Taking Equity out of Home OP spoke to me - now, me too!

[ericthered]

Hopefully your daughters don't start family's in the mean time.

Now that is funny….my oldest who
I’m taking to BC next year was worried about that. I told her not to screw this hunt up! The other two are still trolling….

 

[mattflipper]

Another opinion here since so many others have thrown in on this.

Not that my stamp of approval makes a difference, but I say go for it.

So long as you’ve planned accordingly in your overall financial plan for this who cares. Maybe you work for an extra year, or shift priorities in regards to other hobbies/vacations. If you wait until you can pay for it, that may never come. Kind of similar to “waiting until you can afford to have a child”, I’ve got two and still feel ill prepared at times. No point in saving a mountain of money until you’re too old to use it. I see this all the time with clients and have with family as well. Dying with residual wealth is useless, except your children will have more to waste. Hopefully your children are well on their way and don’t need the transfer of wealth from you.

I’ve traveled and seen some amazing places and have been able to do some really cool things in life. I’m thankful for them all. But in the end, some of my top memories are those from hunting trips with my daughter. They are experiences that are truly once in a lifetime and worth every penny. Other vacations have been amazing but hunting is something that we both love and is certinaly different than a beach vacation, trip to Disney, cruise or cross country family vacay.

In the end the short answer is your hunts will just cost more than someone else’s. You’ve got origination fees and interest costs added to the base price. As long as that’s worth it to you then what’s the difference? Some say that anything more than a DIY hunt done with anything more than $200 of gear and a the tag cost is too much. Others spend $35k for a NWT sheep hunt and don’t look back. The only difference is who is paying for it. It’s easy for some who have access to some of the “dream hunts” in their backyard to be against this. I’m not that fortunate either. We’ve got great hunting and great fishing nearby but no killing a caribou, sheep, moose, elk, etc without a significant cost, time away from family and steep learning curve therefore I’m in the same boat as you. I haven’t refinanced the house but I’ve likely paid for a hunt before making an extra two house payments each year or dumping an extra 20k into a brokerage account each year.

Wealth is all relative. As others have chimed in who are in the financial industry so am I. I’m a practicing CPA who has made some irresponsible decisions in life but one who has more than enough memories to offset them. Sure, make sure you’ve got all of the boxes checked with disability, emergency fund, life insurance and your 401k but what’s the point in working yourself to death only to hunt and enjoy what’s in your backyard. Enjoy what you can as soon as you can. When you’re in a nursing home or your family is too busy to go on trips with you it’ll all be worth it.

 

[IDVortex]

Life insurance in place to ensure everything is paid off should I fall off a cliff or get eaten buy a bear.

another thought…most guys whitetail hunting climbing in trees will have more claims per hunter than adventurer hunters who are cared for by a guide.

Sounds like Osha needs to get involved, for hunter safety of course.

 

[SDHNTR]

Not trying to split hairs here but want to clarify your last paragraph.

Do you think that you should be 100% debt free (including a mortgage) and have a retirement fully funded to go on any sort of luxury or discretionary trip?


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No, not necessarily, but you should certainly have a plan and be on track to accomplish your goals laid out in that plan before spending extravagantly. For example, say you want to retire at 65, with a 120k standard of living. To do that successfully, you need to know how much to save each year to do so. Say you’ve done the planning and found you need to max out your 401k and save/invest an additional $20k per year in non qualified accounts. Once that’s done and satisfied for the year, or is solidly on track to be satisfied through automatic contributions, then you get to spend. Until then you don’t. And you also don’t get to spend if doing so now prevents you from saving sufficiently in future years. And if you’re guessing at how much you should be saving/spending, you’re doing it wrong and shouldn’t be spending until you’ve done the proper planning.

And as for the mortgage, assuming the rate is reasonable and you are current, no you don’t need to wait until it’s paid off, but don’t go pulling equity to fund your fun either. If you have credit card debt, nope, no fun soup for you. Sorry, your every extra dollar needs to go to satisfying that debt before all other discretionary purchases.

 

[schmalzy]

No, not necessarily, but you should certainly have a plan and be on track to accomplish your goals laid out in that plan before spending extravagantly. For example, say you want to retire at 65, with a 120k standard of living. To do that successfully, you need to know how much to save each year to do so. Say you’ve done the planning and found you need to max out your 401k and save/invest an additional $20k per year in non qualified accounts. Once that’s done and satisfied, or is solidly on track to be satisfied through automatic contributions, then you get to spend. Until then you don’t. And you also don’t get to spend if doing so now prevents you from saving sufficiently in future years. And if you’re guessing and how much you should be saving/spending, you’re doing it wrong and shouldn’t be spending until you’ve done the proper planning.

Thanks for the clarification.


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[BRTreedogs]

Good luck on your hunts man.

If I were you I'd close this thread and do your thing.

It doesn't matter what a bunch people on a forum think any ways.

In the end you just got to do what you think is best for you and your family.

 

[IDVortex]

Good luck on your hunts man.

If I were you I'd close this thread and do your thing.

It doesn't matter what a bunch people on a forum think any ways.

In the end you just got to do what you think is best for you and your family.

At the end of the day, someone will always hate on what you do when it comes to your money or finances. No 2 people will agree on how money should be spent, and more importantly, what's important to them.

 

[BRTreedogs]

At the end of the day, someone will always hate on what you do when it comes to your money or finances. No 2 people will agree on how money should be spent, and more importantly, what's important to them.

Not if you don't ever tell anyone.

 

[5MilesBack]

Following the debt free approach to adventure hunting will leave most people with YouTube memories.

Well, a lot of folks won't like to hear this, but if you want to hear the "bottom line", here it is. And it is what it is, regardless what you believe it is. Everything we have belongs to God. He demands 10% of the "first fruits" in our tithe, but it's all (100%) still His. We are just stewards of what He blesses us with, and we all eventually have to answer to Him. So if you believe that taking on even more debt to fund adventure hunts is being a good steward.......well, that's for you to decide and answer for. It doesn't really matter what "we" think.

 

[ihookem]

Firmly agree 100%.

I’m definitely in the don’t extend yourself camp and that you and your family all have to be on same page. But I don’t think waiting until you’re 100% debt free is necessarily the answer for everyone either.

Only thing I know is tomorrow isn’t guaranteed and you can be gone in an instant. Make good choices and plan for the future, but don’t miss out on living life.


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I will guarantee , I will be here tomorrow, and tomorrow I guarantee I will be here the next day. I will do this every day , and only be wrong once. Kidding aside, you are right. Ya have to live a little. If you need to take a home loan for a hunt, you can't afford the hunt. Many hunts are very cheap . I can go to Minnesota to hunt bear for about $2,000 total cost. I can hunt New York and stay with my uncle, for just a few hundred bucks for a deer hunt. However it is not much different than Wisconsin. I could go out west for deer for $2,000? maybe $3,000, but we are talking about $20,000 hunts here right?

 

[ericthered]

I will guarantee , I will be here tomorrow, and tomorrow I guarantee I will be here the next day. I will do this every day , and only be wrong once. Kidding aside, you are right. Ya have to live a little. If you need to take a home loan for a hunt, you can't afford the hunt. Many hunts are very cheap . I can go to Minnesota to hunt bear for about $2,000 total cost. I can hunt New York and stay with my uncle, for just a few hundred bucks for a deer hunt. However it is not much different than Wisconsin. I could go out west for deer for $2,000? maybe $3,000, but we are talking about $20,000 hunts here right?

The same standard should be applied to car loans, second homes, etc. while I disagree with your position, thank you for making the point.

 

[Andrew12gauge]

The NWT Dall’s sheep hunt will be pushing a $100k five years from now. If you put your deposit down 5 years from now and then actually go 2 years from then….inflation.

No it won’t, you’re just telling yourself that to make yourself feel better about a poor financial decision. A NWT Dall sheep hunt can be had today for $50,000, 20 years ago it was about $20,000, 5 years ago it was about $35,000, I’m guessing 5 years from now it will be $65-75k.


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[MuleyFever]

No it won’t, you’re just telling yourself that to make yourself feel better about a poor financial decision. A NWT Dall sheep hunt can be had today for $50,000, 20 years ago it was about $20,000, 5 years ago it was about $35,000, I’m guessing 5 years from now it will be $65-75k.


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If you borrowed $50K today on a 10 year term at 6% and made a $1000 a month payment you would have it paid off in about 5 years. You will have paid about $57k for the hunt. So, you can book and pay for the hunt now with borrowed money and pay $57K or save up and pay $65K. Not sure that borrowing the money is such a poor financial decision.

 

[Doc Holliday]

If you borrowed $50K today on a 10 year term at 6% and made a $1000 a month payment you would have it paid off in about 5 years. You will have paid about $57k for the hunt. So, you can book and pay for the hunt now with borrowed money and pay $57K or save up and pay $65K. Not sure that borrowing the money is such a poor financial decision.

Dont let facts get into the way of people presenting themselves as financial authorities. What I find most entertaining is the average financial advisor or CFP is busy working, especially the ones who have time to lurk on forums and beat a dead horse. If they were such wizards, they would be off on a yacht somewhere being fed grapes and fanned with a feather.

 

[Cactus kid]

Well, a lot of folks won't like to hear this, but if you want to hear the "bottom line", here it is. And it is what it is, regardless what you believe it is. Everything we have belongs to God. He demands 10% of the "first fruits" in our tithe, but it's all (100%) still His. We are just stewards of what He blesses us with, and we all eventually have to answer to Him. So if you believe that taking on even more debt to fund adventure hunts is being a good steward.......well, that's for you to decide and answer for. It doesn't really matter what "we" think.

I think the teaching of financial guru Dave Ramsey is very similar to this. A favorite quote of Dave’s is from Proverbs: “The borrower is slave to the lender.”

My favorite fact about Dave Ramsey is he has declared bankruptcy more times than I have and has zero sheep to show for it.

 

[SDHNTR]

If you borrowed $50K today on a 10 year term at 6% and made a $1000 a month payment you would have it paid off in about 5 years. You will have paid about $57k for the hunt. So, you can book and pay for the hunt now with borrowed money and pay $57K or save up and pay $65K. Not sure that borrowing the money is such a poor financial decision.

You aren’t getting a 10 yr loan at 6%.

 

[SDHNTR]

Dont let facts get into the way of people presenting themselves as financial authorities. What I find most entertaining is the average financial advisor or CFP is busy working, especially the ones who have time to lurk on forums and beat a dead horse. If they were such wizards, they would be off on a yacht somewhere being fed grapes and fanned with a feather.

Metaphorically speaking, the successful ones pretty much do.

 

[isItFallYet]

OP, have you considered a loan from your 401k? Pay yourself the interest. I have no opinion regarding your financial situation, and wouldn’t provide it anyway, but I do think the experiences with your kids would be invaluable. Sounds like they’re fully grown and don’t rely on you financially. I’ve let my kids know that they should not expect anything from me when I die.

 

[MuleyFever]

You aren’t getting a 10 yr loan at 6%.

I saw rates under 7 online but you are probably correct. I guess there will be fees as well. So you would probably pay the same or maybe save a few grand at most. You would just get to go a couple years earlier and if health or age was a concern that may be a big benefit. Still doesn't look like much of a poor financial decision in this example. The OP isn't going sheep hunting though so their scenarios may not look the same.

 

[SDHNTR]

Loan or not (and yes loan makes matters worse) I think the better question here is should most people be paying $50k to hunt anything in the first place. In the vast majority of circumstances, probably not.