Trump Admin will ask Congress to eliminate USGS Biological Resources Division

[2buffalo]

There are ways to tax assets and close loopholes without screwing over the middle and lower class. But sure keep defending people that can buy out our entire government.

How do you tax assets? If they lose money in any given year do they get a refund on their assets?

 

[2buffalo]

Even in high years, BLM revenue tops out around $4–5 billion. DOI’s annual budget is $20–30 billion.

I haven't looked into this that's why I was asking for some back up. If what you are saying is correct I think he needs to go back to school and take some math classes?

 

[menhaden_man]

Oh I have 0 interest in increasing the money going to these organizations. I don’t think we need to throw more money here. I just think the current system is correct. I watched Ryan Zinke on a local news channel talk about how we didn’t need as many scientists but we needed front line fire workers. He talked about BLM, USFS, and FWS but whether we all like it or not, those biologists are all working on different missions. Biologists in each agency have a specialization that helps balance the decisions that are made, in an ideal world that is as litigation has prevented this from functioning correctly. As BLM revenue funds the program, then is it true that the organizations are not economically viable? This comes as the golden goose of defense continues failing audits and increasing their budget. Now talking about some contract for a satellite based defense system (Golden Dome) that could take out enemies at a moments notice. That system is projected to cost $25 billion dollars and then have an operating cost of $4-$5 billion dollars a year. Is that really more important than scientific research? I firmly believe it is not but that is what this administration is talking about.

Additionally this is kind of a side note but, I had a friend who started as a hotshot and he immediately rejected what Zinke said because the scientists that show up on the front line were the people keeping the firefighters safe. They are able to steer them away from areas that would kill them.

Maybe 25–30% of DOI’s overall budget is offset by revenues from ‘selling’ public resources — and that’s a generous estimate. The rest comes from general taxpayer funds. Defense industry, now overshadowed by interest on our debt, is an entirely different topic (both are).

 

[S.Clancy]

Easy to say. Prove it with some facts.

Prove which. That BLM revenue covers annual DOI appropriations?

 

[2buffalo]

Prove which. That BLM revenue covers annual DOI appropriations?

Yes.

 

[Wrench]

Even in high years, BLM revenue tops out around $4–5 billion.

Grand coulee dam does half of that without the rest of reclamation....add in the rest of projects and let me know how it adds up.

 

[elkhunter505]

Who is we and their?

In this case wildlife mangers need to take into account public input better or we end up being defunded as is happening currently.

 

[S.Clancy]

Even in high years, BLM revenue tops out around $4–5 billion. DOI’s annual budget is $20–30 billion.

Annual budget of DOI in 2023 was $14.5 Billion. BLM returned to treasury ~$8 billion. That is after takeoffs. The $20-30 Billion you are referencing was over a decade ago.

BLM gets money from Grazing leases, recreation, timber sales, etc (something like $700-800 million. These are basically subsidies with how cheap they are, especially grazing fees.

BLM also gets tons of money through extraction. Here is a link for the ONRR (office of national resource revenue). This includes offshore extraction.

Edit: Below is the change in grazing fees BLM charges over time. 2025 is same as 2019, $1.35 per AUM. That $2.31 in 1981 is worth ~$8.50-9 now considering 2-3% annual inflation. We could increase our grazing fees collected by multiples by just increasing the fee by inflation. Further, we are ~5% the cost of private land lease rates. Things to ponder

 

[mostlybirch]

This is like looking for change in the couch to pay the mortgage. Eliminating government scientists is a gift to industry.

 

[2buffalo]

Annual budget of DOI in 2023 was $14.5 Billion.

 

[ZMT]

So you guys are cool with paying extra taxes when you take out a car loan, mortgage or any other type of loan right? After all the personal loan, car and home market dwarfs the few billionaires taking out loans and if they decide to start taxing them well it sure isn’t going to generate the supposed benefits so you can be damn sure they will move on to taxing us on our loans once the cat is out of the bag.

You forgot the obvious - I've already been taxed on that money I'm using to pay. Billionaires use the "Buy, Borrow, Die" method. The way these work means they won't have to spend a cent because banks know they'll get back their money and them some (with an appropriate interest rate) once their estate pays up.

They're leveraging assets that won't be taxed for decades to come. The taxes come out of their estates once their gone, they don't have to pay them in their lifetime.

I don't get to differ my income taxes for 50 years, why should they?

 

[2buffalo]

You forgot the obvious - I've already been taxed on that money I'm using to pay. Billionaires use the "Buy, Borrow, Die" method. The way these work means they won't have to spend a cent because banks know they'll get back their money and them some (with an appropriate interest rate) once their estate pays up.

They're leveraging assets that won't be taxed for decades to come. The taxes come out of their estates once their gone, they don't have to pay them in their lifetime.

I don't get to differ my income taxes for 50 years, why should they?

 

[ZMT]

View attachment 870584

Damn got me there dude

 

[Billinsd]

The smug argument has been that the states own the wildlife. Non Residents can literally and figuratively take a hike and camp on Federal Public Land all they want. Now when these smug resident hunters come screaming for help from Non Residents to protect funding for subsidized state wildlife, Non Residents are asking themselves why should they as federal taxpayers subsidize state owned game?

I fixed it all, I think…

 

[Billinsd]

I have no interest in being forced to pay through federal taxes without equal access to the tags.

Bruh!! I’ll go one further, I absolutely do not want to pay through federal taxes without equal access to tags. Can’t have it both ways, LOL!! Cheers Bill

 

[Billinsd]

I’m in the tax billionaires crowd personally.

I thought you were much smarter. Exactly how much should someone that makes a billion dollars a year in taxes? How much should they keep? Serious question

 

[Gila]

Most of these cuts cannot be justified it’s just a facade to get power. This Admin doesn’t give a rat’s patootie for any environmental science what-so-ever let alone any wildlife, fishery management plans. There is no economic benefit to cutting these programs, actually the reverse is true. Billions of dollars of revenue was generated by the science these programs provided. Case in point last weeks executive orders included opening up the pacific areas for tuna and other pelagic species (juveniles off the spawning areas) over by Samoa.

Another Presidential Execuitive Order dated 17 April gutted the regional Fisheries Management Councils by throwing out not only the fishery science, but included shooting another arrow into the heart of the commercial fishing industry. He completely ignores the Magnuson-Steven’s Act, the Highly Migratory species Acts and the international Tuna Convention Act. The Army Corps of Engineers determines the dam flows. Without the science to keep the eco-systems in and around the reservoirs healthy, there will be no fishing. It has taken over 50 years of environmental science to reverse some of the damage done to our trout and salmon fisheries.

 

[S.Clancy]

Looks like I was quoting 2022, my bad, $15.1 billion 2023

 

[Billinsd]

There are ways to tax assets and close loopholes without screwing over the middle and lower class. But sure keep defending people that can buy out our entire government.

Comrade are you talking about a wealth tax? What is the most money an individual or family can have comrade? A million, 10, or a hundred million? Who decides this? Sounds like “everyone” benefits? I’m not a pro or anti billionaire, I’m a liberty guy. Most billionaires are liberal assholes and I don’t like them either, however, who gets to decide how much money a person can keep? The government? Tyranny or billionaires. I prefer billionaires. Bill

 

[Billinsd]

How do you tax assets? If they lose money in any given year do they get a refund on their assets?

He’s probably talking about a wealth tax, which is unconstitutional and tyranny. I could be wrong.