Why you should not take equity out or dump your 401 K to take super expensive hunts.

[roadrunner]

How so?

To get any worth out if it, you're in it for the long haul of 35 to 40 years working for someone else.

There are other ways to prepare for retirement (aka financial independence), but "they" won't tell you about it. And, it doesn't take 3-1/2 to 4 decades to do it...

 

[sasquatch]

Many hardcore YOLO type people that piss money away on keeping up with the joneses, become liberals when they 65 and can’t retire

All of a sudden they want what the rich savers have that gave up the toys early on.

Funny how that happens


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[roadrunner]

I actually had the burn some of the few brain cells I have to figure out what "YOLO" meant

 

[Cactus kid]

Good ol Dave Ramsey says it best: money is 20% numbers and 80% behavior.

Dave Ramsey:
Bankruptcies: 1
Wild sheep: 0

Me:
Bankruptcies: 0
Wild sheep: 2

Follow me for more financial advice.

 

[buckpro]

Dave Ramsey:
Bankruptcies: 1
Wild sheep: 0

Me:
Bankruptcies: 0
Wild sheep: 2

Follow me for more financial advice.

Best post in this thread

 

[180ls1]

To get any worth out if it, you're in it for the long haul of 35 to 40 years

This is incorrect, short term benefits include:
- growth of $$$
- tax reduction
- employer match, not guaranteed
- asset protection
-other benefits

working for someone else.

This is also incorrect. Self employed can have a 401K.

There are other ways to prepare for retirement (aka financial independence), but "they" won't tell you about it. And, it doesn't take 3-1/2 to 4 decades to do it...

This is true but they almost all involve more effort/risk.



When you consider real estate and company sponsored retirement plans have made more millionaires than anything else, it's really worth considering.

 

[TheGrayRider]

Surprised that no one has yet discussed taking out a reverse mortgage on your personal home to fund bighorn sheep hunts.

Great plan for some older hunters? Never have to pay back the loan, tax free money, use the money however you want, live in the house forever, descendants keep taxidermy forever, and loan gets paid back at death.

Talk to your mortgage broker and your financial advisor.

 

[LostWapiti]

How so?

Wondering this as well. Having money in your 401k doesn’t make you work. You can still retire early without touching your 401k so long as you still have assets and or money outside your 401k to live on until 59.5.

 

[sasquatch]

Dave Ramsey:
Bankruptcies: 1
Wild sheep: 0

Me:
Bankruptcies: 0
Wild sheep: 2

Follow me for more financial advice.

This is awesome haha


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[sasquatch]

Surprised that no one has yet discussed taking out a reverse mortgage on your personal home to fund bighorn sheep hunts.

Great plan for some older hunters? Never have to pay back the loan, tax free money, use the money however you want, live in the house forever, descendants keep taxidermy forever, and loan gets paid back at death.

Talk to your mortgage broker and your financial advisor.

Reverse mortgage gives you monthly payments

Not lump sum, therefore won’t pay for the hunt unless you came out of pocket somehow

Pretty sure anyway.


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[roadrunner]

This is incorrect, short term benefits include:
- growth of $$$
- tax reduction
- employer match, not guaranteed
- asset protection
-other benefits



This is also incorrect. Self employed can have a 401K.



This is true but they almost all involve more effort/risk.



When you consider real estate and company sponsored retirement plans have made more millionaires than anything else, it's really worth considering.

Wow. You just really went in head first without checking how deep the water is didn't you...

You said "incorrect" twice without even knowing what you were saying incorrect to. You assumed, and you assumed wrong.

You can't get full benefit until your 59-1/2 years old, aka the "long haul", like I said. Everything you listed isn't the "benefit" you think it is. That's just what they tell you to invest.

Most people work for someone else investing in their 401k plan, not their own, aka "working for someone else".

Expand your financial education by learning more about "passive income" and the tax benefits it has. You're welcome.

 

[roadrunner]

Dave Ramsey:
Bankruptcies: 1
Wild sheep: 0

Me:
Bankruptcies: 0
Wild sheep: 2

Follow me for more financial advice.

But if Ramsey were a sheep hunter, how many more sheep hunts could he go on next year than you?

I disagree with most of what Ramsey says, he tends to keep people performing in the same economic class their entire life...

 

[TN2shot07]

I disagree with most of what Ramsey says, he tends to keep people performing in the same economic class their entire life...
[/QUOTE]

But how much better is that than the average American’s financial picture?

 

[180ls1]

Wow. You just really went in head first without checking how deep the water is didn't you...

You said "incorrect" twice without even knowing what you were saying incorrect to. You assumed, and you assumed wrong.

Take it easy. I just responded to factual inaccuracies within your statements.

You can't get full benefit until your 59-1/2 years old, aka the "long haul", like I said. Everything you listed isn't the "benefit" you think it is. That's just what they tell you to invest.

You never said that, you said "any worth."

Most people work for someone else investing in their 401k plan, not their own, aka "working for someone else".

Yes, you are correct most have employers. However, you are incorrect that you have to work for someone else to have a 401k.

Expand your financial education by learning more about "passive income" and the tax benefits it has. You're welcome.

I know more than you, as displayed here.

 

[2531usmc]

You know, we oftentimes wonder about how & why other people spend money for hunting trips. I met an old codger on a Quebec caribou hunt. He was a retired judge living in Florida and rediscovered his love for hunting much later in life. I kept in touch with him for many years after the caribou hunt.

He went on four back to back African safaris in his early to mid 70s. Started out with two plaines game hunts and ended up with two Cape buffalo hunts. He said he did it all on credit figuring he would be dead and would not have to pay much of it back.

Not saying right or wrong, but like I said sometimes you just gottta wonder

 

[HuntHarder]

Sure. So I'm 35, I take $20k (of my money), pay the tax penalty (last I looked into it was 10%, definitely not the 50% previously posted) and burn it on a trip. Let's call it $25k. I owe about 200k on a house that is currently valued near 600k. My 401k took a bigger hit thanks to Crooked Joe. I still have a job and another thirty (or more) years to work.

Where's the part that I go broke? Who is the everybody else that gets to support me?

Don't look now, but my 401k is in much better shape over the last 3.5 years than it was under Trump. My 3 year return is 19.9%, which equates to some serious Coin. I do agree with the "Crooked Joe" comment, but i am also wise enough to do my own research and not take candidates word as gospel...

 

[schmalzy]

I am not a financial planner, but I have been following these discussions regularly.

A friend of mine is a booking agent, his top end hunts are about $20,000. Mostly he books common European species for reasonable prices. Trophy expectations are reasonable and there is a lot of success. He does not focus on high fenced areas, and has some very interesting species.

He has also hunted all over the world mostly on his own without an outfitter where possible.

He and I were in deer camp together in Hungary this week. We had this discussion, with 3 other hunters in camp and everyone said the same thing. It is a stupid endeavor.

There are other experiences you can have that are just as challenging and cost percentage points of what sheep hunts cost.

New Zelanad on your own or outfitted for Tahr and Chamois.

Europe Chamois, mouflon, capercaillie and black grouse hunts.

Spanish Ibex, Caucasian Tur, Tajikistan Ibex, Krygiz ibex among other options.

the problem with hunts priced in this tier is the same problem as drawing a tag that takes a lifetime to draw. The odds are very good that the hunt will not go the way you want.

On the first day at 0800 am of a very pricy aoudad free range hunt in West Texas I was offered a 32 inch ram, and I turned him down because I wanted to hunt more. 3 days later on the last day of the hunt I shot a 25 inch ram. Only ram we got onto, that wasn't 800 yards away running the other direction.

I had 9 or 10 points for Wyoming antelope and finally drew a good tag. Worst draught in 20 years, my father and uncle insisted on going and my father gave all of us covid. Then I gave it to my wife and kids. Was a rough couple of weeks. I shot a 12 inch buck because my father wanted to go home. He lied to me and told me he wasn't sick. So I picked him up in Cheyenne and then wasted the tag on a dink.

I know lots of people that have been on 2 or 3 sheep hunts for Dallas, and multiple sheep hunts for Stones and bighorns.

Personally know outfitters that have told me they are about 30% on their stone tags in BC. In the old days they would be able to use the same tag on multiple hunters taking them for long walks. Not finding a big enough ram.

Think this couldn't happen to you?

Don't romanticize it. It is a transaction between you and the outfitter.

If you are worth millions of dollars and $300,000 is nothing to you then do it. I don't personally feel as though you could do it for $300,000.

If you are not worth millions of dollars and blowing $300,000 resets your financial clock to zero for some heads on the walls and a couple weeks worth of memories think twice about it.

We aren't talking about 2024 prices. We are talking about 2028 prices if you are booking today.

Currently Mexican deserts are $45,000 to $75,000.
New Mexican deserts on the Amanda's are $75,000
Texas deserts are $95,000 to 120,000
Alberta and BC bighorns and Californias are $45,000-85,000
Dalls are $28,000 in Alaska to $45,000 in the NWT with the select outfitters
Stones are $70,000-120,000

So Dall average $35,000 today and $50,000 in 5 years
Stones average $80,000 today and $120,000 in fiver years
Desert average $55,000 in Mexico and $90,000 in the USA and in 5 years $120,000
Bighorns average $60,000 and in five years $80,000

Booked today if you got todays prices you'd be into $230,000 if you were lucky.
Most likely a $290,000 investment in some dead sheep on the wall no one will care about but you.

However saying that if it doesn't hurt you at all do it.

If you want romance and punishment of a tough trip go to Paris and join the Foreign Legion. You'll last a few months and get kicked out, and know true romance.

FFL current cut off is 39.5, so may not be an option for some.

C’est la vie.


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[180ls1]

Don't look now, but 401k's are in much better shape over the last 3.5 years than they were under Trump. My 3 year return is 19.9%, which equates to some serious Coin. I do agree with the "Crooked Joe" comment, but i am also wise enough to do my own research and not take candidates word as gospel...

This may be useful for a lot of people.

 

[Axlrod]

But if Ramsey were a sheep hunter, how many more sheep hunts could he go on next year than you?

I disagree with most of what Ramsey says, he tends to keep people performing in the same economic class their entire life...

HE keeps them in the same economic class their entire life?
News flash genius, a freaking shit ton of people that never heard of or can spell Dave Ramsey stay in the same economic class their entire life!

 

[RidgeRunner1018]

How so?

I would imagine he's trying to point out that the government, in all its wisdom, regulates traditional 401ks and the age at which you can withdraw from the without penalty, i.e. 'retirement age'. Because most people see this as their only option, they fail to supplement their retirement with bridge accounts such as Roth 401ks/IRAs and brokerage accounts. Both can be withdrawn penalty free, and in the Roth's case, tax free, BEFORE the government's bogus retirement age to bridge those years. Most don't do this, however, and are forced to work until they can withdraw penalty free from their traditional 401k.