SilencerCo Scythe Ti failures

[just.mark]

Since this thread went very engineering-heavy for a bit, I propose a question for discussion. Does utilizing a muzzle brake attachment system possibly uniquely add stress to portions of a can that a direct thread would not? I have no idea but I am curious if perhaps there is some kind of external contributor to the failures.

 

[JF_Idaho]

They issued recall for the hybrid, omega and harvesters for weld issues so it doesn't seem like they would be gun shy on issuing one for the scythe.

 

[Termin8R]

If you’ve experienced catastrophic failure of the Scythe Ti, please post the following:

1. Cartridge or cartridges used with approximate round count

2. Barrel length

3. Factory ammo, hand loads or both

4. Details of ammunition

5. Details of failure (to include failure point and pics)

If you’ve experienced catastrophic failure of the Scythe Ti, please post the following:

1. Cartridge or cartridges used with approximate round count

2. Barrel length

3. Factory ammo, hand loads or both

4. Details of ammunition

5. Details of failure (to include failure point and pics)

I voted no but mine is low round count and only being used on two rifles. About 60 rounds on each rifle. If I have a failure I will report back.

1. Custom 6.5CM with 26 inch barrel.
Shooting factory Hornady 140grn ELDM.

2. Custom 7PRC with 26 inch barrel.
Shooting factory Hornady 175grn ELDX.

I see claims on this thread of a 10% failure rate with some heavy bashing. I think 10% is wildly inaccurate. This poll doesn’t even have 200 votes and silencer co is selling thousands of these a month.

 

[BjornF16]

I see claims on this thread of a 10% failure rate with some heavy bashing. I think 10% is wildly inaccurate. This poll doesn’t even have 200 votes and silencer co is selling thousands of these a month.

No one is claiming this is a scientific poll.

I started this thread primarily to try and capture catastrophic failure conditions/history to see if there was a common theme. There was another thread with enough bashing noise that is was difficult to find the failures.

Of course, I still have people getting into this thread that aren't really contributing to my original intent bashing one side or another.

I will say that I've heard of more Scythe Ti failures than any other suppressor

 

[Tahoe1305]

Yeah I agree I think most saying 10% are discussing the stats of this thread and most will agree it is likely less outside of this group. Doesn’t matter, still a high number when potential injuries exist.

Maybe I’ve missed it too but I don’t see any bashing. Out of most of the RS threads this has stayed fairly civil. Folks are frustrated by the failures but SiCo has been great fixing them. I do think folks are frustrated that they won’t admit there’s an issue but that’s probably it.

 

[Termin8R]

No one is claiming this is a scientific poll.

I started this thread primarily to try and capture catastrophic failure conditions/history to see if there was a common theme. There was another thread with enough bashing noise that is was difficult to find the failures.

Of course, I still have people getting into this thread that aren't really contributing to my original intent bashing one side or another.

I will say that I've heard of more Scythe Ti failures than any other suppressor

Yeah I agree I think most saying 10% are discussing the stats of this thread and most will agree it is likely less outside of this group. Doesn’t matter, still a high number when potential injuries exist.

Maybe I’ve missed it too but I don’t see any bashing. Out of most of the RS threads this has stayed fairly civil. Folks are frustrated by the failures but SiCo has been great fixing them. I do think folks are frustrated that they won’t admit there’s an issue but that’s probably it.

I think the original post is useful to track issues with the Scythe design and manufacturing. I went through a few pages where people were hung up on 10% failures but that's only the small group of owners that are on this forum or found it by google search. In reality they are manufacturing and shipping thousands of these on a regular basis and the reported failures I've seen are probably less than 1% but like you said even one failure is potentially extremely dangerous. Silencer co has issued several recalls in the past so I would think they would do the same for this model if needed.

 

[mtwarden]

but like you said even one failure is potentially extremely dangerous. Silencer co has issued several recalls in the past so I would think they would do the same for this model if needed.

The gist of it is they haven’t.

They haven’t even updated their recommendations on what calibers/barrel lengths are appropriate for the can.

They’re replacing them, but I don’t think they have a lot of choice not to.

If it’s relegated to a small lot, get those out of the hands of guys that have them.

If it’s beyond that, fix the problem and get them all replaced.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

The gist of it is they haven’t.

The lack or reply affects customer confidence.

Folks don't know if its:
-barrel length restrictions are needed
-a manufacturing issue that can be fixed / was a lot of manufacturing
-a design issue

The manufacturer accusing folks of misuse as a reply just adds to the customer confidence issue at the moment. The issue can be resolved but a statement clarifying one of the above (or other) issues is in play, but you can't just blame customers when too many folks know that is just deflection.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

For what it’s worth, I am not bashing SiCo in any of my posts. I am simply baffled by their apparent non-response to this issue. All I can assume is that they have a cost benefit analysis that the cost of a recall exceeds the costs of potential lawsuits.

I’m still reasonably confident that my Scythe won’t blow up on my 20” 6.5 Grendel bolt action. I just got my barrel back from PAC-NOR, so I will be trying it out in the next couple of weeks.


____________________
“Keep on keepin’ on…”

 

[1000yards]

I've been thinking about this the past several days and I'm not an expert in any of this but I just haven't seen it mentioned yet in the thread. The possibility of serious injury is very real, and I believe plenty of people here know exactly what I'm talking about. At the same time, it seems like when a scythe comes undone and becomes part of the recoil equation, it shouldn't kick as much as something like an omega 300 which weighs almost double. "Shouldn't". I believe the lesson here is that suppressors will always be an added complication to a firearm, and should be treated as such. Proper technique is mandatory, and eye and ear protection should still be encouraged. That is a comment on personal responsibility, not the manufacturers responsibility. Read that last sentence as many times as you need to.


Another thought. I think focusing on cartridge pressure and barrel length doesn't tell the full story. The actual load data must also be very important. For example, a 308 shooting a light bullet with quick burning powder should only need about 20 in of barrel to burn most of that powder, which should mean that suppressor isn't taking a very hard hit. Compare that to a 7mm RUM with a heavy bullet and slow burning powder, and that combination may need 26 in or more of barrel to burn up most of that powder. Add all of that to an 18 in barrel with a suppressor at the end, and that suppressor must be taking a massive hit. I imagine it becomes like a secondary combustion chamber. What do you all think?

 

[5811]

I've been thinking about this the past several days and I'm not an expert in any of this but I just haven't seen it mentioned yet in the thread. The possibility of serious injury is very real, and I believe plenty of people here know exactly what I'm talking about. At the same time, it seems like when a scythe comes undone and becomes part of the recoil equation, it shouldn't kick as much as something like an omega 300 which weighs almost double.

How are you comparing the velocities of an omega 300 projectile vs a scythe projectile?

 

[1000yards]

How are you comparing the velocities of an omega 300 projectile vs a scythe projectile?

I am nowhere near smart enough to do that sort of math. But I'm just guessing, that all else being equal (cartridge, barrel length, bullet powder combo, rifle weight) that when the front half of a scythe ti breaks away and becomes part of the recoil equation, that recoil shouldn't be as much as the same thing happening with an omega 300, because of the weight difference between the two. And this may explain why we haven't seen any real serious injuries with these scythe failures (yet).

 

[BradArnett]

I've around 600 rnds on mine so far with no issues yet. It's been on a 21" 6.5cm, 16" and 22" 223, and a 7.5" 300blk with subsonics. FWIW my sn is 128xx.

 

[5811]

I am nowhere near smart enough to do that sort of math. But I'm just guessing, that all else being equal (cartridge, barrel length, bullet powder combo, rifle weight) that when the front half of a scythe ti breaks away and becomes part of the recoil equation, that recoil shouldn't be as much as the same thing happening with an omega 300, because of the weight difference between the two. And this may explain why we haven't seen any real serious injuries with these scythe failures (yet).

I was just pointing out that velocity of said weight is part of the deal. The scythe may be lighter, but it might also go faster/further.

 

[1000yards]

I was just pointing out that velocity of said weight is part of the deal. The scythe may be lighter, but it might also go faster/further.

Maybe, but I don't see it. Go punch a bowling ball and a volleyball with the same force. Does the bowling ball hurt your hand less because it's moving slower after the punch?

 

[Lawnboi]

I’d be curious to hear from someone actually testing pressure to measure the muzzle pressure of a round loaded to 80k psi and 60k psi and see how they differ.

You would think that would be something easy to test for by a manufacturer

 

[The Harbor Master]

Hadn't thought of this. That's a good question. Might be worth having those with failures add if they have it on some sort of QD muzzle brake system.

 

[The Harbor Master]

Forgot quote

Since this thread went very engineering-heavy for a bit, I propose a question for discussion. Does utilizing a muzzle brake attachment system possibly uniquely add stress to portions of a can that a direct thread would not? I have no idea but I am curious if perhaps there is some kind of external contributor to the failures.