Senate vote public lands sale

[JGood]

What is the communist position, that the land goes to private hands or that the federal government retains ownership for the collective?

The way it was proposed in HR.1 was a no bid allotment of land and mineral rights to private sector players, not a free market sale.

Right now, you own the land and have a say in how it is managed by electing officials in your state. They can’t sell it, they just get to manage it. Worst case scenario they bugger up your hunting spot for a decade or so.

The communist position is to transfer your current rights over the land and re-distribute land to developers at discounted prices. They will in turn offer lower priced housing and major employers in the region can continue to pay low wages.

Low Cost Housing is just a fancy way of saying Government Subsidy to Employers.

This is not a conspiracy theory. This is what I do professionally for work.

It’s called “picking winners and losers” in Free Market Theory.

 

[Gila]

I wish it were different but this mammoth bill is about making the tax cuts permanent. That is where the tariffs come into play also. The Republicans aren’t doing anymore town halls until the Bill is passed. Maybe not even then. The Republican Senators will vote for this Bill, dirty laundry and all. I hate politics I really do. Hunting, fishing and trapping opportunity has always been bi-partisan up until recently. Every American has had bad politics shoved in their faces from both sides of the isle.

 

[Poser]

Thune is eager to get this bill pushed through "as is"

 

[chanson_roland]

I wish it were different but this mammoth bill is about making the tax cuts permanent. That is where the tariffs come into play also. The Republicans aren’t doing anymore town halls until the Bill is passed. Maybe not even then. The Republican Senators will vote for this Bill, dirty laundry and all. I hate politics I really do. Hunting, fishing and trapping opportunity has always been bi-partisan up until recently. Every American has had bad politics shoved in their faces from both sides of the isle.

This. Republican Senate/House leadership is focused on delivering the tax cuts, because that's what the big donors paid for. Selling public land as the "offset" is their rationale. Hence, they aren't going to bend over backwards to avoid public land sales because protecting the land isn't their motivation; it's providing cover for the permanent tax cuts.

I think Newberg's report saying that Zinke might work to limit the initial damage to just Utah is a best case scenario.

 

[307]

I think Newberg's report saying that Zinke might work to limit the initial damage to just Utah is a best case scenario.

So we're selling Utah? I'm betting on the LDS Church.

Will anything change?

I'd vote for it.

 

[chanson_roland]

So we're selling Utah to the LDS church?

Will anything change?

Mike Lee has become the "face" of the public land sales. So, I could see a number of the GOP House/Senate members put him in the limelight to take all the public heat, and put Utah at the top of the list to begin land sales. That gives the rest of them time to cut side deals to try to preserve land in their own states, and not get buried by their own constituents.

 

[TheTone]

Build a big stupid beautiful wall around Utah for all I care if that will make Lee and others like him happy. Then highly restrict travel out of it

 

[RyanT26]

My appeal is falling on deaf ears in KS...just got this from one of my state Senators...

President Trump’s One Big, Beautiful Bill Will Give American Families More Support to Thrive​

My colleagues and I in Congress are working hard to deliver on President Trump’s promises to the American people – preventing the largest tax increase in American history, securing our southern border, and reining in spending.

With the passage of the President’s One Big, Beautiful Bill (OBBB), we will provide American families with unprecedented support and resources to thrive.

First, it will prevent the largest tax increase in American history by making the Trump tax cuts permanent – American families will save $1,000 per month.

It will increase the child tax credit to $2,200 per American family, providing significant financial relief to parents. If Congress fails to act, however, the current rate of $2,000 will be cut in half to $1,000, harming the ability of parents to cover essential expenses like education, healthcare, and extracurricular activities. We cannot fail – our kids are counting on us.

For newborns, we are going to create Trump Savings, establishing a dedicated savings mechanism to give every child a financial head start that will encourage long-term investment and savings. When it’s time for college, trade school, home ownership, or starting their own family, these accounts will provide a much-needed boost.

We’re also going to extend and improve the paid family and medical leave tax credit so that small businesses can continue to provide paid leave to their workers.

The OBBB will also tackle the issue of access to childcare for hardworking American families. The budget will increase funding and availability of quality childcare options, particularly for single mothers and low-income households, by reducing childcare costs and enabling them to pursue career opportunities without sacrificing family needs.

Lastly, we’re going to strengthen and preserve SNAP for the families that rely on it most. This starts with eliminating blue-state efforts to abuse the program by manipulating SNAP payments and incentivizing them to play by the rules set by the federal government. We will also implement work requirements so that SNAP benefits are directed to those truly in need and promote self-sufficiency among able-bodied recipients in order to reduce participation in the program for the long run.

By passing the President’s ‘One Big, Beautiful Bill,’ we will not just build strong families and encourage responsibility – we will uplift communities, while also protecting and stewarding taxpayer resources.

Now that’s what I call good tax policy.

-Senator Doc Marshall

I am regretting voting for Marshall, seems to get more Dbag’ie every year.

 

[TheTone]

My appeal is falling on deaf ears in KS...just got this from one of my state Senators...

President Trump’s One Big, Beautiful Bill Will Give American Families More Support to Thrive​

My colleagues and I in Congress are working hard to deliver on President Trump’s promises to the American people – preventing the largest tax increase in American history, securing our southern border, and reining in spending.

With the passage of the President’s One Big, Beautiful Bill (OBBB), we will provide American families with unprecedented support and resources to thrive.

First, it will prevent the largest tax increase in American history by making the Trump tax cuts permanent – American families will save $1,000 per month.

It will increase the child tax credit to $2,200 per American family, providing significant financial relief to parents. If Congress fails to act, however, the current rate of $2,000 will be cut in half to $1,000, harming the ability of parents to cover essential expenses like education, healthcare, and extracurricular activities. We cannot fail – our kids are counting on us.

For newborns, we are going to create Trump Savings, establishing a dedicated savings mechanism to give every child a financial head start that will encourage long-term investment and savings. When it’s time for college, trade school, home ownership, or starting their own family, these accounts will provide a much-needed boost.

We’re also going to extend and improve the paid family and medical leave tax credit so that small businesses can continue to provide paid leave to their workers.

The OBBB will also tackle the issue of access to childcare for hardworking American families. The budget will increase funding and availability of quality childcare options, particularly for single mothers and low-income households, by reducing childcare costs and enabling them to pursue career opportunities without sacrificing family needs.

Lastly, we’re going to strengthen and preserve SNAP for the families that rely on it most. This starts with eliminating blue-state efforts to abuse the program by manipulating SNAP payments and incentivizing them to play by the rules set by the federal government. We will also implement work requirements so that SNAP benefits are directed to those truly in need and promote self-sufficiency among able-bodied recipients in order to reduce participation in the program for the long run.

By passing the President’s ‘One Big, Beautiful Bill,’ we will not just build strong families and encourage responsibility – we will uplift communities, while also protecting and stewarding taxpayer resources.

Now that’s what I call good tax policy.

-Senator Doc Marshall

I think they call that a bought and sold politicians that cares way more about being loyal to the party that having thoughts of their own or caring about actual constituents

 

[mostlybirch]

I called Murkowski and Sullivan, waiting on office hours to call our Rep. Begich. Begich will vote for whatever the party wants, but will try anyways.

Sullivan said in April regarding selling public lands : "I think it's a great idea. We're looking at different options for revenue raising. The federal government owns a lot of lands—a lot of lands". He also suggested that some lands around national parks could be sold to build housing for National Park Service employees.

 

[Wrench]

We do need keep perspective on what 3M acres looks like. There's 1.5M in the colville NF alone. There's 63M in Nevada. 32M acres in Idaho, 640M in the country......etc.

3M sounds huge, but with fringe communities, landlocked pieces....etc, this may not be nearly as bad as it sounds. It amounts to .47% of federal lands.

 

[Pulleye16]

If you lived in MN, they just give it to the native Americans for free.

 

[NDGuy]

We do need keep perspective on what 3M acres looks like. There's 1.5M in the colville NF alone. There's 63M in Nevada. 32M acres in Idaho, 640M in the country......etc.

3M sounds huge, but with fringe communities, landlocked pieces....etc, this may not be nearly as bad as it sounds. It amounts to .47% of federal lands.

Give an inch they take a mile

 

[Wrench]

Give an inch they take a mile

I'm far from arguing.....but painting it as the sky is falling when they sell a office in boise or a .3 acre piece that's landlocked isn't the same as wiping out the winter range in Nevada.

 

[mtwarden]

So at one point does a person sound the alarm and take action. Obviously it’s not 3 million acres, 6 million acres? 9 million acres?

Those are just drops in the bucket, nothing at all to worry about

 

[Ten Bears]

Just a year ago 31 Million acres of BLM was selected for wind and solar from the previous administration.

There was literally zero fuss about it. If this 3 Million acres was being used for the same would everyone feel the same ?

I don’t want either to happen. But it’s hard to not feel like this only matters when certain politics are involved.

And I get it. Once it’s sold it’s gone forever. But once solar and wind cover it the land is destroyed along with certain plants and wildlife.

 

[Ozarkansas]

Just a year ago 31 Million acres of BLM was selected for wind and solar from the previous administration.

There was literally zero fuss about it. If this 3 Million acres was being used for the same would everyone feel the same ?

I don’t want either to happen. But it’s hard to not feel like this only matters when certain politics are involved.

And I get it. Once it’s sold it’s gone forever. But once solar and wind cover it the land is destroyed along with certain plants and wildlife.

“Literally zero fuss”? There was a ton of concern over that, both on this forum and in the hunting community at large. I definitely agree that it only matters when certain politics are involved, I’ve gotten accused of TDS and fear mongering plenty of times even when it’s been obvious that this was going to happen.

And no, I wouldn’t be as concerned if the proposal was to develop 3 million acres for energy. That doesn’t mean I’d support it, and depending on the locations they picked I might fight it just as hard as this issue. But an energy lease is fundamentally different than a land sale, particularly when the land sale is to “balance the budget” in a bill that just increases the deficit.
Once they’ve introduced the mechanism for selling public land to offset government spending, do you really think they’ll stop?

 

[Ten Bears]

“Literally zero fuss”? There was a ton of concern over that, both on this forum and in the hunting community at large. I definitely agree that it only matters when certain politics are involved, I’ve gotten accused of TDS and fear mongering plenty of times even when it’s been obvious that this was going to happen.

And no, I wouldn’t be as concerned if the proposal was to develop 3 million acres for energy. That doesn’t mean I’d support it, and depending on the locations they picked I might fight it just as hard as this issue. But an energy lease is fundamentally different than a land sale, particularly when the land sale is to “balance the budget” in a bill that just increases the deficit.
Once they’ve introduced the mechanism for selling public land to offset government spending, do you really think they’ll stop?

There most definitely wasn’t this kind of response. not even close.

And you’re right. Mike Lee and dudes like him are never going to stop. And it’s great that everyone is trying to push back.

Solar and wind destroy the resource. Period.

Hopefully when we lose a gun right, have another administration appoint people that want to give land back to “natives”, lose another hunting season, trapping right, etc the exact same spirit and effort will take place. But from what I have seen here the volume will not match.

 

[Gila]

Just a year ago 31 Million acres of BLM was selected for wind and solar from the previous administration.

There was literally zero fuss about it. If this 3 Million acres was being used for the same would everyone feel the same ?

I don’t want either to happen. But it’s hard to not feel like this only matters when certain politics are involved.

And I get it. Once it’s sold it’s gone forever. But once solar and wind cover it the land is destroyed along with certain plants and wildlife.

If you zoom into the map of land that could be for sale, you will find large parcels of NFS and BLM land that borders wind and solar farms. It could be more like 120 million acres that could be sold off within five years. Remember that the President has executive authority to rescind National Monuments. He is doing just that and then selling off the land. The is just an example of how he intends to “side step” the exceptions. Sen Lee’s land sale provision completely ignores any regulatory oversight provided by FLPMA. It’s a nutshell game! I highly recommend everyone listen to the “Your Mountain” podcast on the subject. Those guys are experts on public land hunting. What they have to say about this fiasco is jaw dropping!

 

[Ten Bears]

If you zoom into the map of land that could be for sale, you will find large parcels of NFS and BLM land that borders wind and solar farms. It could be more like 120 million acres that could be sold off within five years. Remember that the President has executive authority to rescind National Monuments. He is doing just that and then selling off the land. The is just an example of how he intends to “side step” the exceptions. Sen Lee’s land sale provision completely ignores any regulatory oversight provided by FLPMA. It’s a nutshell game! I highly recommend everyone listen to the “Your Mountain” podcast on the subject. Those guys are experts on public land hunting. What they have to say about this fiasco is jaw dropping!

We are on the same team on this one. Even though the histrionics involved in your posts make me skeptical at times.

I fully expect your help and same conviction when the pendulum swings and what we experience as hunters under a different regime starts up.