Proof Research is offering 7BC pre-fits for Tikka actions

[Marshfly]

So zero additional pressure. As I figured.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

So zero additional pressure. As I figured.

Force.

Case holds pressure (higher in this case) and exerts forces into the action.

 

[Jaegerr]

There ya go. That’d be valid in a lawsuit of the action fails so they seem confident.


Step 2 is if someone can figure out how to resize the steel case effectively/reliably for reloading it.

Apparently RCBS is trying but it took them something like 12 times to get it to re-size... I'm not sure If I want to be the financial guinea pig for 7BC, but I'm extremely interested in the technology and performance out of shorter barrels. Imagine taking your favorite cartridge and swapping the case and running 100-150fps faster from the same action and barrel in the future, that seems like a great market in my opinion.

My distaste for Vista outdoors ammunition brands selling to CSG, which includes federal, is a whole other topic on whether I want to support Federal specifically, but that's a conversation for another day. They got our good 250 primers though lol

 

[MuleyFever]

The steel case design is going to grow to many other cartridges. The vast majority of shooters do not reload. The marketing will be huge and people will love it.

 

[5811]

It's too bad the proof offering is 20" - I thought the allure of 7bc was 20" performance in 16"?

 

[Marshfly]

Force.

Case holds pressure (higher in this case) and exerts forces into the action.

They literally said there is zero additional force on the action. What is force measured in? Units of pressure. Why are you just arguing for no reason? That does not make MORE people want to do business with you...

 

[AkMtnRunner]

Right doesn't the steel case handle the extra pressure, not the action?

If that were true, that would mean all extra force is going to extra bolt thrust. It's got to go somewhere outside of the case.


Regardless, I think a Tikka is not ideal for the 7 BC because of limited head height. Maybe Proof doesn't know it yet, but bullets are getting longer these days. Unless they really expect people to only use traditional 7 rem mag bullets, a Tikka and the 7 BC is not a good match up.

 

[WCB]

It's too bad the proof offering is 20" - I thought the allure of 7bc was 20" performance in 16"?

24" performance in a 20"...although even around 18" people are getting around 24" performance from those that have tested it. (This is compared to the 7 PRC and factory loads).

Other manufacturers have said they either need to investigate or design a new action, perhaps just being conservative but something running 20+% higher pressure than prior cartridges I wouldn’t want to go with a hunch.

What manufacturers said they needed to design a "new action"? None of the companies that released guns so far have had to. As far as "investigate" that is part of coming out with a new product and makes sense. And if the companies that have guns out now didn't have to redesign their actions...what does that say about a company that would have to?

 

[Sundodger]

According to Federal there isn't a change in bolt thrust (a force) due to the steel case "gripping" the walls better.

I'd like them to show their homework on that, but take that for what you want.

I am pretty excited on the prospect of higher pressure cartridges, BC or otherwise.

 

[Sundodger]

They literally said there is zero additional force on the action. What is force measured in? Units of pressure. Why are you just arguing for no reason? That does not make MORE people want to do business with you...

Pressure and force are related by the equation P = F/A, where P is pressure, F is force, and A is area. This means that if you know the force and area, you can calculate the pressure.

 

[9.3koolaid]

If that were true, that would mean all extra force is going to extra bolt thrust. It's got to go somewhere outside of the case.


Regardless, I think a Tikka is not ideal for the 7 BC because of limited head height. Maybe Proof doesn't know it yet, but bullets are getting longer these days. Unless they really expect people to only use traditional 7 rem mag bullets, a Tikka and the 7 BC is not a good match up.

Saami COAL is 3.34, you can get factory 195 loads.

 

[Marshfly]

Pressure and force are related by the equation P = F/A, where P is pressure, F is force, and A is area. This means that if you know the force and area, you can calculate the pressure.

exactly...

This fear mongering and ridiculous ignorant assumptions about this cartridge are hilarious.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

They literally said there is zero additional force on the action. What is force measured in? Units of pressure. Why are you just arguing for no reason? That does not make MORE people want to do business with you...

Force is measured in pounds (and other units) and force applied in a certain area gives you pounds per square inch (for example). I was merely saying the case is running at a higher pressure (which we know) and apparently proof said it didn't exert any additional force on the action. I was correcting the term you used nor arguing with what proof said.

I am not doing business with anyone so not really sure how that is relevant to having a discussion here.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

What manufacturers said they needed to design a "new action"? None of the companies that released guns so far have had to. As far as "investigate" that is part of coming out with a new product and makes sense. And if the companies that have guns out now didn't have to redesign their actions...what does that say about a company that would have to?

IIRC the shoot to hunt episode on it mentioned a certain manufacturer but maybe I am misremembering? The latter question could go in various directions but I am not gonna speculate. Hopefully they are firing proof pressure loads in all these new guns just to be certain.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

Force is not measured in pounds. That's weight. But yes. Pressure on the bolt face is most likely what Proof intended. Force makes little sense here. Pressure is the measure of how much force is acting upon an area. The area of the bolt face. But that is really getting into the weeds here.

Your username has your business in it. Your logo is right above that. You are a sponsor of the forum. That's why I found it relevant.

Moving on since we have now established there is no additional "whatever" on the bolt face.

Pounds of force is a customary imperial unit (newtons is typical for SI units). Proofs reply made sense as written, your reply said zero additional pressure and I intended to be helpful in trying to clearly discuss that the case does have additional pressure (internally) but according to proof there weren't additional external stresses (or forces) applied on the action.

I presume you're on mobile interface? If you're on desktop you'd see my signature "I am no longer sewing at this time." I was sewing as a side gig and haven't had time for it in a long while, I just haven't changed the user name/avatar. I have no business dealings going to be impacted by having a conversation here.

 

[wind gypsy]

What manufacturers said they needed to design a "new action"? None of the companies that released guns so far have had to. As far as "investigate" that is part of coming out with a new product and makes sense. And if the companies that have guns out now didn't have to redesign their actions...what does that say about a company that would have to?

In one of the Seekins new release vids about their new havak lineup they alluded to their new actions being built to withstand the new/future high pressure cases. I think a bunch of people extrapolated from that. My impression was more along the lines of being unsure if it’s just a marketing line or if there was any merit to it.

 

[JohnJohnson]

In one of the Seekins new release vids about their new havak lineup they alluded to their new actions being built to withstand the new/future high pressure cases. I think a bunch of people extrapolated from that. My impression was more along the lines of being unsure if it’s just a marketing line or if there was any merit to it.

Could that be because the Element (at least the previous version) was an aluminum action with a steel barrel adapter or whatever it was?

 

[DangerRanger]

This is cool, very interested in a 6.5 creed case now since it seems like nothing really needs to change

 

[MTMeatHunter]

This is cool, very interested in a 6.5 creed case now since it seems like nothing really needs to change

That’s probably the most interesting point I’ve read through all of this. A steel cased 6.5 Creedmoor, without changing anything other than the ammo you buy, zinging 143s at 80k. That will be awesome!

 

[Machingeaneer]

That’s probably the most interesting point I’ve read through all of this. A steel cased 6.5 Creedmoor, without changing anything other than the ammo you buy, zinging 143s at 80k. That will be awesome!

Hold on, wouldn't you still need to change the barrel as a std 6.5 creed chamber is rated to 65k?