Wyoming special draw increase ...

[drra]

I have been buying preference points so I will hopefully draw a tag the year I retire. It will likely be a once in a lifetime hunt for me so I'm not concerned if it costs more to go. I would be really disappointed if they passed a law that said nonresidents must hire a guide to go on an Elk hunt in Wyoming.

 

[BRTreedogs]

In one year of having a nonresident special elk tag, with 3 preference points leading up to it, a guy has contributed significantly more to elk management in Wyoming than a resident would in 10 years of buying the same license. That’s the real disparity. Simply living in a state doesn’t make your dime somehow trump their dollar.

No one but sportsmen and PR are paying for wildlife management in Wyoming, yet nonresidents are paying ridiculously more yet continuing to get the shaft. It’s unsustainable. 60% of the WGFD budget comes from license sales. Non residents contributed over 25 million of that last year, residents contributed 8.

Through license sales alone, non residents contributed almost half of the budget, for 15% of the tags. It’s almost unbelievable how much nonresidents pay to keep elk on the mountains so residents can then bitch about them every fall.


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I had a fat finger in that post, I am a non resident in Wyoming
I support the price increase because id rather have a tag then sit on my ass without tag.

What I'm saying is apply in the regular, make more money, move or don't participate.

Only way to get them to give out free elk tags is for no one to participate until they are so over objective they beg us to reduce the population.

 

[Overdrive]

I must of missed the part in the article where it said the WYOGF is forcing every NR to use the special draw when applying. The choice is yours always has been.

 

[fatlander]

I had a fat finger in that post, I am a non resident in Wyoming
I support the price increase because id rather have a tag then sit on my ass without tag.

What I'm saying is apply in the regular, make more money, move or don't participate.

Only way to get them to give out free elk tags is for no one to participate until they are so over objective they beg us to reduce the population.

The point I’m making is how can anyone look at a government organization with an annual budget 85 million dollars, half of which is paid for by non residents who get 15% of the tags, and be ok with them asking for more? They cut big 5 allocations and now they’re jockeying at increasing prices.

Why in the hell can’t they get more elk on the mountain (tags in pockets) with 85 million dollars per year? They haven’t increased tags numbers anytime in the recent past, how is a giving them more money to mismanage going to get more tags in pockets?


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[BRTreedogs]

The point I’m making is how can anyone look at a government organization with an annual budget 85 million dollars, half of which is paid for by non residents who get 15% of the tags, and be ok with them asking for more? They cut big 5 allocations and now they’re jockeying at increasing prices.

Why in the hell can’t they get more elk on the mountain (tags in pockets) with 85 million dollars per year? They haven’t increased tags numbers anytime in the recent past, how is a giving them more money to mismanage going to get more tags in pockets?


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Regardless of money or management. I doubt residents will ever allow an increase of NR tags.

All more money is doing in lining more pockets.
All an increase MAY do is increase odds in the draw for people willing to pay for it.

 

[Z Barebow]

$700 year is only $59 a month.

Less than a penny for each swimmer!

I am trying to add a little leavity!

I have been playing the points game a long time. Do I like proposed price increase? No. Do I anticipate change? Yes. The tag landscape is always changing.

Is it outfitter welfare? Depends.

Is it an outfitter carve out? (Like previous proposal) No. Will NR’s who use outfitters be more likely to apply? Probably. But it still is an opportunity for DIY NR who is adequately motivated.

Keep in mind this is just a proposal. If it does pass, I suspect the final fee will land somewhere in between proposal and and current fee.

 

[wytx]

The point I’m making is how can anyone look at a government organization with an annual budget 85 million dollars, half of which is paid for by non residents who get 15% of the tags, and be ok with them asking for more? They cut big 5 allocations and now they’re jockeying at increasing prices.

Why in the hell can’t they get more elk on the mountain (tags in pockets) with 85 million dollars per year? They haven’t increased tags numbers anytime in the recent past, how is a giving them more money to mismanage going to get more tags in pockets?


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You really have no clue do you? We have too many elk, they don't want more elk on the mountain, they want more taken.
The NR elk quota was also just recently changed and the cap of 7250 was removed.
Did you comment on these proposals to the WTF or the commission ?
I can get 3 elk tags a year, you could too in Wyoming of you look closely and had the access.

 

[fatlander]

All more money is doing in lining more pockets.

And their in lies the real problem. That’s why it’s ultimately unsustainable. It was never designed to be that way. We the people are too busy arguing resident vs nonresident, bow vs rifle, opportunity vs trophy. . . All the while opportunity is dwindling and pockets are getting lined.


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[wytx]

The fee increase is in the hands of the committee for the legislature, not the commission or WTF.

 

[BRTreedogs]

And their in lies the real problem. That’s why it’s ultimately unsustainable. It was never designed to be that way. We the people are too busy arguing resident vs nonresident, bow vs rifle, opportunity vs trophy. . . All the while opportunity is dwindling and pockets are getting lined.


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Opertunity is actually static, Wy has a will issue that hasn't been reduced.

It may decrease for those without the budget.

 

[Rob5589]

You really have no clue do you? We have too many elk, they don't want more elk on the mountain, they want more taken.
The NR elk quota was also just recently changed and the cap of 7250 was removed.
Did you comment on these proposals to the WTF or the commission ?
I can get 3 elk tags a year, you could too in Wyoming of you look closely and had the access.

Genuinely curious; how does WY have too many elk? Not enough landscape to hold/feed them?

 

[BRTreedogs]

Genuinely curious; how does WY have too many elk? Not enough landscape to hold/feed them?

I've seen in other threads members reference the decline of Mule deer to being out competed by elk.

 

[Z Barebow]

The fee increase is in the hands of the committee for the legislature, not the commission or WTF.

Good point. Yesterday's meeting was a Legislative/Advisory Committee. (Although the proposal was a recommendation of WTF to this committee, I believe)

Long way to go before anything is etched in stone folks. Who knows? It could be $2762.89 before this is done! (It is fun throwing out numbers. It is comparable to picking a new minimum wage. Just a number arbitrarily picked with no basis on justification)

 

[fatlander]

You really have no clue do you? We have too many elk, they don't want more elk on the mountain, they want more taken.
The NR elk quota was also just recently changed and the cap of 7250 was removed.
Did you comment on these proposals to the WTF or the commission ?
I can get 3 elk tags a year, you could too in Wyoming of you look closely and had the access.

Frankly, I couldn’t care less about elk (or any wild game) getting in the pockets of private landowners with posted signs on every fence post. What other public owned natural resource can rich landowners so easily cry woe is me and wage war on?

With 85 million a year, there should habitat improvement work that allows for the healthy expansion of elk (all game) populations.

The legislature has no problem increasing fees, why not increase codified tags?


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[wingmaster]

This will probably price most hunters out of the special draw. I've never entered the special draw but at least it used to be an option for me, it won't be an option at all with those price hikes. Good news for high-earners, your chance of drawing a premium WY tag every year will be pretty good.

 

[bsnedeker]

Hey man, I appreciate it. I'm officially pulling out of the points game in WY. They clearly are targetting their product to the wealthy NR pool. I hope they make a lot of money doing this...they just won't be getting any more from me.

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[BRTreedogs]

This will probably price most hunters out of the special draw. I've never entered the special draw but at least it used to be an option for me, it won't be an option at all with those price hikes. Good news for high-earners, your chance of drawing a premium WY tag every year will be pretty good.

Haha, I'm just a blue collar hourly dirt bag.
I just choose to only elk hunt with my life.
Everything is centered around elk hunting.

I own nothing else and do nothing else with my time, money etc.
No boats, no drinking, no vacations. Travel for work and sleep inside my subaru. I'm in a sleeping bag like 300 days a year to make elk hunting happen.
If I have to get a 2nd job so be it.

 

[wytx]

Frankly, I couldn’t care less about elk (or any wild game) getting in the pockets of private landowners with posted signs on every fence post. What other public owned natural resource can rich landowners so easily cry woe is me and wage war on?

With 85 million a year, there should habitat improvement work that allows for the healthy expansion of elk (all game) populations.

The legislature has no problem increasing fees, why not increase codified tags?


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What private landowners did I mention? The quota in NR elk tags was removed, humm isn't that actually increasing NR opportunity?
We don't need expansion of elk at all, they are doing fine. Mule deer on the other hand are in desperate straights right now in parts if the state.
How would 85 million combat drought ? We're all ears on that please.

 

[TreeWalking]

Don't think this would be the right approach though. Simple numbers game, less tags in special pool means less have to apply for the odds to be worse currently. A price hike like this would certainly weed out some, but the trade off would be regular draw odds could also get significantly worse.

I am certainly not opposed to paying to hunt in a state which I don't reside, but the article makes it seem like a pure greed play.

There was no need to introduce classism into a draw for public hunts though here we are in Wyoming creating the equivalent of an airport lounge for VIPs only. Set the price for tags so there is only one bucket at that one price and tag sale revenues create a net change of $0 vs. revenues from the classism two-tier system.

Here is my question for anyone going, gee, is sort of okay to have two tiers: Will you support a two-tier pricing system for sheep, moose, bison and goat where the price for the lower-price pool is the current price and the VIP queue for the higher-priced tags is in the same ratio as the proposed elk pricing ratio between their two tiers?

If this is really about increasing revenues then why not put every non-resident tag on eBay with the minimum bid set at the current non-resident lower-tier price? Heck, put up a 3-pack of sheep tags where can bid on hunting sheep in the breaks year-round for 3 consecutive years.

The opportunities are endless though something seems at odds with the North American model when the focus is getting the most money rather than providing the most opportunity for hunters no matter how fat their wallet is in a given year. I would also propose in about Year 3 that all Resident tags go up on eBay as well but have to be a resident to buy. Let Landowners bid up on eBay for their pool of tags. Same if outfitters carve off some tags. Another idea, auction off Wilderness Exemptions for non-residents so they can not only walk around the wilderness fishing and bird watching and taking pictures but also can when have a hunting tag.

If the price increases go forward yet are not effective until 2024 then point creep is going up like Trump's blood pressure on a court stand and odds are going down like the size of a bag of $100 worth of groceries.

Let them eat cake.

 

[Scooter90254]

We all know there is an all-out war on Non Resident elk hunters. Something is going to be done in every state to significantly reduce our numbers over the next few years.

In an idea world it would be by the luck of the draw not your financial situation.