Texas school shooting

[*zap*]

I posted it on a different comment but one article mentioned he was engaged by LE while attempting to enter the school. So i guess in this case that theory doesnt really work. So whats the solution when the threat cant be successfully neutralized? More physical security, in the form of secured doors and buildings?

Pretty simple, allow teachers to be armed. I hear the kid wore body armor and a border patrol swat team took him out. I have no idea what 'engaged' means in this instance. Evidently two cops were shot but not killed.

 

[idahodave]

We’re all sad partner…so feel free to get off your high horse as you don’t have that market cornered.

Wallowing in emotions is for children. We are discussing the issue of why this happened in a larger sense. That “bickering“ you describe might also be grown men looking for causes, solutions, and the like.

 

[MeatMissile]

Give your kids an extra hug.

 

[Centralcoastca]

Counter point: when we start having 30 to 80 typically male teenagers crashing cars into groups of school children we can work on those problems. If you say mental health is the problem (it is for sure A problem). You the have to ask why does the USA have so many more school shootings Vs other countries??? Is it that we have so much worse mental health problems? (Answer is No) is it because we have less secure schools? (Answer again is No) or is it because we are a gun loving country with easy access, low barriers to obtainment, and the same problems above that other countries have? (Ding ding ding we have a winner!!!!)

Saying guns are the problem may not be entirely right, but saying that guns are "not the problem" is equally false. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. . . But in countries with less guns, less people are killing other people with guns.

I'm not saying ban guns, I'm not saying enact more laws, but I am saying think critically on things, do serious research and recognize the facts involved in the case.

Then It boils down to one of two things, option A you want change and support some form of gun control. Option B, it's the cost of doing business. It sounds heartless when out that way, but that is what it is when your 2A rights are untouchable (again not saying they shouldn't be merely presenting the case for you the jury to decide).

More security might help, or might be the first one shot.

Those that want more monitoring of these people and their Facebook accounts are you good with red flag laws so cops can take their guns when there are "warning signs"???

It's a shitty world today, but this weekend most of us will bbq and forget about this while family's in Texas bury their 8 year olds.

I actually do think that we have a worse mental health problem here than a lot of countries. Cultures are very different around the world and our culture has definitely deteriorated. There’s a ton of little things that have changed so incrementally that all of the sudden todays America is almost unrecognizable to the days of my youth, and I’m not too old. More broken families and the ones that do stay together are usually separated by outside influences. I often see a family out and about, together physically but everyone is staring at a phone. People eating at a restaurant with their kids babysat by an iPad. My wife is a teacher and complains about how much basic parenting she has to do for a lot of the kids in her classes that she didn’t used to have to do. I have been to many peoples houses that are first generation from Mexico, Philippines, Japan, etc and they have a completely different dynamic. They are typically very involved in each other’s lives. They eat meals together, celebrate together, support each other, etc… That is not typical here. I do know a few families here and there that are like that, some Mormon friends and country ranch type people mostly, but unfortunately most people I know are not like that, my family included. Our culture has changed and not for the better. People don’t interact like they used to, they don’t look out for each other like they used to and are often so alienated and so far removed from reality that they do unthinkable things. Firearms are more controlled than ever and people secure them more than ever, when was the last time you saw a wood gun cabinet with a glass door in someone’s house? That used to be normal and somehow this type of thing wasn’t so prevalent. I can’t think of any friends or family that didn’t have some sort of firearm in the when I was younger, now I know several. Firearms are absolutely not easier to obtain, just a little before my time you could just order a gun from an ad in magazine and it’d show up at your house or go to most hardware stores or whatever and give the clerk cash and walk out with a gun. Ding ding I guess…now here in ca. you have to do all sorts of paperwork and even have to do a background check to buy ammo. Do messed up people still do things like shoot people? Yup. Did the tough gun laws stop them? Nope. Of course this is just my personal experience, but I know that many have had a similar experience. There is such an obvious change in people in my observation, especially over the last 20 or 30 years I’m always surprised when people pretend that it has to be something else.

 

[AkMtnRunner]

As long as the conversation is around simply keeping the 2nd Amendment vs banning guns, no solution will be found. Meanwhile pissed off, overmedicated, ill raised boys will walk in and buy whatever sexy gun they see in movies or the video games, without a proper firearms role model to teach them how to treat it.

Simply having the 2nd Amendment isn't enough. Gun safety needs to transcend throughout gun culture. If we don't control the solution, someone else will. And until then, there'll just be more PITA regulations making gun ownership painful and not actually helping keep anyone safe.

 

[HighUintas]

Thoughts and prayers for those poor children, children's families, officers, and officers' families, teachers, and teachers' families.

I'm not religious, but I feel compelled to do all of the above.

** Shame on you sick fucktards for politicizing, wining about liberal agendas, blahblahblah, when so many elementary children were murdered today.

 

[william schmaltz]

what the hell is wrong with some of you guys?

 

[Jmort1754]

what the hell is wrong with some of you guys?View attachment 414101

I'll tell you what, when is a good time to talk about it ? When they make a move to ban weapons? Thoughts and ******* prayers don't get us anywhere.

 

[Jmort1754]

Thoughts and prayers for those poor children, children's families, officers, and officers' families, teachers, and teachers' families.

I'm not religious, but I feel compelled to do all of the above.

** Shame on you sick fucktards for politicizing, wining about liberal agendas, blahblahblah, when so many elementary children were murdered today.

Shame on you guys for being to afraid to talk about bigger issues, you ******* people don't want to talk about the every day gun violence that occurs in our country. You want to use this oh you're sick you're this. Nothing says we don't feel the pain, however I'm not going to hang my head and think that thoughts and prayers are going to fix this problem

 

[chapman8523]

Mental health is never the focus, but the tool is to blame. The decay of decency, empathy, compassion, morals, values, community, etc is the root cause. People are numb to one another and the decline continues. I train on a routine basis to have the ability to protect my family and others around me. My heart goes out to the families involved in this tragic massacre.

 

[cnelk]

I worked and retired from a large school district.
Ever since Columbine, school security has been improved but not near like it should.

We put in security doors, cameras, re-arraigned main offices so there is only one point of contact upon entry.

Spent millions.

BUT.... here is the kicker....

Even with all this security at the main entrances, ANYONE, and mean ANYONE can walk up to an exterior classroom door during the day, and knock on it.

Guess what happens next.

Little Johnny jumps up from his desk and runs to the door and opens it.

Or...

The teacher props open the exterior classroom door [ latest thing they do is put a refrigerator magnet on the latch so there is always an open door]

So many ways to gain entry to a school... I could write a book

 

[452b264]

The secret service already has a full report out on how to stop school shootings with security. Its very similar to what Israel does for their schools and they dont have school shootings. We can send millions of dollars over seas every year but we can secure our schools and they what to pass more laws that will just be broken again and again.

 

[Rich M]

what the hell is wrong with some of you guys?View attachment 414101

Controlled by your emotions much? Fear much?

What did you do when that dude drove thru the parade? Jump on the bandwagon to ban cars?

This stuff always turns to gun control. They want to turn the entire country into Chicago, the poster child for gun control.

 

[Woodrow F Call]

it seems odd that so many are dead and no wounded or did I miss something.

Another thing is that all the people on this forum who do not carry daily every day/everywhere legal are part of the problem.

Not everyone is equipped to be a sheepdog. You should probably think about that a little. Kinda makes me wonder about you.

 

[Woodrow F Call]

I'll just leave this here to answer to your question.

While I agree mental health is important, our country, citizens, and elected officials like to talk about it, but not fund it.

Mental Health Care Was Severely Inequitable, Then Came the Coronavirus Crisis

COVID-19 has exposed the disparities in the U.S. mental health system, leaving many Americans without accessible and affordable care as policymakers fail to adequately address the crisis.

www.americanprogress.org

I've about come to the conclusion that our elected officials are honestly just too dumb or lazy to do the work we elect them for.... including treating the problem that creates a tragedy like this. They oversimplify and go for the easy visual that they are "trying" to do something about it..... when they really aren't.

Someone who would do something like this, there is something wrong with them.

 

[*zap*]

Not everyone is equipped to be a sheepdog. You should probably think about that a little. Kinda makes me wonder about you.

The people on this forum are not equipped to defend children? What a sad thought.

 

[98XJRC]

The truth of the matter is that politicians don't want to want to work together and truly solve the problem. We've seen it with every single issue that is polarizing to both sides of the isle. There is absolutely no compromise from either side. (Granted as a strong supporter of the 2nd amendment I don't believe we should be compromising any more.)

Our government has no issues spending millions of dollars at airports for TSA check in, the large banks have no issues spending millions of dollars on their own security force / system, professional sports teams spend millions on security throughout a season, politicians spend millions on private security. The majority of the security is proactive meaning that metal detectors are used and or gates / fences used to prevent unauthorized entry, however we are all also aware that there is a strong police / armed presence at all of these venues as a reactionary force. Yet as a society we expose the weakest of us with little to no regard for their actual security. When new schools are being built why is security not one of the largest factor's in it's design. The answer is simple, it's not sexy and won't win awards or be appealing to the eye. It's sad to think, but it's coming up on 11 years from Sandy Hook. Can anyone say we've seen an actual increase in security in our schools. Particularly the elementary schools? I know that I haven't and the "security" is laughable in my school district.

Many of us use some sort of security system in our homes, have firearms, and lock our doors (I get it location dependent) to keep those inside safe and keep out or at least slow down any unwanted threats from the outside. I get it we don't want our children to feel as though they are in a prison while in school, however at this point in time is there truly any faster/safer option available then actually hardening the schools and making them a more difficult target? Replacing exterior glass windows with bullet proof and or have grids / bars installed to prevent any access if the glass is broken out provides a significant advantage over what we currently have in place.

As a father of 4 elementary age kids I'm sickened by this bastard's choices. I also knew immediately what the average response would be from the current group of politicians before they even spoke. Unfortunately events like this get votes due to most humans being emotional beings and not thinking logically through all of their choices.

 

[Farmingdale's Finest]

I was just watching the news and the kid shot his was past two armed guards at a gate by the road. He then got into the school which they didn't give details but he ran into a classroom and barricaded himself in it with kids and a teacher. At that point the school guards evacuated the rest of the school waiting for back up and he killed those in the classroom. Absolutely sickening.

He bought the guns legally earlier this month after he turned 18. Both a handgun and an Ar 15. He had no record, no apparent mental issues although they are looking deeper on it, and no gang affiliations. This seems to be a case that would justify the raising of the purchasing age from 18-21. Most states to my knowledge already have handguns at 21 but not Texas. We also need to be able to know about mental health issues. I am not talking about a universal background check and I understand the issues with HIPPA laws but we need to figure this part out and now! I fear for my daughter daily who is a special ed teacher. She has a kid in one of her classes that beat up another teacher in the classroom next to hers. When she and the kids heard what went on she had to lockdown her class and get them away from the door. She was visibly shaken that day. The teacher beaten by the kid went to the hospital and got stitches to her face and the kid wasn't expelled. My daughter is now looking to leave being a teacher and that's a shame because she loved it and was nominated to be teacher of the year. With a situation like this everyone loses out.

I am very much pro 2A but don't own any guns. I sold my shotgun 30 years ago because I preferred bowhunting. It hasn't handicapped me since I have killed about 150 deer in my lifetime and only one with a firearm.

 

[Eltigreblanco]

We’re all sad partner…so feel free to get off your high horse as you don’t have that market cornered.

Wallowing in emotions is for children. We are discussing the issue of why this happened in a larger sense. That “bickering“ you describe might also be grown men looking for causes, solutions, and the like.

If isis had bombed a super market last week, and a school this week I'm sure your reaction would be different, but since this is a domestic act I guess its not that big of a deal. If the murder of our children doesn't make you emotional I'm not sure what would.

 

[swavescatter]

I’m not a democrat, or a Republican. I refuse to subscribe to any corporate platform telling me how to believe on each individual issue.

We can all agree that mass shootings happen too often, correct? Gun violence is way too high, undeniably. I just can’t wrap my head around the arguments that the solution is MORE GUNS to solve gun violence.

I’m a gun nut myself. Assault rifles, high capacity handguns, suppressors, hunting rifles, etc. I love them. They’re awesome. However, I’m fine admitting they were all to easy to buy. I should be allowed to purchase them, but I’d be fine with stricter background checks, cool off periods, mental health evaluations, increased liability should my guns be used to commit crimes. Force gun owners and sellers to be better.

As a father with school age children, I don’t think turning each school into a super max prison facility is a feasible solution.

We also need better monitoring of mentally ill. We need increased prosecution of criminals. The media has a role here as copycats are too common. No silver bullet solution.

But due to ignorant red team/blue team paralysis, comprehensive solutions are impossible.