.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[Juan_ID]

According to the form, it expires 1/31/2024

I was looking to buy one through eurooptic and on there it says it needs to be purchased by December 31, but the form does say it needs to be purchased by January 31 2024. Apologies! I may need to try and buy another now… That is a $75 savings after all.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

I promised my wife that I will not buy another firearm last year and I kept my promise like a champ.
It's 2024 now and to my luck, Bass Pro has a promo on the TX3 Lite D-18. Additionally, Beretta is running a rebate on the T3X so as of 10 min ago, I can finally say that I'm joining the rockslide special team. Can't wait to pick it up.

That's a great value.
$949 ($400 off retail) less $75 rebate is $874, but you've got a fluted and threaded barrel, oversized bolt knob, and cerakote. In .243 at least, the Eurooptic cart price is either $699 (blue) or $799 (stainless), and after rebate you can't upgrade bolt knob, threading, etc... for $874 total.

 

[swavescatter]

Threading a barrel is under $200 and you can easily upgrade the bolts for around $50.

Not a terrible deal though if you like the D18's.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Threading a barrel is under $200 and you can easily upgrade the bolts for around $50.

Not a terrible deal though if you like the D18's.

The D-18 has more than threading and a bolt handle.

The cart price for the blued .223 is $699 from Eurooptic. Less $75 rebate you're looking at $624.

D-18 add-ons:
$150 to thread (estimated)
$70 oversized bolt handle (DIY estimate at $50 plus tax and shipping)
$100 to flute
$150 muzzle brake
$125 cerakote
$595

$624+$595= $1,219

So $874 for the D-18 after rebate is a damn good deal to most I think. The .243 is 1:8 twist as well.

EDIT: also comes with a fluted bolt, so probably another $100 or so in savings over the standard blued model on sale at Europtic.

 

[ianpadron]

I’m in the market for a SWFA fixed 6X if anyone has one to sell. My mid/low tier sig isn’t cutting it


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I have multiples of both.

FOV and eye box of 6x are truly as good as it gets. Was pounding rocks out to 518 yds this past week with zero need for more mag, spotting my own shots with eaas.

The 10s are more finicky in terms of eye box but still better than average. They become a better tool past 400 yds or so to my eyes.

Seems to be a relatively universal train of thought that if bulk of your shots are 0-400, get the 6x...majority are longer, get the 10. That is my sentiment as well.

One thing to note is that if I was planning on doing minimal to no still hunting, the 10x would be my choice as I find the reticle subtensions easier to see and even if a short shot presented itself, if you've practiced shouldering your rifle with speed it really isn't much of a hindrance at all. Assuming you'll be running a light recoiling rig, spotting shots at 100 is a breeze with the 10x.


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[jadkins223]

I have multiples of both.

FOV and eye box of 6x are truly as good as it gets. Was pounding rocks out to 518 yds this past week with zero need for more mag, spotting my own shots with eaas.

The 10s are more finicky in terms of eye box but still better than average. They become a better tool past 400 yds or so to my eyes.

Seems to be a relatively universal train of thought that if bulk of your shots are 0-400, get the 6x...majority are longer, get the 10. That is my sentiment as well.

One thing to note is that if I was planning on doing minimal to no still hunting, the 10x would be my choice as I find the reticle subtensions easier to see and even if a short shot presented itself, if you've practiced shouldering your rifle with speed it really isn't much of a hindrance at all. Assuming you'll be running a light recoiling rig, spotting shots at 100 is a breeze with the 10x.


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Definitely makes me wanna hold out for the 6x. 450-500 is my max 1800 fps with my setup anyway


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[ianpadron]

Definitely makes me wanna hold out for the 6x. 450-500 is my max 1800 fps with my setup anyway


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I've scooped 2 in the past month for below new price. Keep an eye on here, EBay, and Snipers Hide. If 500 is your max the 6x is absolutely the better tool.

 

[roosiebull]

Has anyone here tried to nose ring a 77gr smk and shoot an animal with it? Seems like it would upset more consistently?

Just curious since there are so many cheap/accurate options with the 77gr smk, is it as simple as buying a nose ring tool and getting good and consistent performance on critters?

 

[jadkins223]

I've scooped 2 in the past month for below new price. Keep an eye on here, EBay, and Snipers Hide. If 500 is your max the 6x is absolutely the better tool.

Okay I’ll keep an eye out man. Do you mind me asking what you paid ?


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[ianpadron]

Okay I’ll keep an eye out man. Do you mind me asking what you paid ?


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$265 and $280 shipped

 

[swavescatter]

Has anyone here tried to nose ring a 77gr smk and shoot an animal with it? Seems like it would upset more consistently?

Just curious since there are so many cheap/accurate options with the 77gr smk, is it as simple as buying a nose ring tool and getting good and consistent performance on critters?

I asked this about Berger 156's, and Form (I believe) responded that the nose ring approach is a red herring, and not likely the reason DTACs can be effective (they tumble). They seemed to be studying the nose ring approach and weren't convinced it actually helped bullets open up on impact like advertised. I'm guessing the TMK's are still the best option.

Maybe they'll correct me.

@Formidilosus @Ryan Avery

 

[roosiebull]

I asked this about Berger 156's, and Form (I believe) responded that the nose ring approach is a red herring, and not likely the reason DTACs can be effective (they tumble). They seemed to be studying the nose ring approach and weren't convinced it actually helped bullets open up on impact like advertised. I'm guessing the TMK's are still the best option.

Maybe they'll correct me.

@Formidilosus @Ryan Avery

Thanks, I figured if it was something that was a good option, it would be in practice, I was just curious, mainly because the nose ringed dtac being a thing and smk’s not reliably upsetting

 

[Formidilosus]

Has anyone here tried to nose ring a 77gr smk and shoot an animal with it? Seems like it would upset more consistently?

Just curious since there are so many cheap/accurate options with the 77gr smk, is it as simple as buying a nose ring tool and getting good and consistent performance on critters?

I asked this about Berger 156's, and Form (I believe) responded that the nose ring approach is a red herring, and not likely the reason DTACs can be effective (they tumble). They seemed to be studying the nose ring approach and weren't convinced it actually helped bullets open up on impact like advertised. I'm guessing the TMK's are still the best option.

Maybe they'll correct me.

@Formidilosus @Ryan Avery

So Nose Ringing does seem to help OTM’s or pointed OTM’s like some SMK’s upset earlier or more reliably. @eoperator has seen some indications in gel that NR Bergers have a shorter neck length than standard, but they also upset better in the beginning than SMK’s. A NR 77gr SMK would probably be fine, but will be more variable than a tipped bullet by far. The Nose Ring tool is also expensive. Between the 77gr SMK even with a NR, and the 73gr ELD-M- the 73gr ELD-M is a way easier, more available option.

In general unless there is a compelling reason to NR a bullet (6mm heavy projectile for instance), plastic tipped bullets are a better, more reliable option.

 

[roosiebull]

So Nose Ringing does seem to help OTM’s or pointed OTM’s like some SMK’s upset earlier or more reliably. @eoperator has seen some indications in gel that NR Bergers have a shorter neck length than standard, but they also upset better in the beginning than SMK’s. A NR 77gr SMK would probably be fine, but will be more variable than a tipped bullet by far. The Nose Ring tool is also expensive. Between the 77gr SMK even with a NR, and the 73gr ELD-M- the 73gr ELD-M is a way easier, more available option.

In general unless there is a compelling reason to NR a bullet (6mm heavy projectile for instance), plastic tipped bullets are a better, more reliable option.

Excellent, thanks for the reply

 

[waterengineer]

Thanks to everyone that has contributed evidence and knowledge to this great thread! I found it and read the whole thing in January 2023. I just finished reading it for a second time.

It saved my dad’s whitetail hunting season this year. He had eye surgery and the doctor said he couldn’t shoot his typical rifle due to recoil. He asked about the .223 and the doctor was okay with the lower recoil. He ended up killing 2 deer with 77 gr TMK’s and another with 62 gr Fusion. I don’t think he would have tried it without me insisting it would work based on the evidence shown here.

 

[swavescatter]

I have two Oryx tags next week. Private land guided so almost guaranteed within 200 yds...

Still nervous to try 223 for some reason. Might just go with the mighty 6.5 creed...

 

[atmat]

I have two Oryx tags next week. Private land guided so almost guaranteed within 200 yds...

Still nervous to try 223 for some reason. Might just go with the mighty 6.5 creed...

Just shoot the 223

 

[wind gypsy]

The D-18 has more than threading and a bolt handle.

The cart price for the blued .223 is $699 from Eurooptic. Less $75 rebate you're looking at $624.

D-18 add-ons:
$150 to thread (estimated)
$70 oversized bolt handle (DIY estimate at $50 plus tax and shipping)
$100 to flute
$150 muzzle brake
$125 cerakote
$595

$624+$595= $1,219

So $874 for the D-18 after rebate is a damn good deal to most I think. The .243 is 1:8 twist as well.

EDIT: also comes with a fluted bolt, so probably another $100 or so in savings over the standard blued model on sale at Europtic.

No denying its a good deal and for someone who wants a 24" threaded barrel it's a great setup, especially having 5/8 threads. 24" is pretty long for suppressed though and then you're dealing with the fluting if you want to cut it shorter. Fluting, the bolt knob (compared to an $8 tourbon), a radial brake (would replace with side discharge if using a brake), fluted bolt (no benefit), cerakote, combined are less valuable to me than just having stainless. (I assume the bass pro models aren't ss?).

 

[sveltri]

No denying its a good deal and for someone who wants a 24" threaded barrel it's a great setup, especially having 5/8 threads. 24" is pretty long for suppressed though and then you're dealing with the fluting if you want to cut it shorter. Fluting, the bolt knob (compared to an $8 tourbon), a radial brake (would replace with side discharge if using a brake), fluted bolt (no benefit), cerakote, combined are less valuable to me than just having stainless. (I assume the bass pro models aren't ss?).

They are SS

 

[JJ3]

Long time lurker...time to add a data point.

First off I have followed the thread since the fist few posts and have read it in entirety a couple times over the last couple years. I update the thread daily during hunting season also.

I typically hunt ridge areas and fields in NWGA. Shots range from 10-400yds. I prefer to carry my 10.5" 300 Blackout suppressed SBR, 1-4 scope, with Barnes Tac-Tx as it is easy to carry, does not require ear pro and has never let me down. It has also has yet to require a tracking job more than 30yds. I am comfortable with a 250yd shot with this setup.

I am a AR15 hobbyist. I like the ergos, Im comfortable with one and I shoot them often from 10-300yds in various positions at my local rifle club. For all the reasons pointed out in this thread I gravitate towards 223/556 but I still hunt with my 300BO.

The new area I am hunting this year is so thick plus leaves have been late to fall that my Vortex 1-4 just isnt doing it.....I missed a couple doe opportunities recently. I did not have time to swap optics so I took my 10.5" red dot equipped 556 house gun with 73ELDs out on Christmas eve morning to get those does I missed the previous outing.

Well less than an hour in the 180lb +/- 7point we call Loki that Ive been watching on camera for 6 months comes in to about 40yds stopping in one of the very, very few shooting lanes available in this spot. In the 10sec transaction he took a 73 ELD in center of chest, turned with tail down and slowly trotted off. I felt like it was a good hit and thought I heard him crash down the North (steep) side hill out of sight. I waited an hour to get down.....alone with my thoughts.

Once I got down to find him I found ZERO blood or hair.....nothing. I was sick. Looked for 1.5hrs before calling in the dog and help. Dog found him in 5min, buried in a ravine head down 30yd from where he was hit. We drug him an hour out of the ridges to where a vehicle could access for the remaining haul.

We do gutless processing, were wore out and were in a hurry to say the least so no necropsy pics. Opening him up he was full of blood, I assume the heart was destroyed and pumping it into the chest cavity.

Soooo.....It work and worked well at killing a mature buck. Maybe better than my beloved barnes 110s. It did not leave any blood to track and in this area thats a problem without a good dog. I will try the 77TMK before our season is over