The Shoot2hunt Podcast

[Archer86]

I can't say I'm a huge fan of the voice changer but isn't the point of all this that who he is doesn't matter? Even if he's a 16 year old from England and doesn't even own guns, we live in reality. Game animals are not undiscovered creatures whose anatomy we're guessing at. We know what a bullet has to get through depending on what angle the shot comes in at and where it hits. And we know what bullets do when they hit animals. So we can figure out what cartridges/bullets are "enough gun".

It could matter if it comes out he works for a a manufacture of a certian products. Do I necessarily think that not currently but if it comes out he works a manufacture of proucts he pushed it might be a cause for concern

Unfortunately we live in a world where most people that are presenting info in one way or another and hiding their identity so they can't be tied to are usually up to no good probabaly not the case here but you never know. Question everything and belive no one

its just funny to me How all l the formies see a podcast, post or whatever that they dont agree with and they all flock to it who gives a crap if jvb did a podcast that he doesn't agree with small Calibers. All you did was give someone irrelevant more views downloads or whatever.

 

[Wiscgunner]

It could matter if it comes out he works for a a manufacture of a certian products. Do I necessarily think that not currently but if it comes out he works a manufacture of proucts he pushed it might be a cause for concern

Unfortunately we live in a world where most people that are presenting info in one way or another and hiding their identity so they can't be tied to are usually up to no good probabaly not the case here but you never know. Question everything and belive no one

its just funny to me How all l the formies see a podcast, post or whatever that they dont agree with and they all flock to it who gives a crap if jvb did a podcast that he doesn't agree with small Calibers. All you did was give someone irrelevant more views downloads or whatever.

I believe him when he says identity clouds the data as your post indicates. Who he is or who he works for does not change if a scope will pass my drop test when I follow the same protocols.

I could care less if Form works for SWFA or the CIA. While I don't necessarily agree with everything he says that are opinion bases, the drop tests are an objective animal. From the start Form has encourage people NOT to take his word for it and to test their own SYSTEMS and not just write off any particular scope. The date is their, we are encouraged to follow HIS instructions on setting up a rile system and then we are encouraged to TEST OUR OWN SYSTEM.

In no way would it bother me if he work for a company involved as there has been no pressure to buy or not buy any products, even Leupold. He has, however, encouraged people to buy at their own risk and to be responsible for testing our own gear systems. With the exception of Form Approved cardboard boxes the Rokstok comes in, I have yet to see an Online Shop he is encouraging readers to visit.

A biased brand rep that doesn't push their brand??? Not adding up to me.

 

[Archer86]

I believe him when he says identity clouds the data as your post indicates. Who he is or who he works for does not change if a scope will pass my drop test when I follow the same protocols.

I could care less if Form works for SWFA or the CIA. While I don't necessarily agree with everything he says that are opinion bases, the drop tests are an objective animal. From the start Form has encourage people NOT to take his word for it and to test their own SYSTEMS and not just write off any particular scope. The date is their, we are encouraged to follow HIS instructions on setting up a rile system and then we are encouraged to TEST OUR OWN SYSTEM.

In no way would it bother me if he work for a company involved as there has been no pressure to buy or not buy any products, even Leupold. He has, however, encouraged people to buy at their own risk and to be responsible for testing our own gear systems. With the exception of Form Approved cardboard boxes the Rokstok comes in, I have yet to see an Online Shop he is encouraging readers to visit.

A biased brand rep that doesn't push their brand??? Not adding up to me.

Tikka tmk rokstock soon to be montana rifles. You don't have to push a brand to impact sales. Just look at the rokstok

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

Tikka tmk rokstock soon to be montana rifles. You don't have to push a brand to impact sales. Just look at the rokstok

Don’t forget Leica, SWFA, Loctite, SRS, Lapua, Peterson, ADG, and Sportsmatch. While you’re at it gotta throw UM in the mix too.

My goodness, maybe form is the CEO of a big box retailer and he’s just pushing products that haven’t sold well.

Or…. Maybe he’s just trying to help guys out that haven’t had the benefit of his experience like tons of other guys on here. When I first joined RS I had the same uninformed arguments as most and he called me out. I eventually got over being butt hurt about somebody challenging me (I’m 49 and been hunting all my life). Then I thoughtfully read all his posts and swallowed my pride.

My perspective really changed when I started reloading. His painless reloading process has de-mystified the sometimes intimidating routine and simplified it for beginners like myself. Had I not gotten anything else out of RS in the last 3 years, the reloading advice alone would’ve been enough.

You probably have never asked Form for advice or a recommendation, but when you PM him he responds every time with patience and generosity. He doesn’t seek recognition or reward, and would rather remain anonymous.

IME, I’ve never sensed any ulterior motives other than to share his honest experience and data to help guys out. However, I know that is getting to be a rare thing, and the conspiracy theorists need something to talk about. Now before you think I’ve drank all the cool aid, I still run a .257 and 7mm and have a pair of Leupold binoculars.

 

[RancherJohn]

It could matter if it comes out he works for a a manufacture of a certian products. Do I necessarily think that not currently but if it comes out he works a manufacture of proucts he pushed it might be a cause for concern

Unfortunately we live in a world where most people that are presenting info in one way or another and hiding their identity so they can't be tied to are usually up to no good probabaly not the case here but you never know. Question everything and belive no one

its just funny to me How all l the formies see a podcast, post or whatever that they dont agree with and they all flock to it who gives a crap if jvb did a podcast that he doesn't agree with small Calibers. All you did was give someone irrelevant more views downloads or whatever.

I believe he has said before he has taken zero money from the outdoor/shooting industry, including S2H classes. If you want to call him out for shilling, I'd recommend doing so. Just bring your data.

What works, works. It will work day, night, rain, sleet, snow, and (maybe) even if you drop it.

Took me about 30 seconds to find this-

No I do not. I do not know how to make this more clear- not one single penny has ever been paid to me from any company in the hunting/gun industry.

Maybe one day that will change, and if it does I will be open about it.

@Archer86 So no data, no posts, no pictures, no industry secret connections to support your position? Your laughing emoji says more about you than anyone else.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

Loctite

 

[Archer86]

I believe he has said before he has taken zero money from the outdoor/shooting industry, including S2H classes. If you want to call him out for shilling, I'd recommend doing so. Just bring your data.

What works, works. It will work day, night, rain, sleet, snow, and (maybe) even if you drop it.

Took me about 30 seconds to find this-



@Archer86 So no data, no posts, no pictures, no industry secret connections to support your position? Your laughing emoji says more about you than anyone else.

Show me where i said I care if he got compensated for what he does? show your data

i am not calling him out for anything I said if it came out he did in fact work for a manufacture it could be a cause for concern maybe skewed data maybe not You formies are so sensitive

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

including S2H classes

I would hope he's getting paid for his time to teach and wouldn't question any integrity at all if so.

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

 

[HighUintas]

I would hope he's getting paid for his time to teach and wouldn't question any integrity at all if so.

He is getting paid through acquiring that data and satisfying his obsession with shooting in the mountains.

 

[Chris_in_Idaho]

But he totally contradicts himself, his daughter shot a "6mm Creedmoor" and killed the dear dead.. and good grief, we all now it is a 6 "mm" or a 7 "mm" he doesn't need to say it every damn time....

Always use the entire cartridge designation your sponsor prints on the box so your readers will funnel money to the correct manufacturer.

 

[Chris_in_Idaho]

Don’t forget Leica, SWFA, Loctite, SRS, Lapua, Peterson, ADG, and Sportsmatch. While you’re at it gotta throw UM in the mix too.

My goodness, maybe form is the CEO of a big box retailer and he’s just pushing products that haven’t sold well.

You forgot pink nail polish.

 

[RancherJohn]

Show me where i said I care if he got compensated for what he does? show your data

i am not calling him out for anything I said if it came out he did in fact work for a manufacture it could be a cause for concern maybe skewed data maybe not You formies are so sensitive

You'll throw a three paragraph screed up, couching your feelings as hypotheticals. I quoted him directly.

I'm far from a "formie". I get to carry a rifle to shoot animals almost every day of the year on our ranch, and when I see something I want to challenge him or others on I go try it. Usually I end up humbled and learning something. I go back to what works, works. Sorry if that hurts your sacred calf.

It could matter if it comes out he works for a a manufacture of a certian products. Do I necessarily think that not currently but if it comes out he works a manufacture of proucts he pushed it might be a cause for concern

Unfortunately we live in a world where most people that are presenting info in one way or another and hiding their identity so they can't be tied to are usually up to no good probabaly not the case here but you never know. Question everything and belive no one

its just funny to me How all l the formies see a podcast, post or whatever that they dont agree with and they all flock to it who gives a crap if jvb did a podcast that he doesn't agree with small Calibers. All you did was give someone irrelevant more views downloads or whatever.

Tikka tmk rokstock soon to be montana rifles. You don't have to push a brand to impact sales. Just look at the rokstok

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

You forgot pink nail polish.

Lol, roger that, and I didn’t recall a brand. Maybe it’s Revlon or some other bougie womens’ fashion brand.

 

[Carl Ross]

Advocacy and science are inherently at odds. In (good) science things must be open to questioning, the methodology of testing hypotheses is what's most important. In advocacy, when you've decided you have "the answer", the questioning is shut down and the focus becomes convincing everyone else of "the answer". Subject Matter Experts have their place, but the best ones talk like scientists in a lot of ways, having strong opinions on many things but still rarely speaking in complete absolutes and also being very willing to discuss areas where they AREN'T confident.

Consider everything presented (not just here), use logic to see where you might have made an erroneous assumption in the past, do your own testing, and see what happens. Be forewarned, it often requires a decent amount of time, effort, and funds. It IS how you really learn things, so that you can truly have your own opinions and stop borrowing other people's.

But that's just like, my opinion, man.

 

[Axlrod]

My first interaction with Form was 6-7 years ago. In a post he talked about failure of a Swaro rifle scope. The very scope I had just purchased for 4 times more money than I had ever paid for a scope before.

I asked him specific questions about why they fail etc. He said they just do, usually after 400-600 rounds. I thought this arrogant jackwagon doesn't know what he is talking about!

But the thought was in my mind, so I regularly checked zero. One day without any drops or bumps It was shooting 6" high and 3.5 inches right. I was at 364 rounds on this scope/gun. I sent it in to Swaro, they replaced the erector assembly. I replaced the Swaro with an ATACR for my hunting rifle.

Someday this wealth of FREE knowledge Form provides will go away. Probably when he tires of the guys that don't shoot, but have a keyboard to complain with. For me I don't give a shit how the watch was built, I just want to know the time.

 

[Wiscgunner]

Tikka tmk rokstock soon to be montana rifles. You don't have to push a brand to impact sales. Just look at the rokstok

So Form works for Beretta, Unknown Munitions, Montana Rifle Company and Sierra bullets? Is he paid directly, do you suppose? Or is it more affiliate marketing because I really missed the boat on the discount codes if that is the case? Wouldn't Nightforce be peeved their employee was pushing sales for Trijicon and SWFA? Maybe he works for a secret cabal? Has he taken Garand Thumbs place at the top of the Holy Order of Leviathan?

If this is the case, when should I expect my checks to arrive for all the recommendations I have made to friends, and strangers for Kifaru, Kuiu, ELD-M, Firstlite, ARC, Feisol, Armageddon Gear, Swarovski, or Christmas Mint M& M's or Tillamook ice cream sandwiches? Does it come in one lump sum or ....

 

[Travis Hobbs]

My first interaction with Form was 6-7 years ago. In a post he talked about failure of a Swaro rifle scope. The very scope I had just purchased for 4 times more money than I had ever paid for a scope before.

I asked him specific questions about why they fail etc. He said they just do, usually after 400-600 rounds. I thought this arrogant jackwagon doesn't know what he is talking about!

But the thought was in my mind, so I regularly checked zero. One day without any drops or bumps It was shooting 6" high and 3.5 inches right. I was at 364 rounds on this scope/gun. I sent it in to Swaro, they replaced the erector assembly. I replaced the Swaro with an ATACR for my hunting rifle.

Someday this wealth of FREE knowledge Form provides will go away. Probably when he tires of the guys that don't shoot, but have a keyboard to complain with. For me I don't give a shit how the watch was built, I just want to know the time.

I think this is why everything these guys are doing and saying is so valuable, especially with the drop tests.

I know years ago I honestly thought ALL scopes just lost zero, and it’s what you have to deal with….that was until I bought a nightforce NXS in 2006ish that changed what I thought was possible.

There is a SHIT load of guys, reading this information, with background and experience that have been losing zero, and learning and understanding there are ways to correct it and its not even about the $$$ spent! That’s who all this stuff really resonates with.

It’s moving the needle and I think it’s fantastic for everyone, hate it or love it.

I just had a conversation with a guy that has had problems with babied guns that did nothing besides ride on a back seat type to and from the range that lost zero. He’s not even a member of the forums. But he’s reading and learning.

I’m amazed so many people haven’t had a problem with scopes losing zero…. Keep living right.

 

[huntnful]

Or…. Maybe he’s just trying to help guys out that haven’t had the benefit of his experience like tons of other guys on here. When I first joined RS I had the same uninformed arguments as most and he called me out. I eventually got over being butt hurt about somebody challenging me (I’m 49 and been hunting all my life). Then I thoughtfully read all his posts and swallowed my pride.

My perspective really changed when I started reloading. His painless reloading process has de-mystified the sometimes intimidating routine and simplified it for beginners like myself. Had I not gotten anything else out of RS in the last 3 years, the reloading advice alone would’ve been enough.

You probably have never asked Form for advice or a recommendation, but when you PM him he responds every time with patience and generosity. He doesn’t seek recognition or reward, and would rather remain anonymous.

IME, I’ve never sensed any ulterior motives other than to share his honest experience and data to help guys out. However, I know that is getting to be a rare thing, and the conspiracy theorists need something to talk about. Now before you think I’ve drank all the cool aid, I still run a .257 and 7mm and have a pair of Leupold binoculars.

This is very well stated. I don't agree with everything he's said, and I've even unnecessarily been a dickhead at times towards him about it. He never has been one back to me though . But he has genuinely provided a TON of excellent info that takes years and years to gather. Mostly unbiased info at that. I just appreciate the access to it, and then what I decide to do with it from there is on me.

I don't follow suit with everything he says, mostly just out of sheer defiance at this point hahaha.

I still hunt with magnum rifles, MOA scopes, use a bipod and clean my barrels. @Formidilosus literal worst nightmare haha.

But seriously, I really appreciate all the data and info he's brought here, whether I fully follow suit or not. It's good shit and has saved me TONS of headaches and mental gymnastics.


I’m pretty sure there’s some mono metal bullets in this pic also…..

 

[The Guide]

Here's my take on it. Form gives us data and tells us to do with it what we will because to him, it is just data. I enjoy being given data about something I care about/enjoy/participate in and then test it on my own. If I find that my data matches the data given, I continue to test the data and then share my findings with others in my sphere. When the people in my sphere try these things and end up with the same data I got which matches the data Form shared, we are starting to see trends that are suggesting that the data is a factual truth.

In the last 2+ years I've continued to test and educate myself by trying things I never would have tried before. I've been using heavy for caliber match type bullets since before Shawn and Broz started LRO when LRH was THE forum for western hunting information. I've had big bore magnum rifles built for me by Kirby Allen and Snowy Mountain Rifles that were killing machines but weren't fun to shoot. They were accurate but you didn't want to run more than 20 rounds through them in a day without risking getting flinchy. They weren't guns you practiced with or shot for fun. It was a slow evolution back to smaller and smaller cartridges to get to where I am today. I went from a 243 Winchester to a 270 Winchester to a 300WM to a 338WM to a 338 AE back to a 300WM to a 264WM to a 280AI to a 260 to 6.5CM to a 6CM to a 223 in the last 20 years. I will always have a 300WM in my rifle stable but I will never be without a bolt action 223 either.

From the mid 80's to about 2010, I thought that all scopes lost zero or I was a poor shot until I started installing my own scopes. I bought the tools and found the it wasn't hard to make a gun shoot really good with factory ammo or handloads. Even then, I would occasionally get a zero shift for no apparent reason even when rifles were babied. That ended when I started trying drop tested scopes that passed. I'm now the guy in my sphere that people bring their rifles to when they can't get them to shoot well. Once we remove, clean, and check all the fasteners and make sure they are properly torqued, we swap to a known good drop tested scope. What we usually find is that the guns shoot great. The issue was it was never set up properly. Dirty threads, loose screws, cross threaded screws, and other things are often found because the kid that put your scope and gun together hadn't been trained or had no previous mechanical experience and put the gun together poorly or the components you went cheap on broke.

I'll keep testing the data Form shares and enjoying shooting more than I once did. Shoot more, test the data yourself, and see if maybe you can learn something too.

Jay