Wyoming What Are You Doing?

CMP70306

WKR
Joined
Mar 3, 2023
Messages
483
So this came across my email, can y’all talk some sense into your legislators that bringing shot ethics into game management decisions is not really a road we want to go down.

 
Why not ?
Lots of bozos are out there that have no clue how to shoot a rifle at 600-700
Much less 250-300 yards
I think there should be a shooting competency test requirement along with a hunter safety certificate, before you can apply for a license or buy one .
Nothing wrong with required certification
 
If harvest is exceeding what they want then eventually something has to give. We are constantly getting better at killing animals, especially at long range, the animals aren’t getting better at getting away from us
 
Why not ?
Lots of bozos are out there that have no clue how to shoot a rifle at 600-700
Much less 250-300 yards
I think there should be a shooting competency test requirement along with a hunter safety certificate, before you can apply for a license or buy one .
Nothing wrong with required certification
We have an urban archery hunt here with a one evening class and simple proficiency test. The applicants must load an arrow on bow and shoot 3 arrows in to a 8-10 inch circle at 15 yards indoors. One or two fail every year.
 
We have an urban archery hunt here with a one evening class and simple proficiency test. The applicants must load an arrow on bow and shoot 3 arrows in to a 8-10 inch circle at 15 yards indoors. One or two fail every year.
When I did my concealed carry license, the shooting part was 5 yards
And in my class of 10 , 3 failed ! Hard to miss at 15 feet
Instructor let me shoot and dismissed me to help those who failed

I will bet that over 1/2 the people who say they killed their game @ over 500
Are just plain old liars and braggarts trying to impress us on here .
 
Why not ?
Lots of bozos are out there that have no clue how to shoot a rifle at 600-700
Much less 250-300 yards
I think there should be a shooting competency test requirement along with a hunter safety certificate, before you can apply for a license or buy one .
Nothing wrong with required certification


I feel that way about the archery guys. Seems to be damn near a badge of honor when they loose one. Just make sure you take a pic of the notched tag.........
 
Why not ?
Lots of bozos are out there that have no clue how to shoot a rifle at 600-700
Much less 250-300 yards
I think there should be a shooting competency test requirement along with a hunter safety certificate, before you can apply for a license or buy one .
Nothing wrong with required certification
The issue becomes how strict is this test and how do you prevent it from being weaponized against hunters in the future?
 
Shooting competency doesn’t appear to have much relevance to the legislators. The 2 stories that prompted the discussion were successful kills at 800 and 1900 yards.
 
I am 100% for a cert test. I require anyone that hunts my place shoot a full mag from the rifle they hunt with at 100 yrds with 100% hit rate on clay pigeons. If you can’t go 4 for4 on a 4” target you can’t shoot which means you can’t hunt.

I would prefer the test be much more stringent to remove the Fudds that generate much of the bad press. I would even be fine with a system that allows you to shoot to to a stated distance (add in an error assumption). Trouble is enforcing it. It would keep honest people honest but scoundrels will always exist and won’t be able to pass on the buck of a lifetime at 400 when they couldn’t qualify at 200.
 
I require anyone that hunts my place shoot a full mag from the rifle they hunt with at 100 yrds with 100% hit rate on clay pigeons. If you can’t go 4 for4 on a 4” target you can’t shoot which means you can’t hunt.

You would be suprised the amount of people that cant do this for one reason or another. First starting with bad scopes. You should go to the local range and see how many people can do this.
 
I am 100% for a cert test. I require anyone that hunts my place shoot a full mag from the rifle they hunt with at 100 yrds with 100% hit rate on clay pigeons. If you can’t go 4 for4 on a 4” target you can’t shoot which means you can’t hunt.

I would prefer the test be much more stringent to remove the Fudds that generate much of the bad press. I would even be fine with a system that allows you to shoot to to a stated distance (add in an error assumption). Trouble is enforcing it. It would keep honest people honest but scoundrels will always exist and won’t be able to pass on the buck of a lifetime at 400 when they couldn’t qualify at 200.

So then how’s that target shot? Off a bench? No benches in the woods would be the argument so then you have to shoot sitting or offhand. How about different guns, a precision rifle is way more capable than a muzzleloader or handgun so should you have separate tests and get a weapon specific certification? Should western guys have smaller targets than the guys in the east shooting less than 100 yards?

How about birds, they are game animals too. Should a passing score on a sporting clays course be required to hunt upland or waterfowl? How about turkeys and squirrels, plenty of guys miss turkeys with a shotgun and squirrels are a small target for a .22.

Would these tests be a one time thing? We see how well that goes with driving and people hunt well into their senior years so it should probably be done several times just to make sure you can still do it. How often is enough? Once a decade? Once every 4 or 5 years like a drivers license? Once a year to really weed people out?

You see where I’m going, what starts as “we need a shooting test to get rid of the fudds” turns into new hunters looking at a mountain of qualifications for something they don’t even know if they want to do while those enjoy it need to keep up a rotating list of certifications that cost time and money to obtain make all but the most dedicated drop out of the sport entirely.
 
My place my rules. Are you questioning if you would qualify? The requirements of a general shooting proficiency test would not be difficult to determine.

I believe the test should be yearly. I also believe people should have to requalify for a drivers license every other year as well as be approved to pull any type of a trailer. There are far too many morons on the road that are on bald tires, 3 lug nuts and a steering knuckle held on by a nail with no experience or knowledge of how to operate a vehicle or trailer properly. I am at a point I won’t lend my friends trailers anymore as they always come back damaged. Guns are the same. Hunting should be as well. If we reduced the number of ill equipped poorly prepared people by requiring only those that are “qualified/ trained” to operate the equipment then we would all benefit. Based on your points above, we should allow anyone to fly a commercial jet or a semi just so we are fare. I am not interested in fare. I am interested in improving hunting and shooting sports on the whole. If the qualification for entry eliminate those in the gene pool that can’t provide or won’t put in the time to learn, then I am fine with them sitting out. Survival of the fittest. Let’s raise the IQ of the gene pool, not lower it.
 
I also believe people should have to requalify for a drivers license every other year as well as be approved to pull any type of a trailer. There are far too many morons on the road that are on bald tires, 3 lug nuts and a steering knuckle held on by a nail with no experience or knowledge of how to operate a vehicle or trailer properly. I am at a point I won’t lend my friends trailers anymore as they always come back damaged.
Yes, please.

NV has an endorsement (with written and driving test) for towing trailers over 10k GVWR. Tag it on to a Class C and you don't need a CDL for many tasks.

Moved to NM, and MVD is like ... whatever.
 
My place my rules. Are you questioning if you would qualify? The requirements of a general shooting proficiency test would not be difficult to determine.

I believe the test should be yearly. I also believe people should have to requalify for a drivers license every other year as well as be approved to pull any type of a trailer. There are far too many morons on the road that are on bald tires, 3 lug nuts and a steering knuckle held on by a nail with no experience or knowledge of how to operate a vehicle or trailer properly. I am at a point I won’t lend my friends trailers anymore as they always come back damaged. Guns are the same. Hunting should be as well. If we reduced the number of ill equipped poorly prepared people by requiring only those that are “qualified/ trained” to operate the equipment then we would all benefit. Based on your points above, we should allow anyone to fly a commercial jet or a semi just so we are fare. I am not interested in fare. I am interested in improving hunting and shooting sports on the whole. If the qualification for entry eliminate those in the gene pool that can’t provide or won’t put in the time to learn, then I am fine with them sitting out. Survival of the fittest. Let’s raise the IQ of the gene pool, not lower it.
That’s great that YOU choose to do that on YOUR property but keep the dam government out of our lives.

They are already in it too much.

Anyone that wants more government control over their lives is just dumb. M
 
Why not ?
Lots of bozos are out there that have no clue how to shoot a rifle at 600-700
Much less 250-300 yards
I think there should be a shooting competency test requirement along with a hunter safety certificate, before you can apply for a license or buy one .
Nothing wrong with required certification
Agreed. Every base I hunted on had this for archery. Quantico you had to hit a paper plate at 30th a if I remember correctly. I’m a huge proponent of hunter competency testing. Especially in today’s world of social media bragging
 
That’s great that YOU choose to do that on YOUR property but keep the dam government out of our lives.

They are already in it too much.

Anyone that wants more government control over their lives is just dumb. M
Never said I want more. I want better. I expect a greater ROI on my tax dollars than I currently receive. If the rules and regs are written properly it will aid in removing those that don’t belong.
 
My place my rules. Are you questioning if you would qualify? The requirements of a general shooting proficiency test would not be difficult to determine.

I believe the test should be yearly. I also believe people should have to requalify for a drivers license every other year as well as be approved to pull any type of a trailer. There are far too many morons on the road that are on bald tires, 3 lug nuts and a steering knuckle held on by a nail with no experience or knowledge of how to operate a vehicle or trailer properly. I am at a point I won’t lend my friends trailers anymore as they always come back damaged. Guns are the same. Hunting should be as well. If we reduced the number of ill equipped poorly prepared people by requiring only those that are “qualified/ trained” to operate the equipment then we would all benefit. Based on your points above, we should allow anyone to fly a commercial jet or a semi just so we are fare. I am not interested in fare. I am interested in improving hunting and shooting sports on the whole. If the qualification for entry eliminate those in the gene pool that can’t provide or won’t put in the time to learn, then I am fine with them sitting out. Survival of the fittest. Let’s raise the IQ of the gene pool, not lower it.

Depends on the circumstances, clay pigeons at 100 yards standing offhand I give myself 50/50 on if I would pass. Any type of support even standing leaning off a tree and I’m 90% confident, something more solid like prone or a tripod and I’d give myself just shy of 100% confidence.

You are welcome to set such rules on your property, we have rules of our own that we enforce on ours. However setting restrictive barriers that require time, effort and money to overcome could have far more negative consequences than it does positive ones. And since hunting rules are state based you would end up with 50 different sets of rules and requirements for such a test some of which may not be compatible with other states.

Per your examples hunting =/= driving, commercial pilots or semi truck drivers. For many driving is a requirement for their way of life while commercial pilots and truck drivers are being paid to do so. What that means is you can put additional training restrictions on them and still maintain a significant pool of qualified applicants due to their interest in maintaining their way of life.

Hunting however is a hobby that is not only voluntary but in many cases already requires a significant time and monetary investment to get started and maintain. As a result the more restrictions you put in place the more hunters you carve out and while it would eliminate some bad ones it could also eliminate a large number of otherwise good ones.

For example PA has a percentage of hunters that socially hunt once a year for the opening day or two of rifle deer season and have been doing so for years if not decades. They aren’t serious hunters, rarely shoot deer but every year they buy a license and head to camp to spend time with their buddies hunting. Requiring them to drive to a range and spend several hours waiting to take a qualifying test with dozens of others would cause a number of them to drop out as to them it isn’t worth the hassle. Add in multiple qualifiers for different equipment such as archery, muzzleloader and shotgun and now you’ve turned getting your yearly qualification into an all day or multi day event which could turn away a greater number of people.

Sure you could argue that they weren’t that into it and we would be better off with less hunters crowding public lands but that sharp drop in hunter numbers could cause an unintended rippling effect among people that don’t hunt. The two main things I can think of would be the shrinking voter base and the reduced overall visibility of hunters as a group.

For hunter visibility it breaks down to how non hunters perceive hunters. With hunting rarely making it into the public eye, and the media choosing to highlight a handful of negative cases over the multitude of positive ones, public perception could be skewed against hunters if the general public doesn’t have someone they know as a counter to the negative. I can think of several people who would otherwise be anti hunting that are fine with it directly because a well regarded family member was a hunter. Heck my own marriage exists because my wife’s grandfather hunted, if it wasn’t for him my mother in law and by extension my wife would most likely have both been anti hunters.

The other issue is the reduced voting base, while we may not all agree, the 15 to 17 million hunters are still a significant portion of voters and as a result politicians aren’t outright going to vote against them for fear of reprisal. Take again for example PA, some politicians last year tried to get their hands on $150 Million from our Game commissions funds which would have significantly curtailed their management goals as well as strip PA of its P&R funding to the tune of $41 million per year. The only reason they didn’t is because hunters were a large enough base that they didn’t want to risk the backlash.

Additionally what happens when anti hunting groups get control of the state agencies like in Colorado? You basically just handed them a blueprint to get rid of even more hunters by increasing the difficulty or inconvenience of the qualifications to the point most people just give up.
 
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