What are your thoughts on the Kung Flu?

[MTSasquatch]

Far from anything to worry about.

this didn’t age well

 

[Mike7]

I believe your are being deliberately misleading as, at least here in CA, the notion is to wear masks when social distancing is not possible (e.g. grocery store). I haven't heard any recommendations regarding wearing masks while social distancing. Not sure the point of arguing something that isn't.

That said, what study shows the opposite? To my (limited) knowledge, none exists. Given this is a new disease and given what we know of other diseases, why not wear them in conditions that are deemed to warrant mask usage until we have better information?

Especially in light of evidence that masks have been part of a regiment that has significantly reduced the prevalence of the disease elsewhere?



A number of assumptions here: Lots of low risk people have died from this disease, this isn't as binary as you imply. Moreover, I do not believe we have evidence of seasonality. Answering the question is pointless as neither you or I know enough to even speculate.

Maybe this disease dies down over summer and is controllable in the fall through testing and selectively quarantining the ill and those they have been in contact with, which could result in even fewer deaths?

But if we are going to use speculation as the basis for policy, I'd rather just wear a mask.



Uh, none. What unconstitutional mandates do you suggest?

Nothing in medicine is binary, but from the last stats I looked at, people under 25 years old were dying in greater numbers from the flu than from COVID with a progressive increase in COVID death rates beyond that age. And many more people were still dying of non-flu/non-COVID pneumonia than from either of the other two.

As far as speculation, I think that is kind of my point...most of what we are doing now is being based upon speculation still, along with moving targets and seemingly not very satisfactory reasons of why we are doing many things.

Now that we have a little data on this virus, don't you think that we should have some really good reasons for restricting people's freedoms by the orders of unelected bureaucrats in state health departments who advise the governors and are not required to explain themselves?

This week near where I live, local officials are petitioning the State of WA to have Spokane County and surrounding counties be moved to Phase 2 reopening. Spokane is the medical referral site for most of Eastern WA and parts of Northern Idaho and NE Oregon. The governor is requiring 3 wks of "zero" COVID cases in Spokane County and the surrounding counties before phase 2 opening can occur, followed by testing, tracing contacts, and quarantine for any potential new cases.

I would love for someone to tell me how they are coming by their current restrictions and how long they anticipate that this will go on?... and how they are going to effectively keep a hospital system alive while not taking care of routine medical problems, and how they are going to stamp out COVID just by doing widespread testing, tracing, and then quarantine for an illness that is mutating, has less than perfect testing, and has a large percentage of the population who is asymptomatic during the infection it seems?

Are these goals really achievable?... because there are a lot of economic and health consequences to these restrictions? For example, I had people in the grocery industry and hardware industry tell me this week, that their truckers are now not getting all the supplies that they are requesting, and so that they are now starting to see shortages in their stores...i.e. unfilled restocking orders for vegetables, certain hardware items, etc.

There are probably some reasonable situations for masks, but I wonder from the information presented above if broad mandates and misinformation about their real effectiveness is really helpful. I believe that the local areas of California that I have read about where mask mandates have been ordered under penalty for non-compliance, and regardless of social distancing in some circumstances are in the LA and San Francisco Bay areas. Maybe that is not the intent, but tell that to people who are being fined $5,000-$7,000 per day for violating similar COVID related orders around the country?

 

[Laramie]

Nothing makes sense right now, including the virus. I know several people (ages 20-55) who have tested positive and have a close exposure to 1 person. I may have had it? Each case was different. A couple got pretty sick... Maybe worst of their life sick. Several felt literally nothing. Some in between. Makes no sense. One thing that holds true with all I know. They think the extent of the lockdowns are completely wrong. Living in fear is no way to live.

 

[Fatcamp]

this didn’t age well

LOL. And I am now a full time Covid nurse spending 36 hours a week in a PAPR mask.

 

[*zap*]

I was told that depending on who you caught this thing from might determine the severity of it. If it has been thru more people before you catch it it may mutate more....patient x gives it to 5 people.....those people may not have it to severe. But if one of them gives it to patient y and y gives it to patient g then g gives it to patient w, patient w may wind up with a more severe case......than one of the original 5.

 

[jmez]

If you do some research into masks you'll find little to any evidence that they work, even in surgery. There is zero consensus, other than for a properly fitted respirator (that's not a mask), that they do any good.

What you mostly find us that they are worn because it seems like a good idea and it is expected.

Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk

 

[MattB]

I believe that the local areas of California that I have read about where mask mandates have been ordered under penalty for non-compliance, and regardless of social distancing in some circumstances are in the LA and San Francisco Bay areas.

I don't think that is a real thing. There are mask requirements when going into essential businesses or public transportation and such (or waiting in line outside to enter such). Again, the notion here is that there are instances where it is not possible to socially distance, so masks are being required.

 

[Billinsd]

I don't think that is a real thing. There are mask requirements when going into essential businesses or public transportation and such (or waiting in line outside to enter such). Again, the notion here is that there are instances where it is not possible to socially distance, so masks are being required.

In San Diego, technically it looks like you have to have a mask if you get less than 6 feet from someone. However, read the County Supervisors adage below. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/health/story/2020-05-01/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-countys-new-face-covering-rule?_amp=true
A new COVID-19 public health order that went into effect this morning requires the use of a cloth face covering or mask in all public and business spaces whenever you’re within 6 feet of another person who is not from your household. As encountering a stranger is unpredictable, county supervisors have adopted a new adage: “When you leave your place, cover your face.”

Detailed criteria for the new order or what consequences those who were not in compliance would face were not detailed Friday. But the county has stated anyone not in compliance with the public health order could face up to $1,000 fine or 6 months in jail.

 

[MattB]

Looks like you have to have a mask if you are less than 6 feet from someone. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/health/story/2020-05-01/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-countys-new-face-covering-rule?_amp=true
A new COVID-19 public health order that went into effect this morning requires the use of a cloth face covering or mask in all public and business spaces whenever you’re within 6 feet of another person who is not from your household. As encountering a stranger is unpredictable, county supervisors have adopted a new adage: “When you leave your place, cover your face.”

Detailed criteria for the new order or what consequences those who were not in compliance would face were not detailed Friday. But the county has stated anyone not in compliance with the public health order could face up to $1,000 fine or 6 months in jail.

San Diego is not in LA or the San Francisco Bay Area, and that order doesn't line up with what Mike 7 asserted ("regardless of social distancing" is not equal to "requires the use of a cloth face covering or mask in all public and business spaces whenever you’re within 6 feet of another person who is not from your household.".

 

[Billinsd]

San Diego is not in LA or the San Francisco Bay Area, and that order doesn't line up with what Mike 7 asserted ("regardless of social distancing" is not equal to "requires the use of a cloth face covering or mask in all public and business spaces whenever you’re within 6 feet of another person who is not from your household.".

Right, that's why I started off with "In San Diego". Thank God San Diego is not in LA or SF. We have enough troubles. Right the order in San Diego does not "technically" agree with Mike's assertion of the other two large metropolitan areas LA and SF, which San Diego is not in. However, the county supervisors have adopted a new adage: “When you leave your place, cover your face.” I can understand if people heard that, they could intrept it to be the order. Carry on... Cheers Bill

 

[brettdunn7]

Just gonna drop this here. It will probably get pulled by YouTube but it’s also on Vimeo I think.

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[KurtR]

I heard Copenhagen kills the virus. I quit a few years ago but since the is a pandemic pandemic pandemic ( say stuff three times makes it even scarier) I will take one for the team and go get a log right now.

 

[Mike7]

San Diego is not in LA or the San Francisco Bay Area, and that order doesn't line up with what Mike 7 asserted ("regardless of social distancing" is not equal to "requires the use of a cloth face covering or mask in all public and business spaces whenever you’re within 6 feet of another person who is not from your household.".

You can look up the orders by the public health officers and then additionally read all of the various interpretations by the press and law enforcement, but to summarize, the county orders in the areas that I am talking about say, "people/businesses shall be required to wear masks" without specifying social distancing, even though as I already stated this may not be the public health officer's intent.

 

[Mike7]

This is well done from start to finish. Funny.

 

[7mmremmag]

I think I just had the most scientific mask test completed yet.

I walked in the restroom at work (masks required at all work places in PA) and the fat, weird guy that every workplace has was ughmm.. going number 2. I promptly put my mask back on and was relieved to find almost all the smell went away and I could pee without the full olfactory assault.

By the way, my mask for work is made from an old Kuiu t-shirt in vias in case anyone is wondering what material was so effective.

 

[BuzzH]

I think I just had the most scientific mask test completed yet.

I walked in the restroom at work (masks required at all work places in PA) and the fat, weird guy that every workplace has was ughmm.. going number 2. I promptly put my mask back on and was relieved to find almost all the smell went away and I could pee without the full olfactory assault.

By the way, my mask for work is made from an old Kuiu t-shirt in vias in case anyone is wondering what material was so effective.

Use scent-loc material next time...

 

[MattB]

You can look up the orders by the public health officers and then additionally read all of the various interpretations by the press and law enforcement, but to summarize, the county orders in the areas that I am talking about say, "people/businesses shall be required to wear masks" without specifying social distancing, even though as I already stated this may not be the public health officer's intent.

I reviewed a couple of local orders (San Francisco and Santa Clara) and they do not say what you suggested. Which counties specifically?

 

[Foldem]

What do you guys think about Sweden's response and corresponding results? People are freaking out that their deaths are higher than other Scandinavian countries, but this really makes sense if you're not flattening the curve "as much". WHO says their response is now a model for response.

 

[Mike7]

I reviewed a couple of local orders (San Francisco and Santa Clara) and they do not say what you suggested. Which counties specifically?

Here is a story about one order...followed by the actual order. I see that the link to the PDF of one order I looked at has either moved or been taken down. Hmmm.

Coronavirus: Face Mask Mandate Goes Into Effect In Los Angeles

Under the order, people must cover their noses and mouths while still keeping a distance of 6 feet from others. Business may refuse entry to anyone not wearing a face covering as of Friday.

losangeles.cbslocal.com

https://www.lamayor.org/sites/g/files/wph446/f/page/file/20200416MayorPublicOrderWorkerProtectionRevised041620.pdf

This all seems to be the same theme...
bureaucrats ordering people about and/or ordering them not to use their own property, under threat of fine and/or imprisonment, without due process, and all under the guise of an ongoing emergency...and with little to no evidence to support many of these actions.

Most of the colonists in the 1700's were satisfied following their masters orders from England as they had been conditioned to do, so I guess we should be satisfied as well.

If these orders, not recommendations are so benign as you intimate, then I wonder why many law enforcement officers around the nation have had to stand up and say that they will not enforce these orders.

 

[*zap*]

What do you guys think about Sweden's response and corresponding results? People are freaking out that their deaths are higher than other Scandinavian countries, but this really makes sense if you're not flattening the curve "as much". WHO says their response is now a model for response.

Could be good and could be bad, we will know by the end of the year.....I do not think anyone knows very much about the kung flu, yet. We are sill @ 2,500 or so deaths in the USA from it daily...that has not gone down @ all and it seems that all the #'s are being played with to 'prove' a pov.