’m not sure. But the previous dry spell was 8-12 months (if not longer, I don’t have the exact dates at the moment).
Especially at these prices. Expecting a price increase later this year.

 

[Drenalin]

Saw a couple more whitetails hit with the 73 ELD-M yesterday, both around 150 yards. One was a spine hit, no vitals, and required a cleanup shot. The other was a good hit, with the deer running about 50 yards before expiring. Bullet traveled through lungs into offside shoulder with the amount of damage (read borderline excessive) I’ve come to expect from this bullet.

 

[Pickettpuncher]

Long time lurker...time to add a data point.

First off I have followed the thread since the fist few posts and have read it in entirety a couple times over the last couple years. I update the thread daily during hunting season also.

I typically hunt ridge areas and fields in NWGA. Shots range from 10-400yds. I prefer to carry my 10.5" 300 Blackout suppressed SBR, 1-4 scope, with Barnes Tac-Tx as it is easy to carry, does not require ear pro and has never let me down. It has also has yet to require a tracking job more than 30yds. I am comfortable with a 250yd shot with this setup.

I am a AR15 hobbyist. I like the ergos, Im comfortable with one and I shoot them often from 10-300yds in various positions at my local rifle club. For all the reasons pointed out in this thread I gravitate towards 223/556 but I still hunt with my 300BO.

The new area I am hunting this year is so thick plus leaves have been late to fall that my Vortex 1-4 just isnt doing it.....I missed a couple doe opportunities recently. I did not have time to swap optics so I took my 10.5" red dot equipped 556 house gun with 73ELDs out on Christmas eve morning to get those does I missed the previous outing.

Well less than an hour in the 180lb +/- 7point we call Loki that Ive been watching on camera for 6 months comes in to about 40yds stopping in one of the very, very few shooting lanes available in this spot. In the 10sec transaction he took a 73 ELD in center of chest, turned with tail down and slowly trotted off. I felt like it was a good hit and thought I heard him crash down the North (steep) side hill out of sight. I waited an hour to get down.....alone with my thoughts.

Once I got down to find him I found ZERO blood or hair.....nothing. I was sick. Looked for 1.5hrs before calling in the dog and help. Dog found him in 5min, buried in a ravine head down 30yd from where he was hit. We drug him an hour out of the ridges to where a vehicle could access for the remaining haul.

We do gutless processing, were wore out and were in a hurry to say the least so no necropsy pics. Opening him up he was full of blood, I assume the heart was destroyed and pumping it into the chest cavity.

Soooo.....It work and worked well at killing a mature buck. Maybe better than my beloved barnes 110s. It did not leave any blood to track and in this area thats a problem without a good dog. I will try the 77TMK before our season is over

View attachment 651474View attachment 651475View attachment 651476View attachment 651477

We shot one in the chest with a 25-06 this year, no blood trail. I think your issue, and mine, was shot placement, and not bullet used.