UL fuel efficient cook system

[cornfedkiller]

Been very interested in the rough ridge high country system, been using a Soto/evernew combo and arguably could save some weight if the rough ridge is as fuel efficient as it says it use. Base weight minus fuel is a wash roughly.

Anyone on here eyeing the rough ridge?


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Pretty good discussion about them here: https://rokslide.com/forums/threads/new-cook-stove-on-the-market.436310/page-7#post-4579389

 

[mod7rem]

Do you have any pictures of that edge? I have a few skills but making clean cuts with tin snips is not one of them haha. How much weight did you cut out by shortening it?

Here are a few more pics. The edge doesn’t come out pristine, but a little light file work removes all sharp edges. I’m not sure the exact weight savings in shortening the pot, but it allowed it to all fit inside the Mug and still have enough volume to boil for one person meals.

 

[35WhelenAI]

A pot worth looking at is the Fire Maple "Ramen Pot". 1L capacity even though it is listed at 800ml. Wider base than the G3, has cutouts for both a three-prong support and a four prong support on the heat exchanger bottom. Lid won't sit flush with a 230g canister (110g is an easy fit with the stove too) however efficiency with the wider bottom and heat exchanger looks to be really good. I use a Soto Windmaster and much less than full power easily boils a half quart of water with a package of ramen in well under 2 minutes at my house at 7200' elevation. 1:47 to be more exact.

A few things I've noticed in the journey to arrive at a system that ticks the boxes for me...

1) Why manufacturers don't make a recessed burner head, such as a the Soto Windmaster and a few other highly rated stoves, is beyond me. More designs than not are so exposed as to be criminal. Without a windscreen they couldn't make Jiffy Pop in a slight breeze for a birthday party on a picnic table in the park surrounded by 8 kids blocking the wind (some creative license in that, however I hope the general point is understood).

2) The distance a pot sits above the burner head with respect to the pot support design, varies widely. With that, narrow pots short or tall, HX or not, need to be throttled back more than wider pots to avoid the flame going up around the sides which knocks off efficiency.

3) Empty canisters need to be packed out. 110g canisters weigh about 100g each for the canister, a single 230g is about 130g-140g empty. 10 G more fuel on average with 60g-70g less canister weight that I'm packing out, works for me. And if I don't use the remaining amount of the 230 g canister, then it's a wash with less waste to throw in the trash when I return.

EDIT: 4) Manufacturer boil times are typically from full power runs. Efficient fuel usage (grams/boil) from a lower BTU burner (some jetboil burners for example) can be had with more powerful burners such as the Soto Windmaster or MSR Pocket Rocket Deluxe by throttling back. BTU's are BTU's. With apples to apples pots, and burners adjusted to the same approximate output, most lightweight canister stoves boil and use fuel about the same.

EDIT: 5) Stoves of pressure regulator design do much better as the canister gets lower on capacity and of course as the outside temperature drops.

I'll be the first to admit just like my car, I have no desire to run it down to the end of a tank and finish on fumes, or come up short of my destination. I'll carry a bit of extra fuel above and beyond what I need and use it up on the trip for a rainy day, a few more cups of coffee, simmer up some back strap in the bottom of the pan if I tag out early and not worry about fuel to cook meals after hard days of packing out. Ymmv.

 

[doverpack12]

A pot worth looking at is the Fire Maple "Ramen Pot". 1L capacity even though it is listed at 800ml. Wider base than the G3, has cutouts for both a three-prong support and a four prong support on the heat exchanger bottom. Lid won't sit flush with a 230g canister (110g is an easy fit with the stove too) however efficiency with the wider bottom and heat exchanger looks to be really good. I use a Soto windmaster and much less than full power easily boils a half quart of water with a package of ramen in well under 2 minutes at my house at 7200' elevation. 1:47 to be more exact.

A few things I've noticed in the journey to arrive at a system that ticks the boxes for me...

1) Why manufacturers don't make a recessed burner head, such as a the Soto Windmaster and a few other highly rated stoves, is beyond me. More designs than not are so exposed as to be criminal. Without a windscreen they couldn't make Jiffy Pop in a slight breeze for a birthday party on a picnic table in the park surrounded by 8 kids blocking the wind (some creative license in that, however I hope the general point is understood)

2) The distance a pot sits above the burner head with respect to the pot support design, varies widely. With that, narrow pots short or tall, HX or not, need to be throttled back to avoid the flame going up around the sides which knocks off efficiency.

3) Empty canisters need to be packed out. 110g canisters weigh about 100g each for the canister, a single 230g is about 130g empty. 10 G more fuel on average with 70 G less canister weight that I'm packing out, works for me. And if I don't use the remaining amount of the 230 g canister, then it's a wash with less waste to throw in the trash when I return.

I'll be the first to admit just like my car, I have no desire to run it down to the end of a tank and finish on fumes, or come up short of my destination. I'll carry a bit of extra fuel above and beyond what I need and use it up on the trip for a rainy day, a few more cups of coffee, simmer up some back strap in the bottom of the pan if I tag out early and not worry about fuel to cook meals after hard days of packing out. Ymmv.

Interesting. I’m running the original Petrel/fire maple pot, jetboil zip cozy and lid with pocket rocket delux.

Do you know if the ramen pot lines up with a cozy cover that is readily available? I can see the wider base making a big difference. My normal pot has been awesome

 

[35WhelenAI]

Interesting. I’m running the original Petrel/fire maple pot, jetboil zip cozy and lid with pocket rocket delux.

Do you know if the ramen pot lines up with a cozy cover that is readily available? I can see the wider base making a big difference. My normal pot has been awesome

As you probably have looked, Fire Maple doesn't have one and I don't know of other generic ones to fit the width of the pot.

 

[Dobermann]

A pot worth looking at is the Fire Maple "Ramen Pot". 1L capacity even though it is listed at 800ml. Wider base than the G3, has cutouts for both a three-prong support and a four prong support on the heat exchanger bottom. Lid won't sit flush with a 230g canister (110g is an easy fit with the stove too) however efficiency with the wider bottom and heat exchanger looks to be really good. I use a Soto Windmaster and much less than full power easily boils a half quart of water with a package of ramen in well under 2 minutes at my house at 7200' elevation. 1:47 to be more exact.

A few things I've noticed in the journey to arrive at a system that ticks the boxes for me...

1) Why manufacturers don't make a recessed burner head, such as a the Soto Windmaster and a few other highly rated stoves, is beyond me. More designs than not are so exposed as to be criminal. Without a windscreen they couldn't make Jiffy Pop in a slight breeze for a birthday party on a picnic table in the park surrounded by 8 kids blocking the wind (some creative license in that, however I hope the general point is understood).

2) The distance a pot sits above the burner head with respect to the pot support design, varies widely. With that, narrow pots short or tall, HX or not, need to be throttled back more than wider pots to avoid the flame going up around the sides which knocks off efficiency.

3) Empty canisters need to be packed out. 110g canisters weigh about 100g each for the canister, a single 230g is about 130g-140g empty. 10 G more fuel on average with 60g-70g less canister weight that I'm packing out, works for me. And if I don't use the remaining amount of the 230 g canister, then it's a wash with less waste to throw in the trash when I return.

EDIT: 4) Manufacturer boil times are typically from full power runs. Efficient fuel usage (grams/boil) from a lower BTU burner (some jetboil burners for example) can be had with more powerful burners such as the Soto Windmaster or MSR Pocket Rocket Deluxe by throttling back. BTU's are BTU's. With apples to apples pots, and burners adjusted to the same approximate output, most lightweight canister stoves boil and use fuel about the same.

EDIT: 5) Stoves of pressure regulator design do much better as the canister gets lower on capacity and of course as the outside temperature drops.

I'll be the first to admit just like my car, I have no desire to run it down to the end of a tank and finish on fumes, or come up short of my destination. I'll carry a bit of extra fuel above and beyond what I need and use it up on the trip for a rainy day, a few more cups of coffee, simmer up some back strap in the bottom of the pan if I tag out early and not worry about fuel to cook meals after hard days of packing out. Ymmv.

Good timing ... I only recently purchased the Firemaple Ramen Pot and was going to post about it.

My short take: I think it provides a useful alternative to the Petrel G2 and G3 in terms of the wide base and volume.

However, in my (very) brief testing, it did not balance well at all on the Soto Windmaster three-prong support - it simply wanted to tip towards the handle side. Could have been something I was doing wrong - we were in a hurry - but I did try to center it a few times and no go. Was lucky I had a four-prong support with me as well, which worked fine.

Some of the reviews on their site spoke about it being hard to remove from the support. I did find I needed to jiggle it to get it on and off. Not something you'd want to do with it full of hot water, so worth experimenting with more.

Overall, would be interesting to see some comparisons of the Ramen Pot with the Jetboil Stash pot (which, as noted earlier in this thread, can be purchased from Jetboil as 'relacement' parts). Some of the tests I linked to a year ago were suggesting that was the most efficient HX pot available (at that time, at least).

 

[35WhelenAI]

Nice input, thanks for sharing. My experience is only with the four prong support.

One of the main benefits to me is the width of the ramen pot. More efficient heating with the wider HX base and easier to eat out of by far than the tall skinny pots.

Personally, the three prong support is a pinhead at just under 4" in diameter. The four prong support is closer to 6" in diameter. The stability and versatility of the four is where it's at in my book. The three prong support is for users that need or want to count every gram and probably won't be using a liter size pot on that type of excursion, in my estimation. In any case a taller skinny 1 L pot would be a better option with the three prong support. In fact, it's been suggested that a liter be the largest pot to consider with the three prong head.

I picked the ramen pot because it had slots for the four flex as I had said in my previous post and I agree that it works well.

 

[Macintosh]

Hoping some of you guys can lend some insight. I’ve been using the toaks 750ml pot below, along with the snowpeak giga that I’ve had for well over 20 years, along with a small wind screen. Its pretty light and the whole kit pictured fits inside the pot, BUT it is slow as heck to boil compared to a jetboil or similar. I’m planning a backpacking trip with the wife, and considering getting a pot with a heat exchanger but not sure which pot or size. Apparently the jetboil pots are not available as parts, at least there are none on their website. Looking at fire maple or others.
My questions are:
-are the newer stoves going to make a difference, or is my current stove still more or less current? Fuel usage being chief consideration.
-looking at a fire maple most likely, heating water for 2 dehydrated meals—from a “how much fuel do I need to bring on a trip” perspective am I better off with a bigger (1.2l ish) pot, or sticking with a smaller pot and doing two boils?

 

[35WhelenAI]

A few observations. The Giga has a very exposed burner, it's going to perform poorly with any wind. Depending on what a "small windscreen means", if the burner is protected then the burner isn't as much of an issue.

It's a non pressure regulated stove, as temperature gets below freezing even good iso butane/propane mixtures are going to perform more poorly as the canister empties over the course of a trip.

Depending on how far the pot bottom sits from the exposed burner head, that has a big difference on efficiency. In any case, I would swap a heat exchanger pot in an instant for that plain bottom titanium pot no matter what stove. Makes a big difference in fuel consumption.

You're on the right track, if you need to boil a liter of water or thereabouts, a larger pot with one boil is a more efficient way to go. Larger pot spreads flame out along the bottom compared to a taller skinnier pot like you have where heat is wasted up around the sides of the pot unless running really low power.

My stove is a Soto Windmaster and Fire Maple Ramen pot. At my house, 7200', easily under 2 mintes to boil 500 ml on less than full power. Fire Maple Polaris or Greenpeak 2 are similar options for less $$.

There are good videos on YouTube and forums that have chats about the different pots and stove combinations that you can learn a lot from those as well.

 

[Macintosh]

All fair. The windscreen I use is shown, its simply a doubled sheet of aluminum foil electrical taped along the edges so it doesnt tear. It does an ok job although Im certain its not the ultimate. Ive definitely noticed slow boiling even in zero-wind situations though.

Feedback on relative fuel usage between 2 boils in a small pot vs 1 boil in a bigger pot?

 

[35WhelenAI]

Apologies, I was adding a bit to my post about fuel usage using one pot versus two boils and a smaller pot. Don't think you saw before your post. I would always go for one boil because of the larger pot and efficiencies created with such pot (added to my previous post).

Little or no wind, and slow boil, unless cold temps are a culprit, spend 35 or 40 bucks on a new pressure regulated stove and a 1-1.5l heat exchanger pot. Your world will change, lol.

 

[brca005]

Apparently the jetboil pots are not available as parts, at least there are none on their website.

https://jetboil.johnsonoutdoors.com/us/shop/parts-accessories/spare-cups

Jetboil sells a 1L spare cup, it's the only one they sell as parts but they still sell it.

 

[35WhelenAI]

Same as shared above, Jet Boil pot is a replacement part if you are so moved.

With that said, don't spend the money on it, IMO. Get a fire Maple pot that fits your stove. Pick up a new stove for under 40 bucks that will outperform the one you have in the wind and have a pressure regulator then pick up one of the fire maple pots with the cutouts in the bottom versus a jet boil that only attaches to their systems. If I am correct and understand things, the jetboil spare cup will simply sit on top of your burner not nested for more efficiency like ones that have proper cutouts.

With these things said, Fire Maple pots (search around on line for lots of info) in some cases hold 1l though rated at 800 ml, that kind of thing. I am an ounces and qts kind of guy, the ramen pot easily holds a quart. Enough for two freeze-dried meals which is what you use it for from your first post. Ramen pot won't fit a 230g canister due to the more efficient wider bottom/shorter height (110 g fits along with Windmaster stove).

Here's a link to some good pot geeking:

Best Heat Exchanger Pot For Backpacking Ultralight 2026

This buyer's guide will help you find the best heat exchanger pot for backpacking. Ultralight and fuel efficient, perfect for boiling water.

www.adventurealan.com

 

[Macintosh]

@35WhelenAI thanks very much, thats very helpful.

 

[Dobermann]

Hoping some of you guys can lend some insight. I’ve been using the toaks 750ml pot below, along with the snowpeak giga that I’ve had for well over 20 years, along with a small wind screen. Its pretty light and the whole kit pictured fits inside the pot, BUT it is slow as heck to boil compared to a jetboil or similar. I’m planning a backpacking trip with the wife, and considering getting a pot with a heat exchanger but not sure which pot or size. Apparently the jetboil pots are not available as parts, at least there are none on their website. Looking at fire maple or others.
My questions are:
-are the newer stoves going to make a difference, or is my current stove still more or less current? Fuel usage being chief consideration.
-looking at a fire maple most likely, heating water for 2 dehydrated meals—from a “how much fuel do I need to bring on a trip” perspective am I better off with a bigger (1.2l ish) pot, or sticking with a smaller pot and doing two boils?View attachment 1037063

As @35WhelenAI said, an HX pot will almost always be more efficient than a non-HX pot.

If you wade through my posts from Jan/Feb last year in this thread, you'll find links to some tests about relative performance.

Overall, it looks like the JetBoil Stash Pot is the most efficient. Their whole Stash system is expensive, and the burner is not as good as others, but you can order the pot as parts if you contact them directly - I think details of that are available earlier in the thread. From memory, when I spoke with them, it was only a little more expensive than the Fire Maple - or proportionately more, but still reasonable for a high-performing pot.

I didn't end up ordering one with the hassles of overseas phone calls; if I was doing this all over again from the beginning, I suspect I'd just go with a Stash Pot and Soto Windmaster.

However, the Windmaster plus Fire Maple Petrel G2 (larger than the G3) is a great combination.

I recently used the Windmaster plus Fire Maple Ramen pot, and wasn't hugely impressed by the boil time - but I haven't compared it directly to the G3, so I can' say definitively.

Note that the Ramen pot, although it has a clever slot system for both 3 and 4 prong bases, does not balance well at all on 3 prongs - it's own handle pulls it off balance (or did for me). So a 4-prong base is what you'd need, which adds a small amount of weight.

And if weight is not the issue, the MSR Reactor was far faster at boiling water. We had one of each at camp, so took to boiling in the Reactor, and then transferring the boiled water to the Ramen pot for cooking ramen and meals that needed regulated heat. Of course, the Reactor is no good for cooking meals, so the two complemented each other ... but we had a base camp that allowed us to have one of each.

 

[35WhelenAI]

On the flip side, I haven't used a G2 or G3, only the Ramen pot with respect to HX pots. And only with a 4 prong base. Agree, the wider the pot in general, typically the less stable with 3 prong/smaller diameter supports.

Doberman, sounds like you experienced the G2 boiling faster than the Ramen pot. I say that because you mentioned the G2 and Windmaster is a great combination. Was it anything worth noting, as given all else equal, a slightly wider HX pot with the same stove at the same output should boil more quickly. Definitely not a sticking point but interested in your experience.

 

[35WhelenAI]

@Macintosh, found this. May be helpful if it works with your era Giga stove.

I don't like giving up things that I've used for years and years, even if something else can work better or even marginally better. Maybe you can give this a try and stay with your old stove and find an HX pot that fits it.

GigaPower Windscreen

An essential backpacking accessory, the stainless steel GigaPower Windscreen is designed to maximize GigaPower Stove output. The GigaPower Windscreen directs heat towards the cookset and protects the flame from the elements, quickening boil time for easier outdoor cooking. Pair the GigaPower...

www.snowpeak.com

 

[BBob]

@Macintosh, found this. May be helpful if it works with your era Giga stove.

I don't like giving up things that I've used for years and years, even if something else can work better or even marginally better. Maybe you can give this a try and stay with your old stove and find an HX pot that fits it.

GigaPower Windscreen

An essential backpacking accessory, the stainless steel GigaPower Windscreen is designed to maximize GigaPower Stove output. The GigaPower Windscreen directs heat towards the cookset and protects the flame from the elements, quickening boil time for easier outdoor cooking. Pair the GigaPower...

www.snowpeak.com

I used a Giga for a lot of years with that windscreen. I’ll have to dig it out and see how it matches up with the Petrel.

 

[35WhelenAI]

Not going to lie, this discussion is a heck of a lot more interesting and informative than pissing over a bullet and arguing about necropsies.

 

[Dobermann]

On the flip side, I haven't used a G2 or G3, only the Ramen pot with respect to HX pots. And only with a 4 prong base. Agree, the wider the pot in general, typically the less stable with 3 prong/smaller diameter supports.

Doberman, sounds like you experienced the G2 boiling faster than the Ramen pot. I say that because you mentioned the G2 and Windmaster is a great combination. Was it anything worth noting, as given all else equal, a slightly wider HX pot with the same stove at the same output should boil more quickly. Definitely not a sticking point but interested in your experience.

I haven't recorded times or done a side-by-side time trial ... was just going by usages split across time, so I wouldn't rely on my memory at all - for all I know, the Ramen pot may well be more efficient than the G2.

And the tests that showed the Stash pot as most efficient didn't include the Ramen pot, as it wasn't available then.

If one wanted to know about the Ramen vs G3, you'd likely need to test for yourself, or see if anyone has posted results online. Jon Fong at FlatCatGear, who has made many of the best comparison videos on YouTube (and posts his results on Backpacking Light) often tests new pots that come to market - so if he hasn't posted anything yet, chances are good he has already experimented with it. His email address is on his site, and I've found him to be helpful and responsive if you or @Macintosh felt like emailing him to see if he'd compared the two.

He also makes windscreens that improve efficiency.