Is speed king? Or weight...

[Vandy321]

Fellas, haven't shot a bow before this year since I was 15. Alot has changed.

Currently shooting 64# in my new bow. I have a short draw length at 27". I know the250fps range isnt exactly "speed" but its what I'm working with for now.

It seems a touchy subject maybe, but talking elk specifically...speed vs weight?

Current arrows are 442gr (100gr broadhead) at 255 fps.

Have gotten 2 different answers from 2 different pro shops.

I know that speed/weight will kill...but at that poundage and draw weight, is that ideal, or if it were you, would you shoot a lighter arrow faster? A heavy arrow slower? For ref, before i cut these arrows down, they were 490gr or so at 237 fps.

Cut on contact broadheads. Is speed or weight king?

 

[Gumbo]

A balance of the two IMO. I like a middle of the road setup and would stick with your 440 gr arrows if they shoot well for you.

 

[d3ntalbliss]

Opinions will vary greatly. IMO your set up is fine, but I personally wouldn't drop your weight to gain fps. I like both speed and weight, but you can't change your dl. The only thing you could do to increase speed without dropping weight is up your poundage.

My setup is currently 509 grains @ 283 fps if I remember correctly.

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[Vandy321]

I can shoot 70#, but I draw much smoother in a 60# bow torqued down...and I just seem to shoot this bow better at 64 than the same bow in 70#, go figure.

 

[wildwilderness]

I would say your set up will work great. My experience with elk has lead me to heavier arrows. (First elk killed with 390gr arrows, last one was with 505gr arrows )

However it’s also dependent on other factors as draw length and poundage as to what the ideal balance is. For you at 27” and 64# a 440 gr arrow is a good balance. The factor more important than either weight or speed is a perfectly tuned arrow flight!

 

[d3ntalbliss]

I can shoot 70#, but I draw much smoother in a 60# bow torqued down...and I just seem to shoot this bow better at 64 than the same bow in 70#, go figure.

Definitely stick with what you've got. I'm the end what matters is what you shoot best and putting that arrow where you want it.

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[rekkr870]

Never lighten up an arrow for hunting animals. You never know what you might hit...shoulder...rib...etc.

Try to get above 500gr. Load the weight up front and aim for FOC above 18%

If your arrow speed suffers, that's okay because your penetration and momentum will be good to go.

Single bevel or double bevel is fine. Make sure it's cut on contact.

Speed is good and it sells. There isn't a bow on this planet that is going to outrun the reaction time on some of these animals. Good luck.

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[amp713]

I shot 660 gr last year out if a 65 pound compound just for kicks and giggles. At 223 fps I dropped my elk like he was shot with a rifle..

My lightest weight arrows were around 490 and they blew through everything I shot. GRANTED I dont kill a ton of animals in a year and I never had a super bad shot into super thick bone but I'd say your set up should work for anything elk sized and under and you dont need to change it.

I for sure wouldn't shoot lighter arrows, the noise your bow makes will just get louder and you cant shoot faster than the speed of sound....

 

[Pigdog]

Depends on how good you are at judging yardage. If you can accurately judge distance I'd shoot the heaviest arrows you can get ahold of.

 

[Beendare]

Everybody's different when it comes to weighing all of the factors. The FACTS are that a heavier arrow will penetrate better...but it will also have more arc in trajectory- a Tradeoff.

In my experience; A 442gr arrow with a COC Bh will pass through any critter in NA in just about any compound over 60#.

So now the question is the other factors;

What are the max distances do you plan on shooting game? If its 40yds and under...the slightly bigger arc of a heavier arrow is not a big factor...especially if you stand hunt... use an RF.....or shoot 3D regularly.

How quiet is your bow with that arrow? A heavier arrow makes a bow whisper quiet...lessening the odds of string jumping. I strive for a ultra quiet bow...its one of my primary criteria.

Tuning; the heavier arrows are almost always easier to tune.

Long shots; These almost always benefit from a lighter arrow for better trajectory


....

 

[rekkr870]

Everybody's different when it comes to weighing all of the factors. The FACTS are that a heavier arrow will penetrate better...but it will also have more arc in trajectory- a Tradeoff.

In my experience; A 442gr arrow with a COC Bh will pass through any critter in NA in just about any compound over 60#.

So now the question is the other factors;

What are the max distances do you plan on shooting game? If its 40yds and under...the slightly bigger arc of a heavier arrow is not a big factor...especially if you stand hunt... use an RF.....or shoot 3D regularly.

How quiet is your bow with that arrow? A heavier arrow makes a bow whisper quiet...lessening the odds of string jumping. I strive for a ultra quiet bow...its one of my primary criteria.

Tuning; the heavier arrows are almost always easier to tune.

Long shots; These almost always benefit from a lighter arrow for better trajectory


....

Solid advice here.

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[Vandy321]

Everybody's different when it comes to weighing all of the factors. The FACTS are that a heavier arrow will penetrate better...but it will also have more arc in trajectory- a Tradeoff.

In my experience; A 442gr arrow with a COC Bh will pass through any critter in NA in just about any compound over 60#.

So now the question is the other factors;

What are the max distances do you plan on shooting game? If its 40yds and under...the slightly bigger arc of a heavier arrow is not a big factor...especially if you stand hunt... use an RF.....or shoot 3D regularly.

How quiet is your bow with that arrow? A heavier arrow makes a bow whisper quiet...lessening the odds of string jumping. I strive for a ultra quiet bow...its one of my primary criteria.

Tuning; the heavier arrows are almost always easier to tune.

Long shots; These almost always benefit from a lighter arrow for better trajectory


....

Capabilities aside, what's a ethical range to shoot with that that combo of weight and speed? I dont see myself shooting over 50-60 yards, but similar to rifle/bullet energy, is there a way to calculate that and a good number to shoot for?

 

[Beendare]

Capabilities aside, what's a ethical range to shoot with that that combo of weight and speed? I dont see myself shooting over 50-60 yards, but similar to rifle/bullet energy, is there a way to calculate that and a good number to shoot for?

Ethical? Oh man...what a can of worms that is.....grin

I can tell you its typically the Indian...and not the bow that determines your effective range.

The effectiveness of any arrow when paired with a COC head is increased. Just look at the last 400years of archery. [nopt knocking mech heads here, but those do benefit from having a heavy arrow behind them] Many folks shooting low energy setups- 40# stick bows, 50# compounds, etc- that get good performance with just about any arrow and a COC fixed head.

Worth factoring;

My good buddy Robert guided many big name pro shooters on a hog ranch in NorCal [some guys here no doubt] He had a target at 120yds in camp and many guys were crazy good at 100,120yds. An informal tally of 30+ shots at 80+ yards by these top shooters = exactly one animal killed. Big difference between target shooting and shooting at game.

Your effective range is much less in hunting conditions. Its great that you can stack arrows in an 80 yd target under perfect conditions....
......THAT^ doesn't tell you much about your effective range. Put all of your hunt gear on and shoot a 3D range from your knees....this will give you a better idea of your "Ethical" shot distances, IMO

As always...your mileage may vary.


...

 

[IdahoMtnWalker]

Well, coming from a trad angle, shoot as heavy an arrow as you can get to fly well. Like others said, know the yardage and use that cut on impact head, no issues at all. My set up is 715 grains counting 275 up front, shooting 59 lbs at 29", generally shoot through anything and quiet too!

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[wapitibob]

Your current setup will work just fine. Learn where to hit them then spend time learning how to get close enough to put it there.

 

[Spiral Horn]

As a very wise and experienced archer once told me - don’t overthink it. Your setup will work just fine.

- 440gr arrow @ 255fps with COC head is completely adequate momentum and should be absolutely lethal on anything but thick-skinned game out to reasonable hunting ranges (50-60 yards as stated).

- wouldn’t recommend shooting at game animals much further than that with any setup = beyond elevation concerns, with this setup @ 64lbs - momentum will be dropping quickly beyond 50-60yards.

- most important factor is a well-tuned setup = in addition to consistent point of impact a straight flying arrow penetrates deeper than one that is porpoising or fishtailing.

Tune it well and the Elk will be impressed with it.

 

[Bill V]

Your arrow weight is fine. I wouldn't reduce it to add speed. Higher mass gives you more retained momentum and more penetration. Choose a sharp, durable, cut on contact broadhead to reduce the force it takes to penetrate and you'll be fine.

 

[boom]

i am putting all my cards with Accuracy.

my arrow is 430 at 255 fps. it is what it is.

 

[BackcountryBloodline]

My concern with long range archery shots has very little to do with kinetic energy or personal accuracy, at 60 yards shooting even a relatively light arrow the impact is far from instant...when your adrenaline is going and time slows down you can really see how much an animal can move between the shot breaking and impact even at 30-40 yards with a 400gr arrow. I've actually thought I missed before at 30 yards because it felt like I was waiting so long for the impact, that was only a fraction of a second but at 100 yards shooting 300fps it's a full second between the shot breaking and impact...a bull taking a step as the shot breaks can change the location of that one piece of fur you were aiming at pretty significantly at 60 yards even if you hit exactly where you were aiming and that hang time increases more and more the heavier your arrow gets. I like a heavier arrow for sure but they definitely aren't meant for long range (yes, I'm aware that people kill at long range with ashby arrows every year.) I like the idea of shooting an unmarked 3D with all your gear on (including loaded pack) but to really simulate it you need a buddy downrange with a rope randomly yanking the target a few steps here and there if they hold up at 50, get behind a tree, unscrew your nalgene and pour it out from chest height. Good chance you'll bring them in to spitting distance if you play it right.

 

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While I prefer heavy over fast your setup will kill any bull that walks with a good head and good shot placement.