Idaho Bonus point system

[WRO]

I don't want a point system in Idaho and no one is going to change my opinion. That's as nice as I can put it.

Noted, just playing devils advocate.

 

[blacktail434]

No, I don't need a participation trophy for not drawing.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Noted, just playing devils advocate.

This topic really fires me up, I start using adult language and then I have to deal with the mods.

 

[WRO]

This topic really fires me up, I start using adult language and then I have to deal with the mods.

I love single syllable 4 letter words.

 

[idelkslayer]

Bonus point or a split system reward those that wait yet still offer new hunters a chance to draw.

On the counter point, what about the guy who applies for 15 years for 54 rifle and never draws randomly? I like to plan my hunts and scout, not just guess when I’ll draw and be way behind the 8 ball when results come out.

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Long time applicants still have an advantage in terms of probability of drawing a tag over time in a random system. The more you apply the more likely you are to draw. The probability of being successful one time over the course of multiple trials is given by this formula:

1-(1-P)^n

Where n is the number of trials and P is odds of drawing. So for example if there is a hunt that typically has 20% odds of drawing a tag and you applied for 5 years. The probability that you would draw the tag at least once is = 1- (1-0.2)^5; That calculates out to 67%. If you apply for 10 years it comes out to 89%.

So while your odds of drawing in any single year are the same as everyone else, your probability of drawing over time slowly approaches but will never reach 100%. Think about it terms of dice rolls. The odds of rolling a 6 on any given attempt are always 1/6 or ~16.7%. However, if you roll the dice multiple times you will eventually roll a six. Yes each dice roll is independent of each other just like each year of applying for a tag is independent of previous years but if you apply 10 times you are more likely to draw than someone who only applies once.

Let's take your scenario of unit 54. Last year it had 9% drawing odds. The probability that the hunter would draw the tag at least once over the course of 15 years is 75.5%. In a pure preference point system it could take him 11 years to draw. In a 50/50 split preference/random system it could take 22 years. In a pure bonus point system it could take just as long or longer than a random system. I fail to see the advantage in all but a pure preference system and that would require a severe handicap on all future generations of applicants.

 

[WeiserBucks]

I love single syllable 4 letter words.

Same here, we should have a beer and quit arguing about points

 

[CorbLand]

I will die on this hill. No points system!

Not alone.

Screw points systems and the white horse they rode in on.

 

[IdahoBeav]

No on a points system, but I'd like longer wait periods after successful draws for deer/elk/pronghorn and a select few changed to OIL. There is currently a species-based 1 year wait following a successful draw. I think it could at least be bumped to 3 years.

 

[deadwolf]

The point systems only favor those who get in on the ground floor. Everyone else will be playing catchup for the rest of their life. 100% random draw odds is the only way to go, and I do like that Idaho makes you prioritize what species you want to hunt. Wish they would do the same for Alaska.


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[Steve O]

I’m heavily invested in all the point systems. No need for no. Leave Idaho alone, it is a breath of fresh air.

Fix the messed up non resident deer and elk “otc” license system that gets cheated up by outfitters and all is well there.

 

[Randle]

No point system . Just limit the number of tags 1 person can buy and it should help a ton.

 

[Hunthigh1]

HARD NO!

 

[WRO]

Same here, we should have a beer and quit arguing about points

I’m down..


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[WRO]

The point systems only favor those who get in on the ground floor. Everyone else will be playing catchup for the rest of their life. 100% random draw odds is the only way to go, and I do like that Idaho makes you prioritize what species you want to hunt. Wish they would do the same for Alaska.


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That’s not true unless you’re chasing unobtainable small cap tags, it’s very predictable in low to medium demand hunts.

 

[mtnwrunner]

A big cup of nope.

Randy

 

[Wprinkle]

F a point system!! I have been putting for a particular unit in that one state we all have, for 20 years and I am pretty much no closer to drawing it than I was when I started.. NM is random and I drew the Valle Vidal first try.

 

[Andrew12gauge]

They wouldn’t most likely have drawn either with random system either.

Almost every state has a random component, the issue isn’t the point system its limited supply of high demand opportunities.

One of they guys I bird hunt with has 25 years of applying for antelope with no tags in Idaho, he has the same worse odds next year.

A point system won’t make your buddy any more likely to draw an antelope tag. The issue isn’t points it’s the reality that there are very few tags and lots of applicants. There isn’t a rifle tag in the state that I’m aware of with better than 4% odds of drawing. If your buddy wants an antelope tag he should push IDFG to move antelope into the trophy species draws, I bet they would be near 50% odds every year or better if you had to choose between antelope or deer and elk


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[CasNed]

Bonus point or a split system reward those that wait yet still offer new hunters a chance to draw.

There is more to it than just that. A comparison from Colorado deer to Idaho deer, comparing two highly desired units, I see your point. A comparison from Colorado Moose to Idaho moose, I disagree. How Idaho’s draw works for sheep, moose and goat is arguably the best in the lower 48. Then compare to big three in Montana, which is joke, everyone can buy a point for each species every year then apply for each species every year, so the state collects a lot of money and the draw odds are horrible. It’s unfortunate but with the amount of interest in hunting these days and individuals applying in most states year in the west, the good ole days of being able to buy your bonus points for 5-15 years and then hunt the best unit in the country is behind us.

Personally, I wanna see every state kick non residents out of controlled hunt draws (especially moose, sheep, goat). Limit them to general hunts only for deer and elk. Next I wanna see every state to limit residents to only selecting one species yearly for controlled tags. Residents in all states would see much much better draw odds.

Idaho shorts you on your scouting time because the draws so late.

I agree here. Also, they should have the regulations posted before the non resident draw.

 

[Hunthigh1]

11 years ago idfg did a video series analyzing this. It was considered by IDFG multiple times. The ship has sailed in enough other states that the majority of sportsmen finally understand what a horrible idea it is. In 2006 and 2009 it didn’t have enough support to be passed. It certainly won’t get the support now that many see the disaster of draw systems elsewhere.

What will your sons and daughters do when they start hunting a state that has max points over 40? Over 60? Not good for current hunters. Horrid for new hunters arriving to a long established system.

 

[WRO]

There is more to it than just that. A comparison from Colorado deer to Idaho deer, comparing two highly desired units, I see your point. A comparison from Colorado Moose to Idaho moose, I disagree. How Idaho’s draw works for sheep, moose and goat is arguably the best in the lower 48. Then compare to big three in Montana, which is joke, everyone can buy a point for each species every year then apply for each species every year, so the state collects a lot of money and the draw odds are horrible. It’s unfortunate but with the amount of interest in hunting these days and individuals applying in most states year in the west, the good ole days of being able to buy your bonus points for 5-15 years and then hunt the best unit in the country is behind us.

Idaho’s OIL program is awesome.