What are your thoughts on the Kung Flu?

[Mosster47]

My wife was just there as well for ER. Yes they are staffed fine and actually starting to cancel contracts. To put things into perspective about the ICU and COVID, once a patient goes on ventilator it’s pretty much over. However they had more come thru that recovered or will recover from this. When you have a population as high as NY does and then them living on top of each other and really just doing what they want, yes they will have high numbers of COVID patients.

Personally I don’t think it’s any worse or maybe just a tad worse than the flu. The numbers are near identical between the two but what people forget is the flu has a vaccine. Imagine it if didn’t what the numbers would be for flu so to me that just says flu is likely more dangerous.

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Then how are the deaths above average so extremely high in the places where there is a high number of infected people? The previous averages counted the flu. How did 60% more people die than average in NY since this thing kicked off?

People can disagree with the response and that's fine. Still comparing COVID to the flu is just purposefully being naive. The average death number has always been there and the death totals have always been tracked the same way. Until someone can explain the extreme deviation from the mean all over the world that just happens to be during the middle of a pandemic then I'll retract my comment.

 

[JustJustin]

I didn't do any research on this specifically, just going from what I remembered. Feel free to argue, correct, or like.
By looking at the death toll to positive cases, numbers would suggest its slightly deadlier than flu among people without vaccine or immunity. However, take the random antibody test and go with a conservative percentage of people that have developed immunity without symptoms and suddenly you have a disease that, for the larger half of Americans, has no to mild symptoms (that's not as bad as flu, BTW) and for the people who are immunocompromised is very similar to flu.

Thank you sasquatch for pointing out that common flu "magically stopped". With that factor in mind, we can confidentiality be assured that a lot of "COVID-19" patients actually have common flu.

I wasn't planning to wax political in this post, but its interesting that all the left media hammered Trump for saying "it will magically go away" and they said that no virus will ever "magically go away", yet, common flu has prematurely "magically gone away" for the season. It should only be winding up now, not in February!

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[durangobrad]

I didn't do any research on this specifically, just going from what I remembered. Feel free to argue, correct, or like.
By looking at the death toll to positive cases, numbers would suggest its slightly deadlier than flu among people without vaccine or immunity. However, take the random antibody test and go with a conservative percentage of people that have developed immunity without symptoms and suddenly you have a disease that, for the larger half of Americans, has no to mild symptoms (that's not as bad as flu, BTW) and for the people who are immunocompromised is very similar to flu.

Thank you sasquatch for pointing out that common flu "magically stopped". With that factor in mind, we can confidentiality be assured that a lot of "COVID-19" patients actually have common flu.

I wasn't planning to wax political in this post, but its interesting that all the left media hammered Trump for saying "it will magically go away" and they said that no virus will ever "magically go away", yet, common flu has prematurely "magically gone away" for the season. It should only be winding up now, not in February!

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I can think of two reasons that flu cases are down.

-Our methods put in place to flatten the covid-19 curve. Airlines travel is down 95% compared to the previous year, sporting events, concerts, large gatherings, nope. Reduced trips to the grocery stores, hand washing, sanitizing etc.

- when people did get sick, we were told to stay home, self isolate and ride it out. unless you needed to be hospitalized, you weren't getting tested for covid or the flu.

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[JustJustin]

I can think of two reasons that flu cases are down.

-Our methods put in place to flatten the covid-19 curve. Airlines travel is down 95% compared to the previous year, sporting events, concerts, large gatherings, nope. Reduced trips to the grocery stores, hand washing, sanitizing etc.

- when people did get sick, we were told to stay home, self isolate and ride it out. unless you needed to be hospitalized, you weren't getting tested for covid or the flu.

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But if that totally stopped the flu, why didn't it stop COVID-19? Also, its obvious that many people still did get tested without severe symptoms. The positive-hospital ratio proves that.

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[durangobrad]

But if that totally stopped the flu, why didn't it stop COVID-19? Also, its obvious that many people still did get tested without severe symptoms. The positive-hospital ratio proves that.

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Because it's not the flu. We have zero herd immunity and no vaccine.

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[jmez]

Then how are the deaths above average so extremely high in the places where there is a high number of infected people? The previous averages counted the flu. How did 60% more people die than average in NY since this thing kicked off?

People can disagree with the response and that's fine. Still comparing COVID to the flu is just purposefully being naive. The average death number has always been there and the death totals have always been tracked the same way. Until someone can explain the extreme deviation from the mean all over the world that just happens to be during the middle of a pandemic then I'll retract my comment.

Until we have the actual number, or a solid estimate, of the number of people that were actually infected it is also being purposefully naive to say there is no comparison to the flu.

Yes total death percentages and numbers are up. Exactly as you would expect them to be. You, nor anyone else, at this point, knows what the infection % is. It may well end up that Covid is less deadly than influenza.

You also can't just look at a total death % and say, well we have a new disease, the average death % is up by this figure, all of those must be from Covid. Those type of blanket assumptions lead to wildly inaccurate modeling that never comes to pass.

Correlation is not causation.

 

[Montana Slim]

But if that totally stopped the flu, why didn't it stop COVID-19? Also, its obvious that many people still did get tested without severe symptoms. The positive-hospital ratio proves that.

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It has severely limited the spread - which was the point of all the social distancing measures. Had we not done that, cases of both flu and covid would both look much different, and we would be hurting much more than we are I think.

 

[JustJustin]

Because it's not the flu. We have zero herd immunity and no vaccine.

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So... what about the people that are getting COVID-19 tests because they have systems but test negative for COVID-19. These people aren't going to go to the ER or their family doctor for a standard flu test. They just go home happy that they don't have covid and live it out (or die). And that flu case isn't counted.
It is very obvious that the media is biased and dishonest. Both sides. With that in mind, think about the large chunk of deaths that are contributed to COVID-19 but didn't actually have a positive test. There's no evidence that those aren't from common flu, and you wouldn't know any different if they are. I think the decrease in flu numbers corresponds better to the increase in "coronavirus" deaths than to the shutdown.


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[Laramie]

They test everyone for the flu first before wasting a Coronavirus test. The flu test is much less expensive and more readily available.

 

[Trial153]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/05/02/theres-more-accurate-way-compare-coronavirus-deaths-flu/

 

[Trial153]

Coronavirus daily deaths vs all causes United States 2022 | Statista

As of January 6, 2022, an average of 1,192 people per day have died from COVID-19 in the U.S.

www.statista.com

 

[Trial153]

One chart shows how many Americans are dying from the coronavirus each week compared with other common causes of death like heart disease, cancer, and the flu

More Americans are dying weekly from COVID-19 than they have in the past from common causes of death like heart disease, cancer, and the flu.

www.businessinsider.com

 

[Trial153]

The Pandemic’s Hidden Toll: Half a Million Deaths (Published 2020)

Far more people died in 2020 during the pandemic than have been officially reported, a review of mortality data in 35 countries shows.

www.nytimes.com

 

[blueyceman]

Regarding strict state government measures in place to reduce COVID19 spread:

But if that totally stopped the flu, why didn't it stop COVID-19? Also, its obvious that many people still did get tested without severe symptoms. The positive-hospital ratio proves that.

It stopped the flu and not COVID-19 because COVID-19 has a much higher R0 value - contagion rate. Continually downlaying COVID to 'a little worse than the flu' is a pretty tired argument engineered to mitigate political damage and it also squares well with folks who prefer to believe that everything will go back to normal, if only the lockdowns were eased and everyone went back to work.

Some say - if you're scared, stay home. Yes, indeed. On the flip side, if you think now is a good time to go bowling, hit a re-opened movie theater, go to that packed favorite restaurant of yours - great, good luck. Nothing wrong with being a guinea pig if you're aware of the risk. Let's see where we're at in 4-6 weeks. If those claiming this whole thing is overblown prove to be right, then GREAT!

Here is an interesting article discussing COVID-19 Deaths vs annual flu deaths from a Scientific American editorial:

Comparing COVID-19 Deaths to Flu Deaths Is like Comparing Apples to Oranges

The former are actual numbers; the latter are inflated statistical estimates

blogs.scientificamerican.com

 

[durangobrad]

California to reopen some businesses this week as lockdowns ease across US – as it happened

‘It has only happened for one reason: the data says it can happen,’ the state’s governor said

www.theguardian.com

Trump administration says daily deaths will be 3k per day in June.

That's an additional 90k "it's just the flu" deaths in the month of June.

 

[Backyard]

California to reopen some businesses this week as lockdowns ease across US – as it happened

‘It has only happened for one reason: the data says it can happen,’ the state’s governor said

www.theguardian.com

Trump administration says daily deaths will be 3k per day in June.

That's an additional 90k "it's just the flu" deaths in the month of June.

Yeah, he's got that all figured out too. If he calls it, it makes it ok.

 

[durangobrad]

Yeah, he's got that all figured out too. If he calls it, it makes it ok.

Biggly awesome success.

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[sasquatch]

I can think of two reasons that flu cases are down.

-Our methods put in place to flatten the covid-19 curve. Airlines travel is down 95% compared to the previous year, sporting events, concerts, large gatherings, nope. Reduced trips to the grocery stores, hand washing, sanitizing etc.

- when people did get sick, we were told to stay home, self isolate and ride it out. unless you needed to be hospitalized, you weren't getting tested for covid or the flu.

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The flu counts fell off way before all the lock downs!


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[sasquatch]

CDC’s failed coronavirus tests were tainted with coronavirus, feds confirm

A federal investigation found CDC researchers not following protocol.

arstechnica.com

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[brettdunn7]

I didn't do any research on this specifically, just going from what I remembered. Feel free to argue, correct, or like.
By looking at the death toll to positive cases, numbers would suggest its slightly deadlier than flu among people without vaccine or immunity. However, take the random antibody test and go with a conservative percentage of people that have developed immunity without symptoms and suddenly you have a disease that, for the larger half of Americans, has no to mild symptoms (that's not as bad as flu, BTW) and for the people who are immunocompromised is very similar to flu.

Thank you sasquatch for pointing out that common flu "magically stopped". With that factor in mind, we can confidentiality be assured that a lot of "COVID-19" patients actually have common flu.

I wasn't planning to wax political in this post, but its interesting that all the left media hammered Trump for saying "it will magically go away" and they said that no virus will ever "magically go away", yet, common flu has prematurely "magically gone away" for the season. It should only be winding up now, not in February!

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You pretty much said it for me and you are right. It is also proven that a lot of these deaths are not due to COVID but being counted as COVID deaths. Also these hard hit places you have to look at those who are dying and the majority are immunocompromised, elderly, and pre-existing conditions. Extremely high populations are going to have higher infections and more deaths. It is also being found out that more people than expected have had COVID which is why the fatality rate is only slightly higher than flu right now (.2 to .1 or something like that). But again the flu has a vaccine so I will state again I believe the flu to be more deadly.

And yes you can absolutely compare the two. The symptoms are identical. The response and care procedures are identical. The infection and deaths are bear identical (again with the flu having a vaccine). The shutdown were not necessary.


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